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Ohio Football Topic
Topic: Hazing probe hits the 110
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KyleWvr13
10/24/2019 5:09 PM
Last Edited: 10/24/2019 11:43:04 PM by KyleWvr13
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PhiTau74
10/24/2019 5:42 PM
My fraternity Phi Kappa Tau was the first fraternity to be reinstated, happened a couple days ago. Good luck ever getting a penny from any former Bobcats that were in any fraternities or sororities. It is shameful how my fraternity was convicted without a trial or any accusations.
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SBH
10/25/2019 7:34 AM
You weren't convicted. You were suspended out of an abundance of caution due to the death of a student. You couldn't have parties for a couple of weeks. By all means let that forever change your relationship with your alma mater. Grow up.
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shabamon
10/25/2019 7:45 AM
SBH wrote:expand_more
You weren't convicted. You were suspended out of an abundance of caution due to the death of a student. You couldn't have parties for a couple of weeks. By all means let that forever change your relationship with your alma mater. Grow up.
Co-sign
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Robert Fox
10/25/2019 8:35 AM
Counter sign
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Bobcat110
10/25/2019 8:49 PM
I have two daughters in the band. After reading the allegations, I 100% think this administration owes the band an apology for the crap they put them through. My daughters have never felt one bit of hazing or being forced to do anything they didn't want to. The directors have done everything within their power to ensure every student is treated respectfully. The upperclassmen ensure that every underclassman has an escort to walk them to and from their dorms when attending a band function after dark.

Meanwhile, the administration decides to throw them under the bus by putting them on suspension the Thursday of homecoming. They announced the suspension prior to the Thursday band practice and then AFTER that practice the band performed 110% for the administration and their host of VIPs in town for homecoming. Imagine that....the administration tells you that your organization is being shutdown because we think you doing disgraceful things, but we still want you to entertain us. Then for the last two weeks, band students have had to suffer being verbally assaulted by non-band students because of these allegations.

As for the allegations, they're stupid hearsay of hearsay. One allegation was that someone heard from an exgirlfriend who's boyfriend was in the band in 2014 that he "got beat up" in his band jacket during the conditioning. First, 5 years ago? Really? No one in the current band was here? And 3rd hand? I can almost 100% guarantee no band member beat up another band member and if such thing happened fully endorse that person being kicked out of the organization. The band jacket is sacred to band members. Parents and freshmen are explained the tradition. If you are in the band, you are an equal. You are as important as the person marching next to you or the person that marched your spot 50 years ago. No one stands out. They do not have drum majors, they have a field commander who wears the exact same uniform. They do not have soloist or flag corp or baton twirlers. No one stands out. This is not some big secret ritual. Look at the band when they're on the field. You cannot separate them. I cannot find my own daughters unless I know where they will be.

To make everyone feel equal, the band jackets are OPTIONALLY worn in to make them look "old"just like everyone else. The tradition means you can't tell a 50 year old jacket from a freshman jacket. Everyone is equal. You as a freshman are as important as any active or alumni before you. As for the cigarette burns or holes on band jackets, there is a state of Ohio on the breast of the jacket. If you are from Ohio, the burn hole represents your hometown. It's a source of pride to show where your OTHER home is. Look at the jacket. Athens is marked by a star. Who else is from Central Ohio? Who's from NE Ohio? Who's from Cleveland? It's a conversation starter if you've never met that individual before. No one is forced to do any of this. They are told over and over they don't have to do this, but they want to do this. No one is being branded.

Now think about that when some random person who knows a girlfriend who's boyfriend was in the band e-mails Jenny Hall Jones and says "They're burning holes in their expensive uniforms" and ask yourself.....does this sound like someone who knows what they are talking about?
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colobobcat66
10/25/2019 8:58 PM
Bobcat110 wrote:expand_more
I have two daughters in the band. After reading the allegations, I 100% think this administration owes the band an apology for the crap they put them through. My daughters have never felt one bit of hazing or being forced to do anything they didn't want to. The directors have done everything within their power to ensure every student is treated respectfully. The upperclassmen ensure that every underclassman has an escort to walk them to and from their dorms when attending a band function after dark.

Meanwhile, the administration decides to throw them under the bus by putting them on suspension the Thursday of homecoming. They announced the suspension prior to the Thursday band practice and then AFTER that practice the band performed 110% for the administration and their host of VIPs in town for homecoming. Imagine that....the administration tells you that your organization is being shutdown because we think you doing disgraceful things, but we still want you to entertain us. Then for the last two weeks, band students have had to suffer being verbally assaulted by non-band students because of these allegations.

As for the allegations, they're stupid hearsay of hearsay. One allegation was that someone heard from an exgirlfriend who's boyfriend was in the band in 2014 that he "got beat up" in his band jacket during the conditioning. First, 5 years ago? Really? No one in the current band was here? And 3rd hand? I can almost 100% guarantee no band member beat up another band member and if such thing happened fully endorse that person being kicked out of the organization. The band jacket is sacred to band members. Parents and freshmen are explained the tradition. If you are in the band, you are an equal. You are as important as the person marching next to you or the person that marched your spot 50 years ago. No one stands out. They do not have drum majors, they have a field commander who wears the exact same uniform. They do not have soloist or flag corp or baton twirlers. No one stands out. This is not some big secret ritual. Look at the band when they're on the field. You cannot separate them. I cannot find my own daughters unless I know where they will be.

To make everyone feel equal, the band jackets are OPTIONALLY worn in to make them look "old"just like everyone else. The tradition means you can't tell a 50 year old jacket from a freshman jacket. Everyone is equal. You as a freshman are as important as any active or alumni before you. As for the cigarette burns or holes on band jackets, there is a state of Ohio on the breast of the jacket. If you are from Ohio, the burn hole represents your hometown. It's a source of pride to show where your OTHER home is. Look at the jacket. Athens is marked by a star. Who else is from Central Ohio? Who's from NE Ohio? Who's from Cleveland? It's a conversation starter if you've never met that individual before. No one is forced to do any of this. They are told over and over they don't have to do this, but they want to do this. No one is being branded.

Now think about that when some random person who knows a girlfriend who's boyfriend was in the band e-mails Jenny Hall Jones and says "They're burning holes in their expensive uniforms" and ask yourself.....does this sound like someone who knows what they are talking about?
Don’t know about the 110, but I fear we’re in an period of guilty until proved innocent.
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The Optimist
10/25/2019 9:49 PM
The administration doesn’t care about what’s best for the students.

They care about not getting sued and saving their own jobs.

Jenny Hall-Jones should resign.
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OhioCatFan
10/26/2019 12:49 AM
colobobcat66 wrote:expand_more
I have two daughters in the band. After reading the allegations, I 100% think this administration owes the band an apology for the crap they put them through. My daughters have never felt one bit of hazing or being forced to do anything they didn't want to. The directors have done everything within their power to ensure every student is treated respectfully. The upperclassmen ensure that every underclassman has an escort to walk them to and from their dorms when attending a band function after dark.

Meanwhile, the administration decides to throw them under the bus by putting them on suspension the Thursday of homecoming. They announced the suspension prior to the Thursday band practice and then AFTER that practice the band performed 110% for the administration and their host of VIPs in town for homecoming. Imagine that....the administration tells you that your organization is being shutdown because we think you doing disgraceful things, but we still want you to entertain us. Then for the last two weeks, band students have had to suffer being verbally assaulted by non-band students because of these allegations.

As for the allegations, they're stupid hearsay of hearsay. One allegation was that someone heard from an exgirlfriend who's boyfriend was in the band in 2014 that he "got beat up" in his band jacket during the conditioning. First, 5 years ago? Really? No one in the current band was here? And 3rd hand? I can almost 100% guarantee no band member beat up another band member and if such thing happened fully endorse that person being kicked out of the organization. The band jacket is sacred to band members. Parents and freshmen are explained the tradition. If you are in the band, you are an equal. You are as important as the person marching next to you or the person that marched your spot 50 years ago. No one stands out. They do not have drum majors, they have a field commander who wears the exact same uniform. They do not have soloist or flag corp or baton twirlers. No one stands out. This is not some big secret ritual. Look at the band when they're on the field. You cannot separate them. I cannot find my own daughters unless I know where they will be.

To make everyone feel equal, the band jackets are OPTIONALLY worn in to make them look "old"just like everyone else. The tradition means you can't tell a 50 year old jacket from a freshman jacket. Everyone is equal. You as a freshman are as important as any active or alumni before you. As for the cigarette burns or holes on band jackets, there is a state of Ohio on the breast of the jacket. If you are from Ohio, the burn hole represents your hometown. It's a source of pride to show where your OTHER home is. Look at the jacket. Athens is marked by a star. Who else is from Central Ohio? Who's from NE Ohio? Who's from Cleveland? It's a conversation starter if you've never met that individual before. No one is forced to do any of this. They are told over and over they don't have to do this, but they want to do this. No one is being branded.

Now think about that when some random person who knows a girlfriend who's boyfriend was in the band e-mails Jenny Hall Jones and says "They're burning holes in their expensive uniforms" and ask yourself.....does this sound like someone who knows what they are talking about?
Don’t know about the 110, but I fear we’re in an period of guilty until proved innocent.
This is happening in all levels in our society, not just on college campuses, though it's rampant there. It must stopped before we become a banana republic or worse. Colorado is speaking the truth, unfortunately, as are some others on this board. The presumption of innocence is a bedrock of our society; whenever it's violated, for whatever reason, we are treading on very thin ice as a society. One can cite a number of examples of the breach of this principle during our history, but what's almost unique now is that we have educated people advocating from lofty places that it should be abandoned. I'm not sure this has happened since the advent of the so-called Redeemer governments in the South after Reconstruction crumbled. We are living in scary times.
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BillyTheCat
10/26/2019 9:44 PM
Bobcat110 wrote:expand_more
I have two daughters in the band. After reading the allegations, I 100% think this administration owes the band an apology for the crap they put them through. My daughters have never felt one bit of hazing or being forced to do anything they didn't want to. The directors have done everything within their power to ensure every student is treated respectfully. The upperclassmen ensure that every underclassman has an escort to walk them to and from their dorms when attending a band function after dark.

Meanwhile, the administration decides to throw them under the bus by putting them on suspension the Thursday of homecoming. They announced the suspension prior to the Thursday band practice and then AFTER that practice the band performed 110% for the administration and their host of VIPs in town for homecoming. Imagine that....the administration tells you that your organization is being shutdown because we think you doing disgraceful things, but we still want you to entertain us. Then for the last two weeks, band students have had to suffer being verbally assaulted by non-band students because of these allegations.

As for the allegations, they're stupid hearsay of hearsay. One allegation was that someone heard from an exgirlfriend who's boyfriend was in the band in 2014 that he "got beat up" in his band jacket during the conditioning. First, 5 years ago? Really? No one in the current band was here? And 3rd hand? I can almost 100% guarantee no band member beat up another band member and if such thing happened fully endorse that person being kicked out of the organization. The band jacket is sacred to band members. Parents and freshmen are explained the tradition. If you are in the band, you are an equal. You are as important as the person marching next to you or the person that marched your spot 50 years ago. No one stands out. They do not have drum majors, they have a field commander who wears the exact same uniform. They do not have soloist or flag corp or baton twirlers. No one stands out. This is not some big secret ritual. Look at the band when they're on the field. You cannot separate them. I cannot find my own daughters unless I know where they will be.

To make everyone feel equal, the band jackets are OPTIONALLY worn in to make them look "old"just like everyone else. The tradition means you can't tell a 50 year old jacket from a freshman jacket. Everyone is equal. You as a freshman are as important as any active or alumni before you. As for the cigarette burns or holes on band jackets, there is a state of Ohio on the breast of the jacket. If you are from Ohio, the burn hole represents your hometown. It's a source of pride to show where your OTHER home is. Look at the jacket. Athens is marked by a star. Who else is from Central Ohio? Who's from NE Ohio? Who's from Cleveland? It's a conversation starter if you've never met that individual before. No one is forced to do any of this. They are told over and over they don't have to do this, but they want to do this. No one is being branded.

Now think about that when some random person who knows a girlfriend who's boyfriend was in the band e-mails Jenny Hall Jones and says "They're burning holes in their expensive uniforms" and ask yourself.....does this sound like someone who knows what they are talking about?
No WAY, because in 2004 some clown witnessed this certain act by one group and was convinced that all groups are worthy of being banned. Yes there are a couple serious accusations in this entire mess, but the administration has been involved in a with h hunt from day 1, with little to no proof in most of these allegations. Sad, this is what OHIO has become.
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shabamon
10/26/2019 10:10 PM
The Optimist wrote:expand_more
The administration doesn’t care about what’s best for the students.

They care about not getting sued and saving their own jobs.

Jenny Hall-Jones should resign.
I mean, not getting sued is pretty important. I would like there to continue to be an Ohio University.

Lot of people are up in arms about the group suspensions, but if you're a student in a group that was suspended for a minor infraction or no infraction at all, what's the worst case scenario for you as a result? What is the measurable ramification for you or your group as a result of the suspension?
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BillyTheCat
10/27/2019 4:25 AM
shabamon wrote:expand_more
The administration doesn’t care about what’s best for the students.

They care about not getting sued and saving their own jobs.

Jenny Hall-Jones should resign.
I mean, not getting sued is pretty important. I would like there to continue to be an Ohio University.

Lot of people are up in arms about the group suspensions, but if you're a student in a group that was suspended for a minor infraction or no infraction at all, what's the worst case scenario for you as a result? What is the measurable ramification for you or your group as a result of the suspension?
The Universty is sued all the time, and in a lot of cases it’s because of silly decisions that they have made.
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Bobcat110
10/27/2019 11:19 AM
shabamon wrote:expand_more
Lot of people are up in arms about the group suspensions, but if you're a student in a group that was suspended for a minor infraction or no infraction at all, what's the worst case scenario for you as a result? What is the measurable ramification for you or your group as a result of the suspension?
The suspension means that band members are not to associate with other band members outside of sanctioned band practices or performances. Up until Friday, they were not permitted to use group chats on social media. Basically, the students are being isolated by the university and expected to walk campus and eat by themselves or with one other person from band. Considering the time commitment to band, most of these students’ only friends are other band members. Add in some verbal harassment from non-band students, it’s way more demeaning, insulting and demoralizing than anything they were accused of doing. It simply could have been handled more professionally.
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rpbobcat
10/27/2019 1:34 PM
Had a 110 question.

Tried to pm you but it wouldn't go through.

If you get a chance pm me.
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MonroeClassmate
10/27/2019 1:48 PM
shabamon wrote:expand_more
The administration doesn’t care about what’s best for the students.

They care about not getting sued and saving their own jobs.

Jenny Hall-Jones should resign.
I mean, not getting sued is pretty important. I would like there to continue to be an Ohio University.

Lot of people are up in arms about the group suspensions, but if you're a student in a group that was suspended for a minor infraction or no infraction at all, what's the worst case scenario for you as a result? What is the measurable ramification for you or your group as a result of the suspension?
For the fraternities that were temporarily suspended there are a number of consequences that we may never know about.

The parent tells the potential pledge--ALL fraternities very bad OHIO and ALL are into hazing, my money will not go to support. But Mom, the frat I wanted was the first to be reinstated. I said no.

The young man in the fraternity meets a young lady and asks her out to Baker for a hot chocolate and danish. She agrees, they meet, talk, the conversation goes to the fraternity and she drops him like a hot potato not wanting to be associated with a guy who does that to others or allowed it to be done to himself--you know, like getting up early to text the weather.
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FanInTheStands
10/27/2019 3:40 PM
The Post had this update on the hazing allegations:
https://www.thepostathens.com/article/2019/10/ohio-univer...
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Pataskala
10/27/2019 4:05 PM
shabamon wrote:expand_more
The administration doesn’t care about what’s best for the students.

They care about not getting sued and saving their own jobs.

Jenny Hall-Jones should resign.
I mean, not getting sued is pretty important. I would like there to continue to be an Ohio University.

Lot of people are up in arms about the group suspensions, but if you're a student in a group that was suspended for a minor infraction or no infraction at all, what's the worst case scenario for you as a result? What is the measurable ramification for you or your group as a result of the suspension?
Doing nothing is a good way to get sued, as Akron found out after Groce did nothing when one player was assaulted by another: https://www.cleveland.com/metro/2019/10/ex-university-of-...

The strange part is that it was Groce's inaction that got the school sued but the magistrate dismissed the claim against him, not the school.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
10/27/2019 5:29 PM
OhioCatFan wrote:expand_more
This is happening in all levels in our society, not just on college campuses, though it's rampant there. It must stopped before we become a banana republic or worse. Colorado is speaking the truth, unfortunately, as are some others on this board. The presumption of innocence is a bedrock of our society; whenever it's violated, for whatever reason, we are treading on very thin ice as a society. One can cite a number of examples of the breach of this principle during our history, but what's almost unique now is that we have educated people advocating from lofty places that it should be abandoned. I'm not sure this has happened since the advent of the so-called Redeemer governments in the South after Reconstruction crumbled. We are living in scary times.
I'm curious where else in society you see this so rampant?

I don't disagree, for what it's worth. I just am curious where you see the issue and what has you so concerned that we're falling into banana republic territory.
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BillyTheCat
10/27/2019 7:55 PM
Pataskala wrote:expand_more
The administration doesn’t care about what’s best for the students.

They care about not getting sued and saving their own jobs.

Jenny Hall-Jones should resign.
I mean, not getting sued is pretty important. I would like there to continue to be an Ohio University.

Lot of people are up in arms about the group suspensions, but if you're a student in a group that was suspended for a minor infraction or no infraction at all, what's the worst case scenario for you as a result? What is the measurable ramification for you or your group as a result of the suspension?
Doing nothing is a good way to get sued, as Akron found out after Groce did nothing when one player was assaulted by another: https://www.cleveland.com/metro/2019/10/ex-university-of-...

The strange part is that it was Groce's inaction that got the school sued but the magistrate dismissed the claim against him, not the school.
Universities get sued all the time. Will you win is another question.
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colobobcat66
10/27/2019 8:53 PM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
The administration doesn’t care about what’s best for the students.

They care about not getting sued and saving their own jobs.

Jenny Hall-Jones should resign.
I mean, not getting sued is pretty important. I would like there to continue to be an Ohio University.

Lot of people are up in arms about the group suspensions, but if you're a student in a group that was suspended for a minor infraction or no infraction at all, what's the worst case scenario for you as a result? What is the measurable ramification for you or your group as a result of the suspension?
The Universty is sued all the time, and in a lot of cases it’s because of silly decisions that they have made.
And a lot of the time it is because there are 1 million plus lawyers going after the money. I can tell you most companies are willing to settle rather than have prolonged trials even if they’re innocent. We all know that don’t we?
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
10/28/2019 11:23 AM
colobobcat66 wrote:expand_more
The administration doesn’t care about what’s best for the students.

They care about not getting sued and saving their own jobs.

Jenny Hall-Jones should resign.
I mean, not getting sued is pretty important. I would like there to continue to be an Ohio University.

Lot of people are up in arms about the group suspensions, but if you're a student in a group that was suspended for a minor infraction or no infraction at all, what's the worst case scenario for you as a result? What is the measurable ramification for you or your group as a result of the suspension?
The Universty is sued all the time, and in a lot of cases it’s because of silly decisions that they have made.
And a lot of the time it is because there are 1 million plus lawyers going after the money. I can tell you most companies are willing to settle rather than have prolonged trials even if they’re innocent. We all know that don’t we?
This is correct. But that doesn't mean those companies don't also take proactive measures to reduce the likelihood of said lawsuits.
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colobobcat66
10/28/2019 11:43 AM
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:expand_more
The administration doesn’t care about what’s best for the students.

They care about not getting sued and saving their own jobs.

Jenny Hall-Jones should resign.
I mean, not getting sued is pretty important. I would like there to continue to be an Ohio University.

Lot of people are up in arms about the group suspensions, but if you're a student in a group that was suspended for a minor infraction or no infraction at all, what's the worst case scenario for you as a result? What is the measurable ramification for you or your group as a result of the suspension?
The Universty is sued all the time, and in a lot of cases it’s because of silly decisions that they have made.
And a lot of the time it is because there are 1 million plus lawyers going after the money. I can tell you most companies are willing to settle rather than have prolonged trials even if they’re innocent. We all know that don’t we?
This is correct. But that doesn't mean those companies don't also take proactive measures to reduce the likelihood of said lawsuits.
+1000%
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person
BillyTheCat
10/28/2019 12:25 PM
colobobcat66 wrote:expand_more
The administration doesn’t care about what’s best for the students.

They care about not getting sued and saving their own jobs.

Jenny Hall-Jones should resign.
I mean, not getting sued is pretty important. I would like there to continue to be an Ohio University.

Lot of people are up in arms about the group suspensions, but if you're a student in a group that was suspended for a minor infraction or no infraction at all, what's the worst case scenario for you as a result? What is the measurable ramification for you or your group as a result of the suspension?
The Universty is sued all the time, and in a lot of cases it’s because of silly decisions that they have made.
And a lot of the time it is because there are 1 million plus lawyers going after the money. I can tell you most companies are willing to settle rather than have prolonged trials even if they’re innocent. We all know that don’t we?
University is not an easy target, they rarely settle.
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rpbobcat
10/28/2019 12:31 PM
colobobcat66 wrote:expand_more
And a lot of the time it is because there are 1 million plus lawyers going after the money. I can tell you most companies are willing to settle rather than have prolonged trials even if they’re innocent. We all know that don’t we?
When I first started working for my family's engineering company I had a really hard time accepting "business decisions" when it came to litigation.

Our Liability Insurance Companies work out the cost of a settlement,versus a trial.
Even if we are 100% right,they base their decision only on economics.
Of course they never talk about settlement,until they use up our deductible.

Under our policy, we do have the right to demand a trial.
But if we lose,we can be responsible for any damages.

As one lawyer told me "A fair settlement is better then a good trial".

Today its really bad,because juries not only don't understand technically complex cases,they don't want to make decisions.
They prefer to "split the difference".
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person
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
10/28/2019 12:40 PM
rpbobcat wrote:expand_more
And a lot of the time it is because there are 1 million plus lawyers going after the money. I can tell you most companies are willing to settle rather than have prolonged trials even if they’re innocent. We all know that don’t we?
When I first started working for my family's engineering company I had a really hard time accepting "business decisions" when it came to litigation.

Our Liability Insurance Companies work out the cost of a settlement,versus a trial.
Even if we are 100% right,they base their decision only on economics.
Of course they never talk about settlement,until they use up our deductible.

Under our policy, we do have the right to demand a trial.
But if we lose,we can be responsible for any damages.

As one lawyer told me "A fair settlement is better then a good trial".

Today its really bad,because juries not only don't understand technically complex cases,they don't want to make decisions.
They prefer to "split the difference".
I basically choose to settle 100% of the time because legal costs are almost always more expensive than the cost of making it go away. It's a shame, but not sure the solution.
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