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Topic: Official Game 4 Thread: Marshall
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C Money
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Posted: 9/22/2010 6:52 PM
I had lunch today with 4 hard core Marshall fans. 2 are convinced their season is already over, and the other 2 are convinced that without a win this weekend, their season is over, and concede that it might already be over. 

One of the hard core fans was telling me how he thought they could do better this week. Yeah, BUGS moved the ball at will against them, but BUGS is a passing team, and their run defense will stuff us, he said. I politely explained to him how OUr offense SHOULD be much closer to BUGS's than a traditional power rushing team. His response? "Oh. F_ _ _ _!!!" Then he changed the topic to the Reds.

Marshall has worse QB problems than we do. They used 3 different QBs against BUGS, and not in special wildcat packages, but in legitimate we've-got-to-score-here-let's-see-if-this-guy-can-get-it-done critical game situations. The coaches are trying to install a RichRod-style spread system. Anderson, the starter, has next to no athletic ability. Sullivan has the most promise, but he's a true freshman and has horrible mechanics. Graham is the happy medium, but people say he's a head case and unteachable....he's already posted on his Facebook page that he's transferring after this season, so the coaches don't want to turn over the offense to him.

As for their other offensive positions, at RB, Booker has major speed, but he can't hang on to the football. Ward is their best all-around back, but he fits better in a lead-back style running game than the spread, which Marshall's coaches just will not run. At WR, the consensus is that they only have 1 player that can actually catch the ball. I think Marshall's only advantage will be on the O-Line, but we can mix up blitzes and beat them.

When we have the ball, I said it after Toledo, and I will say it again: THROW THE BALL DOWN THE FIELD. Marshall's secondary is horrible. We can and should win this game if we get the ball to our best players (WRs) and let them make plays. Our line has to get it together though, because Marshall can bring a good pass rush.

Prediction: Ohio 24, Marshall 17.

Also, WSAZ just totally mixed up Boo and Phil. I'm hoping Marshall does the same.
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 9/23/2010 2:52 AM
In re last week's game in columbus, maybe I'm seeing what I want to see but I think that OUr O-line is going to start coming together.  Meaning the drives and the passing and the running will start to mesh.  It won't be a sudden explosion thing, just steady improvement that will get us through.
Buckeye Rican
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Posted: 9/23/2010 8:35 AM
medler wrote:expand_more
Marshall ranks 86th in rushing defense (Ohio ranks 71)
Marshall ranks 107th in passing defense (Ohio ranks 10)
Marshall ranks 110th in total defense (Ohio ranks 30)
Marshall ranks 109th in scoring defense (Ohio ranks 75)

Marshall ranks 92nd in rushing offense (Ohio ranks 97)
Marshall ranks 86th in passing offense (Ohio ranks 117)
Marshall ranks 95th in total offense (Ohio ranks 119)
Marshall ranks 101st in scoring offense (Ohio ranks 105) 

Marshall ranks 112th in turnover Margin (Ohio ranks 105)


Offensively it's basically a wash.  Both offensives have been anemic (with Marshall having the slight edge)
Defensively, Ohio utterly destroys them at stopping the pass and overall defense..

Ohio is consistently ranked in the top half of their conference in almost every stat.
Marshall is in the bottom half.  With Houston's QB injury double whammy, the MAC is by far a tougher conference than cUSA.


Take out the FCS option team and our pass numbers are not nearly as good.  Toledo has an anemic pass offense as well.  Our secondary is largely untested outside of OSU.  I am interested in seeing how we fair in the remaining games.


I'm not so certain that the subtraction Keenum at Houston makes the MAC a "by far tougher conference than the CUSA. Houston, Tulane, Southern Miss, and ECU are good football teams. The jury is out on Marshall. I figure Marshall looks at the Ohio game as a must win game. We're going to get the Herd's best effort. Two losses vs. questionable MAC teams won't sit well with "Herd nation" down there. 

We will find out a lot about the 2010 Ohio Bobcats this Saturday. We're still in the cold about this team.

Good teams can run the football when they need to. I don't think Ohio can do this.

Right now I'm not convinced we know how to win. The loss last weekend can't do much for the old confidence. Losing to the #2 team is rough, but we were out of that game in 10 minutes. 

I do hope to admit my fallacy on Sunday morning, but I'm afraid we're in for a long season.


This is why I posted my personal view of each team based off of having seen both of them play.  You're right  Good teams can run the football when they need to.  However, Good teams can also know when to switch around between passing and running when they need to.  As I mentioned about Marshall's D-Line, I don't think they will have the stamina to go a full game.  As long as the attemps to keep pounding it out come every once in a while, their line will start to break down and you will see the running lanes develop much easier.

You have the advantage that both Bates and Jackson can be mobile as needed.  (We've seen Jackson run in the past and Bates was the leading rusher against Ohio State)

I can honestly tell you the blitzing attack Ohio did in the 2nd half was having lots of people start questioning Ohio State's O-line's ability to block, so Ohio should try to keep that in the game.

Also don't take the yardage comparisons between Ohio and Marshall vs. Ohio State as anything.  2nd and 3rd string defense was on the field 5 minutes left in the 1st quarter at times to give people reps.

Also Marshall was playing against Ohio State's 3rd string offensive line the majority of the time and Ohio State still put up more yardage against them than against Ohio (reserves on offense came in in the 2nd half)

Yes, I could be wrong, and Marshall could win the game.  But from the stats and what I've seen, Ohio should win this by 10 at least.
Buckeye Rican
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Posted: 9/23/2010 8:37 AM
Monroe Slavin, CPA wrote:expand_more
In re last week's game in columbus, maybe I'm seeing what I want to see but I think that OUr O-line is going to start coming together.  Meaning the drives and the passing and the running will start to mesh.  It won't be a sudden explosion thing, just steady improvement that will get us through.


3 yards and a cloud of dust eventually leads to 50 yard gains on the ground ;)
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 9/23/2010 10:38 AM
Keys to victory:  no turnovers and some thinking about our running game (such as the occasional two back set).  A throw or two to the TE wouldn't hurt either.
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Posted: 9/23/2010 12:00 PM
We better throw the ball period if we are going to win the game.....but who is going to throw the ball is the question at hand....if you only throw the ball 2-4 yards down field, might as well run the whole game....
bobcat695
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Posted: 9/23/2010 1:34 PM
At least a completed pass from the 4 yard line is unlikely to produce a safety.    
Athens
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Posted: 9/23/2010 5:08 PM

Ohio can get the passing game going early and that will open up the run. I know some on here want a return to the option attack but ultimately a good passing attack will trump a running game. Bowling Green is a good example why are they a good MAC team year after year with an occassional exception is because they know how to execute a passing offense. A program would need a killer defense to win games without a credible passing attack in this day and age.

ddub63
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Posted: 9/23/2010 6:03 PM
That means that you better put in QB that can actually pass the ball down field and complete some of them more than 35 to 40 %......
MUTeke
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Posted: 9/23/2010 10:32 PM
Buckeye Rican wrote:expand_more
Marshall ranks 86th in rushing defense (Ohio ranks 71)
Marshall ranks 107th in passing defense (Ohio ranks 10)
Marshall ranks 110th in total defense (Ohio ranks 30)
Marshall ranks 109th in scoring defense (Ohio ranks 75)

Marshall ranks 92nd in rushing offense (Ohio ranks 97)
Marshall ranks 86th in passing offense (Ohio ranks 117)
Marshall ranks 95th in total offense (Ohio ranks 119)
Marshall ranks 101st in scoring offense (Ohio ranks 105) 

Marshall ranks 112th in turnover Margin (Ohio ranks 105)


Offensively it's basically a wash.  Both offensives have been anemic (with Marshall having the slight edge)
Defensively, Ohio utterly destroys them at stopping the pass and overall defense..

Ohio is consistently ranked in the top half of their conference in almost every stat.
Marshall is in the bottom half.  With Houston's QB injury double whammy, the MAC is by far a tougher conference than cUSA.


You make valid points but let me add to it as well. Ohio State currently has the #7 ranked defense in the nation. WVU has the #10 ranked defense in the nation. Ohio State has the #20 ranked offense in the nation and WVU's offense is ranked #26. Bowling Green's Passing Offense is ranked 29th in the nation. Our Strength of Schedule, according to Jeff Sagarin, is the 6th toughest schedule in the country after three weeks. As much as our offense has turned the ball over and as much yardage as our defense has allowed we're still two fumbles away from being 2-1 at this point.

Ohio also faced Ohio State but match ups with Wofford and Toledo result in a Strength of Schedule rating of #79. Am I saying SOS is indicative of how good either team is on any given day? No. I'm just giving some context to the ranking comparisons above.

From a Marshall standpoint we don't know what we have. We've been Jekyll and Hyde to this point so far. The roller coaster is killing me to be honest. We played horrible against OSU, played arguably the best  55 minutes of football against WVU than we've played since the late 90's, and then went into a buzz saw last week at BGSU hungover and unprepared and got our butts kicked. Consistent play, turnovers and the ability to close football games are our biggest weaknesses to this point.

I really don't know what to expect from Doc and company this Saturday. You guys might see all three QBs. Anderson is a true pocket passer. Sullivan is short and still a little rough around the edges but is quick and can keep plays alive with his feet. AJ gives us a strong arm and a zone read option. I figure we'll see a few of the true freshman wide receivers get some playing time this week too. We can't keep the same couple of guys out there all day running pass routes and not expect them to get tired, we need the depth there. You'll see Martin Ward and Andre Booker in the backfield. Unless something changes this week Ward probably won't carry the ball as often as he did in the Pizza Bowl. Our offensive line has given up one sack all season.

Defensively, Mario Harvey and Vinny Curry are tied for 7th in the nation with 4 sacks a piece. The Defense is tied with LSU, Arizona and NC State at #6 in the nation in sacks. Our defensive backfield is horrible. They've been torched by every team we've played so far. Both of our starting corners were dismissed from the team this summer leaving us to play freshmen, a JUCO transfer and a senior coming back from an injury.

I know you guys aren't fans of the short passes but Bowling Green ran up and down the field on us by utilizing 3 step drops. They neutralized our pass rush by dinking and dunking us to death for most of the game. We'll be in for a long night if your line can give your QB time to throw Saturday night.
Bobcat36
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Posted: 9/24/2010 12:01 PM
It's GO time for the O line!
(see what I did there?)
 
Last Edited: 9/24/2010 12:01:31 PM by Bobcat36
bobcat695
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Posted: 9/24/2010 12:18 PM
Why didn't you post this September 3rd?  They have needed that message all season.
Mr. Mo Jo Risin
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Posted: 9/24/2010 3:32 PM
MUTeke wrote:expand_more
Marshall ranks 86th in rushing defense (Ohio ranks 71)
Marshall ranks 107th in passing defense (Ohio ranks 10)
Marshall ranks 110th in total defense (Ohio ranks 30)
Marshall ranks 109th in scoring defense (Ohio ranks 75)

Marshall ranks 92nd in rushing offense (Ohio ranks 97)
Marshall ranks 86th in passing offense (Ohio ranks 117)
Marshall ranks 95th in total offense (Ohio ranks 119)
Marshall ranks 101st in scoring offense (Ohio ranks 105) 

Marshall ranks 112th in turnover Margin (Ohio ranks 105)


Offensively it's basically a wash.  Both offensives have been anemic (with Marshall having the slight edge)
Defensively, Ohio utterly destroys them at stopping the pass and overall defense..

Ohio is consistently ranked in the top half of their conference in almost every stat.
Marshall is in the bottom half.  With Houston's QB injury double whammy, the MAC is by far a tougher conference than cUSA.


You make valid points but let me add to it as well. Ohio State currently has the #7 ranked defense in the nation. WVU has the #10 ranked defense in the nation. Ohio State has the #20 ranked offense in the nation and WVU's offense is ranked #26. Bowling Green's Passing Offense is ranked 29th in the nation. Our Strength of Schedule, according to Jeff Sagarin, is the 6th toughest schedule in the country after three weeks. As much as our offense has turned the ball over and as much yardage as our defense has allowed we're still two fumbles away from being 2-1 at this point.

Ohio also faced Ohio State but match ups with Wofford and Toledo result in a Strength of Schedule rating of #79. Am I saying SOS is indicative of how good either team is on any given day? No. I'm just giving some context to the ranking comparisons above.

From a Marshall standpoint we don't know what we have. We've been Jekyll and Hyde to this point so far. The roller coaster is killing me to be honest. We played horrible against OSU, played arguably the best  55 minutes of football against WVU than we've played since the late 90's, and then went into a buzz saw last week at BGSU hungover and unprepared and got our butts kicked. Consistent play, turnovers and the ability to close football games are our biggest weaknesses to this point.

I really don't know what to expect from Doc and company this Saturday. You guys might see all three QBs. Anderson is a true pocket passer. Sullivan is short and still a little rough around the edges but is quick and can keep plays alive with his feet. AJ gives us a strong arm and a zone read option. I figure we'll see a few of the true freshman wide receivers get some playing time this week too. We can't keep the same couple of guys out there all day running pass routes and not expect them to get tired, we need the depth there. You'll see Martin Ward and Andre Booker in the backfield. Unless something changes this week Ward probably won't carry the ball as often as he did in the Pizza Bowl. Our offensive line has given up one sack all season.

Defensively, Mario Harvey and Vinny Curry are tied for 7th in the nation with 4 sacks a piece. The Defense is tied with LSU, Arizona and NC State at #6 in the nation in sacks. Our defensive backfield is horrible. They've been torched by every team we've played so far. Both of our starting corners were dismissed from the team this summer leaving us to play freshmen, a JUCO transfer and a senior coming back from an injury.

I know you guys aren't fans of the short passes but Bowling Green ran up and down the field on us by utilizing 3 step drops. They neutralized our pass rush by dinking and dunking us to death for most of the game. We'll be in for a long night if your line can give your QB time to throw Saturday night.


Man, everyone keeps playing awful football against Ohio State. If only someone would show up and not kill themselves against OSU.
That one crazy fan
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Posted: 9/24/2010 9:54 PM
Does anybody know what channel the game will be on?
Buckeye Rican
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Posted: 9/25/2010 7:37 AM
Mr. Mo Jo Risin wrote:expand_more
Marshall ranks 86th in rushing defense (Ohio ranks 71)
Marshall ranks 107th in passing defense (Ohio ranks 10)
Marshall ranks 110th in total defense (Ohio ranks 30)
Marshall ranks 109th in scoring defense (Ohio ranks 75)

Marshall ranks 92nd in rushing offense (Ohio ranks 97)
Marshall ranks 86th in passing offense (Ohio ranks 117)
Marshall ranks 95th in total offense (Ohio ranks 119)
Marshall ranks 101st in scoring offense (Ohio ranks 105) 

Marshall ranks 112th in turnover Margin (Ohio ranks 105)


Offensively it's basically a wash.  Both offensives have been anemic (with Marshall having the slight edge)
Defensively, Ohio utterly destroys them at stopping the pass and overall defense..

Ohio is consistently ranked in the top half of their conference in almost every stat.
Marshall is in the bottom half.  With Houston's QB injury double whammy, the MAC is by far a tougher conference than cUSA.


You make valid points but let me add to it as well. Ohio State currently has the #7 ranked defense in the nation. WVU has the #10 ranked defense in the nation. Ohio State has the #20 ranked offense in the nation and WVU's offense is ranked #26. Bowling Green's Passing Offense is ranked 29th in the nation. Our Strength of Schedule, according to Jeff Sagarin, is the 6th toughest schedule in the country after three weeks. As much as our offense has turned the ball over and as much yardage as our defense has allowed we're still two fumbles away from being 2-1 at this point.

Ohio also faced Ohio State but match ups with Wofford and Toledo result in a Strength of Schedule rating of #79. Am I saying SOS is indicative of how good either team is on any given day? No. I'm just giving some context to the ranking comparisons above.

From a Marshall standpoint we don't know what we have. We've been Jekyll and Hyde to this point so far. The roller coaster is killing me to be honest. We played horrible against OSU, played arguably the best  55 minutes of football against WVU than we've played since the late 90's, and then went into a buzz saw last week at BGSU hungover and unprepared and got our butts kicked. Consistent play, turnovers and the ability to close football games are our biggest weaknesses to this point.

I really don't know what to expect from Doc and company this Saturday. You guys might see all three QBs. Anderson is a true pocket passer. Sullivan is short and still a little rough around the edges but is quick and can keep plays alive with his feet. AJ gives us a strong arm and a zone read option. I figure we'll see a few of the true freshman wide receivers get some playing time this week too. We can't keep the same couple of guys out there all day running pass routes and not expect them to get tired, we need the depth there. You'll see Martin Ward and Andre Booker in the backfield. Unless something changes this week Ward probably won't carry the ball as often as he did in the Pizza Bowl. Our offensive line has given up one sack all season.

Defensively, Mario Harvey and Vinny Curry are tied for 7th in the nation with 4 sacks a piece. The Defense is tied with LSU, Arizona and NC State at #6 in the nation in sacks. Our defensive backfield is horrible. They've been torched by every team we've played so far. Both of our starting corners were dismissed from the team this summer leaving us to play freshmen, a JUCO transfer and a senior coming back from an injury.

I know you guys aren't fans of the short passes but Bowling Green ran up and down the field on us by utilizing 3 step drops. They neutralized our pass rush by dinking and dunking us to death for most of the game. We'll be in for a long night if your line can give your QB time to throw Saturday night.


Man, everyone keeps playing awful football against Ohio State. If only someone would show up and not kill themselves against OSU.


Well every team could be just playing awful against Ohio State.......or maybe Ohio State actually has a good defense?  We currently lead the nation in causing turnovers and were 2nd last year in turnovers.
Buckeye Rican
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Posted: 9/25/2010 7:46 AM
Ringo wrote:expand_more
Does anybody know what channel the game will be on?


WSAZ is carrying it. 
MUTeke
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Posted: 9/25/2010 8:08 AM
Buckeye Rican wrote:expand_more
Marshall ranks 86th in rushing defense (Ohio ranks 71)
Marshall ranks 107th in passing defense (Ohio ranks 10)
Marshall ranks 110th in total defense (Ohio ranks 30)
Marshall ranks 109th in scoring defense (Ohio ranks 75)

Marshall ranks 92nd in rushing offense (Ohio ranks 97)
Marshall ranks 86th in passing offense (Ohio ranks 117)
Marshall ranks 95th in total offense (Ohio ranks 119)
Marshall ranks 101st in scoring offense (Ohio ranks 105) 

Marshall ranks 112th in turnover Margin (Ohio ranks 105)


Offensively it's basically a wash.  Both offensives have been anemic (with Marshall having the slight edge)
Defensively, Ohio utterly destroys them at stopping the pass and overall defense..

Ohio is consistently ranked in the top half of their conference in almost every stat.
Marshall is in the bottom half.  With Houston's QB injury double whammy, the MAC is by far a tougher conference than cUSA.


You make valid points but let me add to it as well. Ohio State currently has the #7 ranked defense in the nation. WVU has the #10 ranked defense in the nation. Ohio State has the #20 ranked offense in the nation and WVU's offense is ranked #26. Bowling Green's Passing Offense is ranked 29th in the nation. Our Strength of Schedule, according to Jeff Sagarin, is the 6th toughest schedule in the country after three weeks. As much as our offense has turned the ball over and as much yardage as our defense has allowed we're still two fumbles away from being 2-1 at this point.

Ohio also faced Ohio State but match ups with Wofford and Toledo result in a Strength of Schedule rating of #79. Am I saying SOS is indicative of how good either team is on any given day? No. I'm just giving some context to the ranking comparisons above.

From a Marshall standpoint we don't know what we have. We've been Jekyll and Hyde to this point so far. The roller coaster is killing me to be honest. We played horrible against OSU, played arguably the best  55 minutes of football against WVU than we've played since the late 90's, and then went into a buzz saw last week at BGSU hungover and unprepared and got our butts kicked. Consistent play, turnovers and the ability to close football games are our biggest weaknesses to this point.

I really don't know what to expect from Doc and company this Saturday. You guys might see all three QBs. Anderson is a true pocket passer. Sullivan is short and still a little rough around the edges but is quick and can keep plays alive with his feet. AJ gives us a strong arm and a zone read option. I figure we'll see a few of the true freshman wide receivers get some playing time this week too. We can't keep the same couple of guys out there all day running pass routes and not expect them to get tired, we need the depth there. You'll see Martin Ward and Andre Booker in the backfield. Unless something changes this week Ward probably won't carry the ball as often as he did in the Pizza Bowl. Our offensive line has given up one sack all season.

Defensively, Mario Harvey and Vinny Curry are tied for 7th in the nation with 4 sacks a piece. The Defense is tied with LSU, Arizona and NC State at #6 in the nation in sacks. Our defensive backfield is horrible. They've been torched by every team we've played so far. Both of our starting corners were dismissed from the team this summer leaving us to play freshmen, a JUCO transfer and a senior coming back from an injury.

I know you guys aren't fans of the short passes but Bowling Green ran up and down the field on us by utilizing 3 step drops. They neutralized our pass rush by dinking and dunking us to death for most of the game. We'll be in for a long night if your line can give your QB time to throw Saturday night.


Man, everyone keeps playing awful football against Ohio State. If only someone would show up and not kill themselves against OSU.


Well every team could be just playing awful against Ohio State.......or maybe Ohio State actually has a good defense?  We currently lead the nation in causing turnovers and were 2nd last year in turnovers.


I would say that is the case. We didn't play horribly because we were THAT bad. The Buckeyes had a lot to do with that.
MUTeke
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Posted: 9/25/2010 8:12 AM
Buckeye Rican wrote:expand_more
Does anybody know what channel the game will be on?


WSAZ is carrying it. 


Herd All Access at Herdzone.com is live streaming it as well. Not sure if it's available to purchase on a game by game basis though. May have to buy a subscription then cancel it.

herdzone.cstv.com/allaccess/
Last Edited: 9/25/2010 8:13:21 AM by MUTeke
Dietz80
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Posted: 9/25/2010 7:03 PM
channelsurfing.net      has the game.
jsteggs
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Posted: 9/25/2010 7:17 PM
Also, nice note...the Ohio Athletics play-by-play on the internet is almost perfectly synced to the channelsurfing video. So if you wanna listen to Russ instead of the Blundering Turd announcers that's an option.
mf279801
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Posted: 9/25/2010 7:36 PM
Have we confirmed that Brian Knorr is not, in fact, calling the plays this season?
jsteggs
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Posted: 9/25/2010 7:39 PM
mf279801 wrote:expand_more
Have we confirmed that Brian Knorr is not, in fact, calling the plays this season?


Please God no.
EastTennesseeBobcat
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Posted: 9/25/2010 8:06 PM
Nice looking drive there.  Might of had 7 if Dovell hadn't dropped the WIDE open pass.  Weller is a beast.
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