Ohio Basketball Topic
Topic: R Johnson- injury
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Columbus_Bobcat
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Posted: 1/6/2014 2:15 PM
According to his Twitter account, Rico is getting surgery on Thursday. 
100%Cat
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Posted: 1/6/2014 3:03 PM
Feel sick for the guy.  I hope somehow a speedy recovery can get him back on the floor before the end of his senior season, but that will probably be a stretch.  Best wishes to Ric to get healthy again.  We're going to sorely miss his hustle and tenacity while he is out.
A-townBound
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Posted: 1/6/2014 3:03 PM
Bobcats_828 wrote:expand_more
According to his Twitter account, Rico is getting surgery on Thursday.
Per Arkley tweet - Christian on Johnson: "He's got two fractures in his leg. He's probably going to have surgery in the next week. We'll move from there."
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 1/7/2014 12:27 AM
Best of health to Ricardo.  BIg loss.  Hope he comes back healthy for whatever the rest of his life holds.
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Posted: 1/7/2014 12:36 PM
GoCatsGo wrote:expand_more
This story involving Coach Groce also makes you pull for the Illini.

http://illiniboard.com/2014/01/02/powerful/
It tells me we didn't offer Groce enough to keep him. I am happy with JC because he's a great coach. Groce might be a once in a generation leader for a program.
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 1/7/2014 1:24 PM
hawaiian bobcat wrote:expand_more
This story involving Coach Groce also makes you pull for the Illini.

http://illiniboard.com/2014/01/02/powerful/
It tells me we didn't offer Groce enough to keep him. I am happy with JC because he's a great coach. Groce might be a once in a generation leader for a program.
Come on, Hawaiian. You can't be serious. It's not that we didn't offer Groce enough to keep him. It's that we COULDNT offer Groce enough to keep him. I'm glad he continues to show an interest in our guys whom he recruited, but it's time to let go of this. Ohio is a stepping stone job. Groce stepped on this stone, did a great job here, and has moved on.
OUVan
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Posted: 1/7/2014 4:42 PM
Jeff McKinney wrote:expand_more
Come on, Hawaiian. You can't be serious. It's not that we didn't offer Groce enough to keep him. It's that we COULDNT offer Groce enough to keep him. I'm glad he continues to show an interest in our guys whom he recruited, but it's time to let go of this. Ohio is a stepping stone job. Groce stepped on this stone, did a great job here, and has moved on.


Nailed it. 
OU_Country
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Posted: 1/7/2014 4:42 PM
Jeff McKinney wrote:expand_more
This story involving Coach Groce also makes you pull for the Illini.

http://illiniboard.com/2014/01/02/powerful/


It tells me we didn't offer Groce enough to keep him. I am happy with JC because he's a great coach. Groce might be a once in a generation leader for a program.


Come on, Hawaiian. You can't be serious. It's not that we didn't offer Groce enough to keep him. It's that we COULDNT offer Groce enough to keep him. I'm glad he continues to show an interest in our guys whom he recruited, but it's time to let go of this. Ohio is a stepping stone job. Groce stepped on this stone, did a great job here, and has moved on.


As much as I wish he could have be coaxed into staying longer, I agree.  John was always going to leave Athens for a bigger program.  It was just a matter of when.  I take a lot of joy in watching his Illini teams do well. 
Columbus_Bobcat
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Posted: 1/7/2014 5:05 PM
OU_Country wrote:expand_more
This story involving Coach Groce also makes you pull for the Illini.

http://illiniboard.com/2014/01/02/powerful/


It tells me we didn't offer Groce enough to keep him. I am happy with JC because he's a great coach. Groce might be a once in a generation leader for a program.


Come on, Hawaiian. You can't be serious. It's not that we didn't offer Groce enough to keep him. It's that we COULDNT offer Groce enough to keep him. I'm glad he continues to show an interest in our guys whom he recruited, but it's time to let go of this. Ohio is a stepping stone job. Groce stepped on this stone, did a great job here, and has moved on.


As much as I wish he could have be coaxed into staying longer, I agree.  John was always going to leave Athens for a bigger program.  It was just a matter of when.  I take a lot of joy in watching his Illini teams do well. 

It was just a matter of time. We offered him what 400k? compared to Illinois's 1.1 Million?

 
Andrew Ruck
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Posted: 1/7/2014 5:22 PM
Jeff McKinney wrote:expand_more
It tells me we didn't offer Groce enough to keep him. I am happy with JC because he's a great coach. Groce might be a once in a generation leader for a program.


Come on, Hawaiian. You can't be serious. It's not that we didn't offer Groce enough to keep him. It's that we COULDNT offer Groce enough to keep him. I'm glad he continues to show an interest in our guys whom he recruited, but it's time to let go of this. Ohio is a stepping stone job. Groce stepped on this stone, did a great job here, and has moved on. 


Anyone else think McKinney has toughened up ever since his alter ego showed up?
Hawaiian Bobcat
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Posted: 1/7/2014 5:29 PM
Jeff McKinney wrote:expand_more
This story involving Coach Groce also makes you pull for the Illini.

http://illiniboard.com/2014/01/02/powerful/
It tells me we didn't offer Groce enough to keep him. I am happy with JC because he's a great coach. Groce might be a once in a generation leader for a program.
Come on, Hawaiian. You can't be serious. It's not that we didn't offer Groce enough to keep him. It's that we COULDNT offer Groce enough to keep him. I'm glad he continues to show an interest in our guys whom he recruited, but it's time to let go of this. Ohio is a stepping stone job. Groce stepped on this stone, did a great job here, and has moved on.
Why? Why do we have to be a stepping stone job? He loved that team. He loved Athens (getting emotional in an interview). This is where you FIND the money. Stepping stone job? Child Please! If we always think we are a stepping stone job we will always be a stepping stone job. Shortsighted in my opinion.

Everybody on this board always complains about not being "next level" or wanting a "better conference" or being a "national player." You have to take chances. John Groce was a VERY SAFE bet. Our leadership is satisfied with being a good MAC program. That is fine.

I am stating a fact. We did not offer enough money to keep him. I think we could have made an offer that he would have stayed. I firmly believe if he'd stayed we could have become a perennial top 25 program. We would have blown past the rest of the MAC. I understand why he left but I wish we could have kept him.

I don't post updates about him. When I read articles about how awesome he is doing in Champaign, I think man I wish we ponied up enough money to keep him. I think it would be much easier to "let him go" if people stop finding it necessary to continue posting updates on him. That's great he tweeted concerned about Ric and it is great he takes time to write members of our military. I think people that post these thing have just a hard enough time letting him go as my comments relating to their post. It is more of a passive aggressive approach. Oh geez look at the great John Groce. Why are these people trolling Illinois sites to begin with if they have already moved on? Perhaps it is their love for Groce? I have never been or will never go to an Illinois site. I don't look for information on Groce. It was presented to me on a Ohio board. So who is really having a tough time letting him go?

It is like having to see the smoking hot girl that you took to the dance twice with another man. You just don't want to see it and when you do you think about what could have been. Then thinking to yourself, I am a nice guy, we had fun but she is with a better dude. Hopefully I can get stepped on by another girl one day.

I think JC was the best replacement we could find. I agree with most posters that JC is here to stay for a long time. I think he will bring a satisfactory amount of success to Ohio. I think we can be a consistent top 3 or 4 team in the MAC year in and year out. Sure we can win a game or two with JC but not perennial top 25. Speaking in another metaphor we replaced filet with NY strip.

Aloha.
Last Edited: 1/7/2014 5:30:24 PM by Hawaiian Bobcat
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Posted: 1/7/2014 5:59 PM
You need to factor in the athletics-academics issue when considering what we could/should have offered Groce.  Had we somehow found a way to offer $700k to keep him, we would have had a riot among our faculty.  It's a reality not faced by presidents at Illinois, et al.




Recovering Journalist
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Posted: 1/7/2014 6:18 PM
Setting aside the salary matching issue, which is impossible, could someone tell me when Groce had us as a perennial top 25 team. Was that before or after losing to two straight sub-200 RPI teams?

Most people on here realize that Groce had something very special as a leader and person, and most of us loved his contributions, but let's not let our memories get too foggy on his record. He caught lightning in a bottle twice in three years, which is awesome, but it didn't magically transform the program. In fact, both runs hinged on squeaking in to the tournament itself -- hardly a 'sure thing."
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Posted: 1/7/2014 6:57 PM
Recovering Journalist wrote:expand_more
Setting aside the salary matching issue, which is impossible, could someone tell me when Groce had us as a perennial top 25 team. Was that before or after losing to two straight sub-200 RPI teams?

Most people on here realize that Groce had something very special as a leader and person, and most of us loved his contributions, but let's not let our memories get too foggy on his record. He caught lightning in a bottle twice in three years, which is awesome, but it didn't magically transform the program. In fact, both runs hinged on squeaking in to the tournament itself -- hardly a 'sure thing."
I am not in the position or tax bracket to figure out where the University could have found the money. Unfortunately nobody wanted to get to creative with his potential extension. You can't deny Groce he has rejuvenated the Illinois program and took the Ohio program to place it had not been in a long time. Ohio was starting to get a higher quality of player with Groce then with TOS. It takes longer to build a perennial top 25 program in the MAC then the Big 10. We will never know because he left. Hence the point where I said, "I firmly believe." The product was not even close to being completed. I am well aware of his record and I believe the party was just getting started. I guess the perspective of how you view those first 3 years. I didn't look at it as the ceiling and lightning in a bottle. I look at it as a glimpse of what Ohio basketball was becoming.

AGAIN. I am very happy with JC. I think we will be a tough MAC team to beat. Our future is still bright. I am tired of talking in hind site. I won't comment on anymore new Groce related posts or any hind site related posts. He is gone.
LuckySparrow
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Posted: 1/7/2014 7:49 PM
I get a sinking feeling every time I think about Ric's injury.

If this is indeed the end of his Bobcat career, then I've been more than impressed with everything he's done. A great representative of this university. Seems like a great friend/teammate too. 

 
Mark Lembright '85
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Posted: 1/7/2014 9:40 PM
LuckySparrow wrote:expand_more
I get a sinking feeling every time I think about Ric's injury.

If this is indeed the end of his Bobcat career, then I've been more than impressed with everything he's done. A great representative of this university. Seems like a great friend/teammate too. 

 


Agreed on all counts as to Ric-it's a big loss but hopefully he makes a full recovery!

As to Groce, there was no way he was staying, Hawaiian.  While he might be making $1.1 million/yr now, I'm sure Illinois will increase that figure significantly in the near future, especially if Groce keeps winning.  $1.1 million/yr is just a starting point.  Secondly, Illinois has better facilities and more resources (see earlier post from Bornacatfan about the upgrades to Memorial Hall).  Finally, Ohio's in the MAC, Illinois in the Big 10.  Just on strength of competition alone Illinois wins that one over Ohio big time!  All of this makes it much easier for Groce to recruit the type of recruit he ultimately wants and thinks he can get.
Last Edited: 1/7/2014 9:41:35 PM by Mark Lembright '85
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 1/8/2014 1:29 AM
Probably we couldn't have kept Groce.  But I'd hope--fantasy?--that somehow Ohio should be able to come up with $1-3 million to keep a stud coach in hoops.  The Convo has enough seats to sell to defray a reasonable part of that.  Then, a tough program should be able to get some road money games.  Alum/friends coming up with the rest of the money in advance....perhaps realizing that national prominence could well lead to greater alumni offerings, hopefully more than offsetting the up front investment...in a way that also boosts academics...

Maybe it's a dream.

But it'd be nice to have that dilemma again--and to be prepared to fight that battle a little more vigorously next time.




Football with limited size of Peden/inability for strong home revs of 60-70k can never be in the same situation, of course.

 
colobobcat66
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Posted: 1/8/2014 7:40 AM
hawaiian bobcat wrote:expand_more
Setting aside the salary matching issue, which is impossible, could someone tell me when Groce had us as a perennial top 25 team. Was that before or after losing to two straight sub-200 RPI teams?

Most people on here realize that Groce had something very special as a leader and person, and most of us loved his contributions, but let's not let our memories get too foggy on his record. He caught lightning in a bottle twice in three years, which is awesome, but it didn't magically transform the program. In fact, both runs hinged on squeaking in to the tournament itself -- hardly a 'sure thing."
I am not in the position or tax bracket to figure out where the University could have found the money. Unfortunately nobody wanted to get to creative with his potential extension. You can't deny Groce he has rejuvenated the Illinois program and took the Ohio program to place it had not been in a long time. Ohio was starting to get a higher quality of player with Groce then with TOS. It takes longer to build a perennial top 25 program in the MAC then the Big 10. We will never know because he left. Hence the point where I said, "I firmly believe." The product was not even close to being completed. I am well aware of his record and I believe the party was just getting started. I guess the perspective of how you view those first 3 years. I didn't look at it as the ceiling and lightning in a bottle. I look at it as a glimpse of what Ohio basketball was becoming.

AGAIN. I am very happy with JC. I think we will be a tough MAC team to beat. Our future is still bright. I am tired of talking in hind site. I won't comment on anymore new Groce related posts or any hind site related posts. He is gone.

My two cents, if Groce had stayed and made us a perennial top 25 team, he would have been gobbled up by someone else anyway. We would not have been able to have kept him anyway in the long run. I think we will get a better idea about your theory when we see him be top 25 at Illlinois every year, but even then I'm not sure that would translate to what he would have done at Ohio long term.
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Posted: 1/8/2014 8:37 AM
OU_Country wrote:expand_more
As much as I wish he could have be coaxed into staying longer, I agree.  John was always going to leave Athens for a bigger program.  It was just a matter of when.  I take a lot of joy in watching his Illini teams do well. 

THe real Karma here is when Illinois fans realize they are not a blueblood and he takes one of the premier jobs in the country.....When COach K retires or Self loses to a few more SDSU's of the world at home you may see JG in a lifetime job. 


There is no way he could turn down the Illinois situation. Money is nice, perks are nice but far overshadowing that is facilities, nutrition, training room, medical staff, recruiting tools and a variety of other intangibles that make the job really hard to turn down. 

 
Last Edited: 1/8/2014 8:40:58 AM by bornacatfan
OUVan
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Posted: 1/8/2014 8:47 AM
hawaiian bobcat wrote:expand_more
Why? Why do we have to be a stepping stone job?


Because we have a stepping stone budget.  You are focusing on the amount it would have taken to keep Groce but it isn't just about him. It's also about his assistant coaches.  Coaches want to take care of their staff.  You are talking about recruiting budgets.  You are talking about amenities. Unless we seriously step our game we have no chance of being anything but a good stepping stone program.  Which is actually a step up from where we were before John Groce showed up.  We might have gotten lucky with the Jim Christian hire in that he has seen the other side and may be happy to stay at Ohio for a long time ala Keith Dambrot at Akron.  But we are millions and millions of dollars annually away from being a destination job.  It is what it is.
Andrew Ruck
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Posted: 1/8/2014 8:55 AM
bornacatfan wrote:expand_more
There is no way he could turn down the Illinois situation. Money is nice, perks are nice but far overshadowing that is facilities, nutrition, training room, medical staff, recruiting tools and a variety of other intangibles that make the job really hard to turn down.

And better parking benefits!

 
bn9
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Posted: 1/8/2014 8:59 AM
Andrew Ruck wrote:expand_more
There is no way he could turn down the Illinois situation. Money is nice, perks are nice but far overshadowing that is facilities, nutrition, training room, medical staff, recruiting tools and a variety of other intangibles that make the job really hard to turn down.

And better parking benefits!

 


He also said something about being much closer to his parents at Illinois.  I think he said it was only a 90 minute drive and that would allow them to be there a lot more.
bornacatfan
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Posted: 1/8/2014 10:04 AM
Andrew Ruck wrote:expand_more
There is no way he could turn down the Illinois situation. Money is nice, perks are nice but far overshadowing that is facilities, nutrition, training room, medical staff, recruiting tools and a variety of other intangibles that make the job really hard to turn down.

And better parking benefits!

 


I don't think his or the staff parking benefits could get much better than they had at the Convo but the players benefits sure did

Better hand dryers too. Can't wait to see how the remodel goes......but he maybe off to greener pastures by the time the State Farm center is done.

FWIW...the coaches have a very nice suite at Ohio and the locker room/training room changes are finestkind. The Basketball offices were remodeled recently as was the locker room. Those are not at issue at all.
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 1/8/2014 1:07 PM
Monroe, I wish your dream could be made reality, but IMO it simply isn't reality--or even possible. 

Only way that might have any chance of happening is if football was dropped as a sport here.  That's NOT going to happen and I'm not suggesting it.

It is what it is.  We can get bigger and better and maybe be like a VCU or Butler, but we can't compete with the Illinois' of the world in terms of attracting coaches.  Even Butler has had a revolving door of coaches because they have their limits, too. 
Hawaiian Bobcat
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Posted: 1/8/2014 1:45 PM
OUVan wrote:expand_more
Why? Why do we have to be a stepping stone job?


Because we have a stepping stone budget. You are focusing on the amount it would have taken to keep Groce but it isn't just about him. It's also about his assistant coaches. Coaches want to take care of their staff. You are talking about recruiting budgets. You are talking about amenities. Unless we seriously step our game we have no chance of being anything but a good stepping stone program. Which is actually a step up from where we were before John Groce showed up. We might have gotten lucky with the Jim Christian hire in that he has seen the other side and may be happy to stay at Ohio for a long time ala Keith Dambrot at Akron. But we are millions and millions of dollars annually away from being a destination job. It is what it is.
I was stating that to not except just being a stepping stone job. Alden was brilliant by building a high major sized venue. Why except something that can chance? I do give what I can to the Athletic Department hoping to help build a bigger budget. Also I know the politics of the institution so I also match every donation I make to the AD with one to the Endowment. I want to eventually match every dollar with one to the general fund as well.
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