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Ohio Basketball Topic
Topic: Should We Accept a CBI/CIT Bid?
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bornacatfan
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Posted: 3/8/2014 3:14 PM
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Big Willy wrote:expand_more
Teams that have played in the CBI/CIT:  Oregon State, St. John's, Wichita State, Stanford, VCU, St Louis, Creighton, Oregon, Pittsburgh, Butler, Purdue, and Texas. We should play in any post-season tourney we can get in.

Anyone have a graphic on their next year success? Teams that go with the idea of building on the next year do so...teams that are just extending a season....don't go very far get very much out of it. 


I know our former coach absolutely used it and has it written into every contract...unless he ends up at Duke I do not think that will change.....I do not know how JC uses that experience. Has he won a post season game ? 


 
bigtillyoopsupsideurhead
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Posted: 3/8/2014 3:48 PM
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bornacatfan wrote:expand_more

I know our former coach absolutely used it and has it written into every contract...unless he ends up at Duke I do not think that will change.....I do not know how JC uses that experience. Has he won a post season game ? 


 

JC never won a postseason game at Kent. Not NCAA or NIT or anything. His only post season win as a HC was the 2012 CBI, TCU over Milwaukee: http://scores.espn.go.com/ncb/boxscore?gameId=320732628



 
OUVan
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Posted: 3/8/2014 3:56 PM
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Yes
ts1227
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Posted: 3/8/2014 4:41 PM
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Regardless of rationale, I would imagine these tourneys hold it against schoold that deny them for future selections. I don't know if it's worth potentially burning a bridge, even though the health concern is valid.
bornacatfan
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Posted: 3/8/2014 5:42 PM
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watching Ndour today I do not think there is a health concern...to steal from football....Beaner needs all the reps he can get as does TC, Setty and anyone else that can get floor time. Nick needs to put this 3 ball record out of reach. 

He has had the good fortune to play from day 1 and have a significant offensive mindset that put him in a great spot....he has continued to improve his floor game and ability ot get to the rim which also opens up the 3 ball as it creates space. Happy to see him extend this as long as possible. Put that sucka way outta reach. 

Look at the road the guys who eschew the tourney have gone ...Wright ST is a great example. 

 
perimeterpost
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Posted: 3/8/2014 9:19 PM
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According to bracketmatrix.com Ohio is projected as a #8 seed in the NIT with a first round matchup vs #1 Georgetown. That would be entertaining.
colobobcat66
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Posted: 3/8/2014 10:42 PM
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bobcat28 wrote:expand_more
Really looking forward to the ohio @ eastern Kentucky first round cbi match up.

I hope we play them because they just beat Belmont to earn a trip to the NCAA tourney!
catfan28
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Posted: 3/8/2014 10:46 PM
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RSBobcat wrote:expand_more

I bet there would be a banner if we won the tourney

 


Good point. I guess the logical follow-up question here is...should we hang banners for CBI or CIT appearances??

They're still postseason tournaments. We hang NIT banners. I tend to think that we should. Thoughts?
bornacatfan
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Posted: 3/8/2014 11:24 PM
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catfan28 wrote:expand_more

I bet there would be a banner if we won the tourney

 


Good point. I guess the logical follow-up question here is...should we hang banners for CBI or CIT appearances??

They're still postseason tournaments. We hang NIT banners. I tend to think that we should. Thoughts?

I don't tend to lean that way .....but my background is a little different than most ....we only hang one type of Banner where we come from ......with 2 runner ups  Ray McCallum who hung 78 and 79 banners still chides Tommy about being a 2 time loser. 



 
giacomo
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Posted: 3/9/2014 6:25 PM
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Let's do the math. 68 teams in NCAA and 32 teams in NIT. That's 100 teams. To me, if you can't get into that group, what's the point? I really doubt that the kids are all juiced up to play in these meaningless sideshows. They are tired after a long year and they know that nobody cares. The CBI has another 32 teams and the CIT has 16. So, the winners of these tourneys are either #101 or maybe number 133,depending on which tourney you think is better.
bn9
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Posted: 3/9/2014 7:29 PM
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giacomo wrote:expand_more
Let's do the math. 68 teams in NCAA and 32 teams in NIT. That's 100 teams. To me, if you can't get into that group, what's the point? I really doubt that the kids are all juiced up to play in these meaningless sideshows. They are tired after a long year and they know that nobody cares. The CBI has another 32 teams and the CIT has 16. So, the winners of these tourneys are either #101 or maybe number 133,depending on which tourney you think is better.
I say the team takes a vote. If they vote to play, great. Let's lace 'em up. If not, then there is no point. I would bet my last penny that there is no one in this locker room that would vote to quit.
The Optimist
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Posted: 3/9/2014 7:45 PM
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giacomo wrote:expand_more
Let's do the math. 68 teams in NCAA and 32 teams in NIT. That's 100 teams. To me, if you can't get into that group, what's the point? I really doubt that the kids are all juiced up to play in these meaningless sideshows. They are tired after a long year and they know that nobody cares. The CBI has another 32 teams and the CIT has 16. So, the winners of these tourneys are either #101 or maybe number 133,depending on which tourney you think is better.

Why 68+32? Why not just 68?

If you are going to make the argument that the CIT and CBI don't matter, why are we giving the NIT a pass? Tradition? Come on... Do the math. 68 is enough to find 1 winner who is the #1 best team.

Unless of course, finding out the #100 best team isn't the purpose of the CIT or CBI.
I say play, no matter how healthy our starters our. Extra games and postseason experience is good for the long-term health of the program. Lets say Stevie and NDOUR both cannot play. Fine, give Bean and Wadley all those minutes. They will both be back next year. The extra minutes in a game that is "do or die" will make them more prepared for future matchup.
Last Edited: 3/9/2014 7:47:08 PM by The Optimist
UpSan Bobcat
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Posted: 3/9/2014 11:10 PM
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The Optimist wrote:expand_more
Let's do the math. 68 teams in NCAA and 32 teams in NIT. That's 100 teams. To me, if you can't get into that group, what's the point? I really doubt that the kids are all juiced up to play in these meaningless sideshows. They are tired after a long year and they know that nobody cares. The CBI has another 32 teams and the CIT has 16. So, the winners of these tourneys are either #101 or maybe number 133,depending on which tourney you think is better.

Why 68+32? Why not just 68?

If you are going to make the argument that the CIT and CBI don't matter, why are we giving the NIT a pass? Tradition? Come on... Do the math. 68 is enough to find 1 winner who is the #1 best team.

Unless of course, finding out the #100 best team isn't the purpose of the CIT or CBI.
I say play, no matter how healthy our starters our. Extra games and postseason experience is good for the long-term health of the program. Lets say Stevie and NDOUR both cannot play. Fine, give Bean and Wadley all those minutes. They will both be back next year. The extra minutes in a game that is "do or die" will make them more prepared for future matchup.

Absolutely. It's not like Ohio is going to be so unhealthy that they can't find enough players to send out on the court. There are some players who can get valuable minutes. Look what extra playing time has done for the development of Willis and Campbell.
OU_Country
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Posted: 3/10/2014 10:51 AM
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giacomo wrote:expand_more
Let's do the math. 68 teams in NCAA and 32 teams in NIT. That's 100 teams. To me, if you can't get into that group, what's the point? I really doubt that the kids are all juiced up to play in these meaningless sideshows. They are tired after a long year and they know that nobody cares. The CBI has another 32 teams and the CIT has 16. So, the winners of these tourneys are either #101 or maybe number 133,depending on which tourney you think is better.


If you're #101, that's still better than 240+ other teams in a given year, and your team had to win a bunch of games in a win or go home format.  I say it's worthwhile to hang.  Also, consider that the teams visiting OUr building don't likely have those types of banners hanging at all.
bigtillyoopsupsideurhead
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Posted: 3/10/2014 10:59 AM
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I mean I probably wouldn't hang a CBI banner above the Convo floor with all the other banners, but I'm sure there's a nice side room somewhere where we can stash a banner and a trophy. 

A CBI trophy is better than no trophy at all. 

 
giacomo
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Posted: 3/10/2014 10:00 PM
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It doesn't take too much to make this board happy. If you want to spin these second rate tourneys, go ahead. You seem to think that any additional games are so valuable, but I disagree. It's the end of a long season and these guys know the score. If the extra games were so valuable, why didn't that help us last year after the sweet 16 run the year before? There is an old saying that you never stay the same when you practice or play, you either get better or get worse.
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Posted: 3/10/2014 11:34 PM
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I don't think we have to worry about the CIT. Last year out of a field of 32 teams only Weber State and Eastern Kentucky had 22 or more wins. For the CBI bracket only North Dakota State, Western Illinois and Charleston had more than 22 wins. What do all of these schools have in common? They play in weaker conferences than the MAC. Ohio should be a lock for the NIT with a win on Wednesday against Miami. They say its tough to beat a team 3 times in one season. I think its tough for Miami to compete with Ohio two times in one week and after a spirited game on Saturday that was their chance at knocking off the Bobcats. Playing Akron in the quarters is a different story but they might have the rust factor working against them.
TheBobcatBandit
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Posted: 3/10/2014 11:36 PM
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giacomo wrote:expand_more
It doesn't take too much to make this board happy. If you want to spin these second rate tourneys, go ahead. You seem to think that any additional games are so valuable, but I disagree. It's the end of a long season and these guys know the score. If the extra games were so valuable, why didn't that help us last year after the sweet 16 run the year before? There is an old saying that you never stay the same when you practice or play, you either get better or get worse.
So you're telling me that playing Campbell and Setty this year and getting them extra minutes hasn't made them better players? They clearly have improved. For any sport the more you play the better you get. They will get better by playing the only negative could be moral. Overplaying will hurt their love for the game and that they'd unmotivated them for the off season.
bornacatfan
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Posted: 3/11/2014 12:12 AM
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giacomo wrote:expand_more
It doesn't take too much to make this board happy. If you want to spin these second rate tourneys, go ahead. You seem to think that any additional games are so valuable, but I disagree. It's the end of a long season and these guys know the score. If the extra games were so valuable, why didn't that help us last year after the sweet 16 run the year before? There is an old saying that you never stay the same when you practice or play, you either get better or get worse.

It s not about being happy. It is about competing in modern day NCAA hoops. You can choose to dislike it and you can act like a curmudgeon and rattle your cane at everyone who sees the benefit. EKU used an appearance last year to get better and punched their ticket to the dance this year. Are you going to deny that Coop, Nick, Ric, TJ, Ivo et al did get a benefit from beating Marshall at their house and getting an extra week of practice before playing ETSU in 2011? the flip side of your Sweet 16 question is that those guys extended the previous year and got extra reps from playing in a rtourney. I think anyone who has any BB knowledge knows why we did not get a lot of ;'lasting  benefit from the 2012 run. Had something to do with changing coaches and systems. Any extra practice and run is offset by major program changes 

I respect your opinion. I  understand why you feel that way. I like to keep moving and evaluating ... I am not still spinning vinyl discs with the Rolling Stones as my only form of music. The universe expands daily... I still listen to the Stones on a very nice turntable but I also download MP3's and stream Slacker via Bluetooth in my motorcycle helmet looking for the next great thing.,,, change comes to all of us... 

 
JSF
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Posted: 3/11/2014 1:07 AM
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giacomo wrote:expand_more
It doesn't take too much to make this board happy.


Weird that a group of Ohio basketball fans would enjoy watching Ohio basketball.
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 3/11/2014 4:08 AM
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Yeah, I'm sure that the coaching staff would absolutely hate the chance to play 1, 2, 3 or more games in a tournament so that the youngsters could get some more experience.  
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Posted: 3/11/2014 8:05 AM
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My guess is getting the opportunity to play over the next week or two may just provide Ric the time to get back on the court.  I'm thinking the team accepts an invite.
The Optimist
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Posted: 3/11/2014 8:28 AM
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Uncle Wes wrote:expand_more
I don't think we have to worry about the CIT. Last year out of a field of 32 teams only Weber State and Eastern Kentucky had 22 or more wins. For the CBI bracket only North Dakota State, Western Illinois and Charleston had more than 22 wins. What do all of these schools have in common? They play in weaker conferences than the MAC. Ohio should be a lock for the NIT with a win on Wednesday against Miami. They say its tough to beat a team 3 times in one season. I think its tough for Miami to compete with Ohio two times in one week and after a spirited game on Saturday that was their chance at knocking off the Bobcats. Playing Akron in the quarters is a different story but they might have the rust factor working against them.

 

I mentioned in the chat that we would make the NIT if we made the finals and it wasn't well received.
 

Much like the NCAA Tournament, I don't think people realize the teams that have made the NIT the last couple of years.
 

That, and this board gives our OOC slate little respect. Our "resume" isn't perfect but it is pretty good. 20 wins, Top 100 RPI (moving closer to 50 if we run all the way to the MACC) multiple top 100 RPI wins, 2 respectably close loses to top 25 teams and ZERO loses to teams below 200 in the RPI. As bad as losing to Oakland was, compared to our bad loses in years past this one wasn't too deadly...
 

NIT is a very real possibility.

catfan28
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Posted: 3/11/2014 8:29 AM
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No way NIT gives us a sniff unless we reach the semis. Might even have to get to the finals. Otherwise, CIT (or CBI) here we come.

Remember, WMU gets an automatic bid if they don't win the MAC. And I don't see the NIT taking two MAC teams.
Last Edited: 3/11/2014 8:30:17 AM by catfan28
giacomo
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Posted: 3/11/2014 4:09 PM
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It's a moot point, anyway. They will play any game to which an invitation is extended. There is a great line from the Bogart movie "Key Largo". If you have seen it, you know the plot. This sums it up:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWa6vsXOKAU
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