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Topic: Syracuse and Pitt to ACC
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Andrew Ruck
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Posted: 9/19/2011 8:22 AM
Isn't it a more likely scenario that the Big East and/or Big 12 take some C-USA teams and C-USA looks to the MAC to replenish?  Thats what happenned when Miami, Va Tech & BC made the move to the ACC...The Big East picked up CIncy, Louisville, & USF...C-USA picked up Marshall & UCF.

Or I could see the leftovers of C-USA and Sun Belt merge for a conference and the MAC stays put as is.  Who knows?
Ohio69
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Posted: 9/19/2011 8:36 AM
Andrew Ruck wrote:expand_more
Isn't it a more likely scenario that the Big East and/or Big 12 take some C-USA teams and C-USA looks to the MAC to replenish?  Thats what happenned when Miami, Va Tech & BC made the move to the ACC...The Big East picked up CIncy, Louisville, & USF...C-USA picked up Marshall & UCF.

Or I could see the leftovers of C-USA and Sun Belt merge for a conference and the MAC stays put as is.  Who knows?


Agreed.
C Money
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Posted: 9/19/2011 9:40 AM
Andrew Ruck wrote:expand_more
Isn't it a more likely scenario that the Big East and/or Big 12 take some C-USA teams and C-USA looks to the MAC to replenish? 



If the offer is there, do we leave the MAC for CUSA?

I vote no.

EDITED: Correction. I vote HELL no. Saturday showed us what that jump could do for our program. But I had forgotten about Saturday, since Rutgers is what matters now.
Last Edited: 9/19/2011 9:49:07 AM by C Money
Bobcat Love
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Posted: 9/19/2011 1:10 PM
C Money wrote:expand_more
If the offer is there, do we leave the MAC for CUSA?


They ain't coming and we ain't going.
KyleWvr13
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Posted: 9/19/2011 1:35 PM
It's a BCS or bust for me.  And as much as i would like to think Ohio would be getting a BCS invite after all of this is set and done, I know that just won't be the case.

If C-USA somehow collapses and only teams geographically local to us (Marshall, ECU, Memphis, and UAB) are the ones left, then maybe jumping to C-USA would be best, but I'm fine with sticking with the MAC for the years to come.
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 9/19/2011 5:29 PM
KyleWvr13 wrote:expand_more
Penn State can cram over 100,000 fans in what is basically Middle-Of-Nowhere, Pennsylvania.  Why can't Ohio dream to do something like that 20 - 30 years down the road?


Because we don't have the resources or institutional committment. 

I don't see the MAC changing that much.  Our schools just aren't attractive to BCS conferences.  I agree that CUSA might raid the MAC for teams.  Or Temple might have a chance to get in a larger conference. 
anorris
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Posted: 9/20/2011 12:47 AM
Reports seem to be that C-USA is discussing the idea of merging/co-operating with a raided Mountain West if more of their teams get poached to a PAC-16 or Big ## scenario.  Because that makes sense.  Who wouldn't want a conference that extends from Orlando to Honolulu?
Andrew Ruck
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Posted: 9/20/2011 8:24 AM
I like things to make sense and be organized, so the geography of all this really bothers me. 
C Money
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Posted: 9/20/2011 9:26 AM
anorris wrote:expand_more
Reports seem to be that C-USA is discussing the idea of merging/co-operating with a raided Mountain West if more of their teams get poached to a PAC-16 or Big ## scenario.  Because that makes sense.  Who wouldn't want a conference that extends from Orlando to Honolulu?



I think the thought process is "a conference that stretches from Orlando to Honolulu is a national conference and #1 can force a seat at the BCS table and #2 can force a cable network on cable providers." We shall see. I think MAYBE it works if it's football only, but that is a big maybe.
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Posted: 9/20/2011 2:36 PM
This is the time that John Steinbrecher should be called on to make the MAC as strong as possible, make some difficult decisions and do some heavy leveraging.  Ohio isn't going anywhere, nor do I think it should.  The University doesn't have the money or the donors to pony up the cash to go to a "more prestigeous conference", and even if they did I don't think the State of Ohio would allow a move up in Conference.  So if I were on the Board of the MAC, I would be pushing our fellow Alumnus to do the following:
  • For God's sake, drop EMU!
  • Immediately put the screws to Temple or UMass (depending on whether or not the current FB only contract allows them to be leveraged) to come in for MBB at a minimum, or otherwise ask them to find a new home after the current contract expires.
  • Then, find the best regional fits to get the MAC to sixteen members and make it the best FB AND MBB mid major in the country.  I would be looking not to Conference USA members but instead to FCS schools that have relevance in hoops as well.
We need the MAC to fix its house and make it an aspirational place for other schools of our like, not look to move neighborhoods.
Last Edited: 9/20/2011 2:38:03 PM by D.A.
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 9/20/2011 3:02 PM
D.A., you have some interesting ideas there. 

In your scenario, would the MAC be:  FCS; FBS; or some new level that takes the best conferences of FCS and combines them with the MAC, WAC and Sun Belt?
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 9/20/2011 3:14 PM
D.A. wrote:expand_more
. . . and even if they did I don't think the State of Ohio would allow a move up in Conference. . . .

Not true.
Last Edited: 9/20/2011 3:15:47 PM by OhioCatFan
C Money
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Posted: 9/20/2011 3:26 PM
Jeff McKinney wrote:expand_more
D.A., you have some interesting ideas there. 

In your scenario, would the MAC be:  FCS; FBS; or some new level that takes the best conferences of FCS and combines them with the MAC, WAC and Sun Belt?


A friend sent me a quote today from James Madison's AD from a local paper (the article is behind a paywall, so no linky) suggesting that he sees several FCS teams (JMU, Appy State, and Delaware were those expressly mentioned) moving up to FBS to join a new conference--expressly including OHIO and Marshall (the friend is a Marshall fan...I was not too tough on him this week) in this new conference.

I replied with this hypothetical conference & division split:
North: Ohio, Miami, BG, Toledo, Temple, Marshall, Delaware
South: FIU, MTSU, UAB, So. Miss., Troy, JMU, Appy State
D.A.
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Posted: 9/20/2011 3:33 PM
Jeff McKinney wrote:expand_more
D.A., you have some interesting ideas there. 

In your scenario, would the MAC be:  FCS; FBS; or some new level that takes the best conferences of FCS and combines them with the MAC, WAC and Sun Belt?


Great question, and I wish I had a crystal ball.  Ideally the NCAA would allow us to remain FBS, but if the four conference, 16 team scenario plays out, and ND/BYU/Army/Navy are still indy, I have a hunch that the MAC and the remaining FBS teams will be realigned into an intermediate tier, formally segregated, non-FBS subdivision.

I believe that the megaconferences NEED the non-BCS FBS teams for non-conference play, lest they thin their ranks too much with injuries going into conference play, especially if they consider nine or ten game conference slates.

The biggest thing proping up the non-BCS competitive levels is the limit to 85 schollys.  If that remains in place through all of this, then I think we can retain our present status.  IF they bump that back up, then I think we are FCS bound along with many of the remaining non-BCS schools.

And I hope OCF is right about the State not stepping in our way IF we could find the money to move up, but it's a moot point.  We aren't going to find the money unless the Love wins a $300MM Powerball Jackpot. (although I think Mrs. BL might have some say in that investment)

Regardless of any of the scenarios above, I think Steinbrecher needs to focus on improving the MAC and making it a 16 team conference ASAP.
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 9/20/2011 3:36 PM
Some of the speculation about Ohio's conference affiliation is unrealistic blather...but I can honestly see something like this as a genuine possibility. 

But the question remains...if a new conference like this came about, would it be a part of the current FBS, FCS, or would there be a new division that would be basically in-between FBS and FCS?
D.A.
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Posted: 9/20/2011 3:42 PM
Jeff McKinney wrote:expand_more
Some of the speculation about Ohio's conference affiliation is unrealistic blather...but I can honestly see something like this as a genuine possibility. 

But the question remains...if a new conference like this came about, would it be a part of the current FBS, FCS, or would there be a new division that would be basically in-between FBS and FCS?


I think as long as there isn't Bowl contraction, there has to be an intermediate tier.  Although I think most here would rather see that group in a playoff.

Ideally, if there were a complete organization put to this chaos, there would be a system a la soccer where the top two to four teams in the intermediate tier would be awarded with a step up in conference affiliation, and the poor performers would get the boot to the intermediate tier, but that's just rainbows and moonbeams.
Athens
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Posted: 9/20/2011 3:47 PM
Jeff McKinney wrote:expand_more
Some of the speculation about Ohio's conference affiliation is unrealistic blather...but I can honestly see something like this as a genuine possibility. 

But the question remains...if a new conference like this came about, would it be a part of the current FBS, FCS, or would there be a new division that would be basically in-between FBS and FCS?


It would be FBS most definitely. Another 4 schools are moving from FCS to FBS over the next couple of seasons. There is no point in forming a third division in D1 ball. The playoff is in FCS. The bowls are in FBS. There is not any momentum for changing the system radically. 
Pete Chouteau
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Posted: 9/20/2011 3:51 PM
I would not be entirely surprised if the final super-conferences don't withdraw from the NCAA completely and become a de facto super-division without having to share anything with non-AQ, FCS, D-II or D-III.

Not to mention the flushing of an unwieldy and inconvenient rulebook.
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Posted: 9/20/2011 4:24 PM
Pete, I think you're on to something there. I find it amusing that NCAA Chief Mark Emmert is asking the University Presidents and AD's to consider what this conference poaching is having on the "well-being of the student athletes". What a (*&^%$ joke! This all-being, all-powerful ruling body can bust some young kid's _alls for accepting a hot dog and a coke from some booster and they are powerless to do anything as the esteemed Universities of Higher Learning Whore and Prostitute themselves out to the highest bidder.

The NCAA becomes more irrelevant and feckless by the minute as I think too that the final make-up of the Superconferences will quickly tell the NCAA to pound sand. There's a new sheriff in town and the old rules do not apply to them.
Last Edited: 9/20/2011 5:50:22 PM by Jeff McKinney
D.A.
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Posted: 9/20/2011 4:46 PM
Pete Chouteau wrote:expand_more
I would not be entirely surprised if the final super-conferences don't withdraw from the NCAA completely and become a de facto super-division without having to share anything with non-AQ, FCS, D-II or D-III.

Not to mention the flushing of an unwieldy and inconvenient rulebook.


I feel that is a possibility as well, but cannot get my thoughts around how a superconference controlled entity for FB autonomous from the NCAA meshes with March Madness, not to mention the other olympic sports that the NCAA governs.
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 9/20/2011 4:53 PM
Pete Chouteau wrote:expand_more
I would not be entirely surprised if the final super-conferences don't withdraw from the NCAA completely and become a de facto super-division without having to share anything with non-AQ, FCS, D-II or D-III.

Not to mention the flushing of an unwieldy and inconvenient rulebook.


How do you spell "Anti-Trust Congressional Action"?  Joe Bidden may not be in Congress any more, but he has friends who are.  Actually that's one thing I like about this new proposed conference.  Nobody is messing with the Blue Hens!

BTW, East Carolina is probably in this mix as well.

Edit: Without saying more than I've agreed not to say, let me just say that there are some within the Marshall administration who desperately want to get out of C-USA because of travel expenses and the flack they are getting from fans who have to travel half around the country to see many of the Herd games.  If this happens, though, the vocal minority lead by their cheerleader Chucky Landon will be raising cane and burning folks in effigy. 
Last Edited: 9/20/2011 5:00:01 PM by OhioCatFan
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 9/20/2011 5:04 PM
The OCF modified Mountain East scenario

North: Ohio, Miami, Toledo, Temple, Marshall, Delaware, JMU

South: FIU, MTSU, UAB, So. Miss., Troy,  Appy State, East Carolina
Last Edited: 9/20/2011 5:05:48 PM by OhioCatFan
Pete Chouteau
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Posted: 9/20/2011 5:06 PM
Forbes reported that the B1G received $82.9 million in March Madness revenue over the last 6 years, or $13.5 million per year. Or $1.2 million per school. This was the fourth highest conference revenue, but the highest average revenue per school.  www.forbes.com/sites/sportsmoney/2011/03/14/assessing-the-financials-for-big-ten-mens-basketball/

The Chicago Tribune reported that B1G television revenue is estimated at about $22 million per school. articles.chicagotribune.com/2010-05-13/sports/chi-100514-big-ten-expansion-greenstein_1_btn-big-ten-network-tv-executive

And at that point, given that the new College Sports League will easily replace the per capita share with the new, super-conference exclusive basketball championship, the NCAA Tournament means very little to the super conference members.
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 9/20/2011 5:09 PM
OhioCatFan wrote:expand_more
The OCF modified Mountain East scenario

North: Ohio, Miami, Toledo, Temple, Marshall, Delaware, JMU

South: FIU, MTSU, UAB, So. Miss., Troy,  Appy State, East Carolina


For my basketball friends:  Is this a two bid basketball conference?  Temple is a usual invite.  JMU has a Final Four appearance.  Looks like the South Division would be much weaker in hoops than the North Division. 

Edit: The NCAA means a lot to the NCAA university presidents and to the Congress of the USA that supported efforts of President Teddy Roosevelt to create the NCAA in order to save football from being outlawed as too dangerous a sport.
Last Edited: 9/20/2011 5:18:34 PM by OhioCatFan
C Money
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Posted: 9/20/2011 5:17 PM
OhioCatFan wrote:expand_more
The OCF modified Mountain East scenario

North: Ohio, Miami, Toledo, Temple, Marshall, Delaware, JMU

South: FIU, MTSU, UAB, So. Miss., Troy,  Appy State, East Carolina



Does Toledo join without BG? That was my thought in including them in my list. If so, I like this layout (assuming ECU doesn't go Big East).
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