Northwestern, because of their affiliation with the big 20, has a built-in cash stream that far exceeds the relative quality of their athletic programs. Their situation, even on a different scale, is nothing like ours.

What a blast down memory lane that was. Fifty years ago, those were "the schools". The only "football school" that I recall also being a credible academic institution was Michigan. Most of the others were just big state institutions with questionable academics. But, a lot can change in a generation. Football, and the general giving that goes along with it, is no doubt a part of the reason for the academic rise of the state schools. I'm sure that the ability of state schools to secure research funding is another part of it.

Regardless of how it has happened, it's clear that there has been a massive shift, and the list of Universities with the biggest endowments includes quite a lot of former "football schools", and the list of top academic universities does, as well.

As you are well aware, I assume, the US News Rankings have been under a lot of criticism by a number of academics for a number of years. The most recent was that several of the top law schools in the nation are now refusing to fill out their questionnaires. Though one story I read indicated that US News was hopeful that they would relent. Nonetheless, I take those rankings with a grain of salt.

I think you did miss my point a little. I'm not saying we should pay what Northwestern and Vanderbilt pay their football coaches. I'm saying relative to the MAC, what we pay a football coach should take into account we are one of the best academic instituions in the MAC, and at least pay as well as Northwestern does relative to the B1G.

I found this list from three years ago that appears more complete than the slightly more recent one I quoted earlier:

Jim Harbaugh, Michigan — $7.504
Jeff Brohm, Purdue — $6.6
James Franklin, Penn State — $5.65
Pat Fitzgerald, Northwestern — $5.145
Scott Frost, Nebraska — $5.0
Kirk Ferentz, Iowa — $4.8
Ryan Day, Ohio State — $4.5
Mark Dantonio, Michigan State — $4.399
Paul Chryst, Wisconsin — $4.15
Lovie Smith, Illinois – $4.0
P.J. Fleck, Minnesota — $3.6
Mike Locksley, Maryland — $2.5
*Chris Ash, Rutgers — $2.3
Tom Allen, Indiana — $1.805

Obviously these figures aren't accurate today, but the relative positions probably haven't changed a whole lot, with exception of Day, who the last I heard was paid more than Harbaugh. Put that being as it may, out of 14 schools, Northwestern was 4th. With the MAC having 12 schools, maybe a reasonable goal would be for OHIO to never be lower than 2nd or 3rd in the MAC salary ranks.

As an tangential point, addressing the original posters assertation about paying our football coach a dean's salary: The OHIO medical school dean if you add his clinic practice plan money to his base salary probably currently makes more than Albin. So, I might give some weight to the argument that we should pay our coach within 25 percent -- plus or minus -- of the medical school dean's total package.

Let me add that if you look you'll find data saying medical school deans in the U.S. average between $350,000 and $585,000. This is deceptive because this is only base salary. Almost every medical school dean makes a good deal more than these posted figures. For a state school one could find out the total package with an FOIA request, which I haven't done for OU-HCOM. I found one recent report that deans with practice plan oversight averaged about $1.5 million in total compensation. I can tell you from my years of working at the College of Osteopathic Medicine that our medical school dean's total package is considerably above the current published $360,853, perhaps double or more.

Edit: Let me add that a FOIA request for Ken Johnson's total salary might not be a simple one. The University would do its best to hid the practice plan money, and claim it wasn't public funds, which in one way it isn't. However, I'm confident that the Ohio legal system would not buy that argument -- just like the Ohio Supreme Court did not accept the claim a number of years ago by the University of Toledo Foundation that it was a private organization and not subject to the Toledo Blade's FOIA request.

You lost me. If Ohio pays as well as Northwestern does relative to the B1G, that would imply Ohio should be 3r or 4th in the MAC, not 2d. TA's career record against MAC foes is 10-7 if you include the MACC game loss. Thus, from a performance standpoint, he should be in the upper half as far as pay.

This is what I found on MAC coaches pay, compiles from a variety of sources, so it may not be accurate:

1. Candle, Toledo $1.1
2. Taylor, WMU $850k
3. McElwain, CMU $840k
4. Linguist, Buffalo $675k
5. Hammock, NIU $631k
6. Creighton, EMU $540k
7. Burns, Kent $540k
8. Martin, Miami $533k
9. Albin, Ohio $531k
10. Loeffler, BG $525k
11. Moorhead, Akron $500k
12. Neu, Ball State $453k

Current career Record of the various coaches versus MAC foes, with MACC games listed separately. For coaches with a long tenure, I also give the record for the last two years:
Candle 35-19 .648, 10-6 .625 last two years, 2-0 in championship games
Albin 10-6 .625, 0-1 in championship games
McElwain 18-12 .600, 9-7 .563 last two years, 0-1 in championship games
Martin 37-30 .552, 9-7 .563 last two years, 1-0 in championship games
Linguist 7-9 .436
Hammock 12-18 .400, 8-8 .500 last two years, 1-0 in championship games
Creighton 27-43 .386, 9-7 .563 last two years
Neu 20-34 .370, 7-9 .436 last two years, 1-0 in championship games
Loeffler 9-20 .310, 7-9 .436 last two years
Moorhead 1-7 .125
Taylor 0-0 .000
Burns 0-0 .000

Based on this, I see no reason not to bump Albin to $580k, which would keep him up with inflation, but also move him into the top half of the MAC salaries.

Albin at 531k plus some bonuses and other perks he likely gets from local businesses is a great package given our market and circumstances. I really don’t care where he ranks in the MAC. Also, it’s not a good example to the other faculty that a coach is the highest paid person, especially given our financial situation. I’m confident if he leaves we can get a good coach for that kind of money. I’d like him to stay, but not at any cost.

You didn't quote my whole post.

Yep, and that's still annoying.

I'm just giving OCF sh*t because he made a completely false accusation about something I'd said. I told him I'd make a $1000 donation to the charity of his choice to quote where I'd done so, and shared links to the conversations in question.

He didn't, and the thing he quoted in this thread reiterated the offer. He cut that out of the quote because he's been caught in a lie and won't admit it.

Actually, I cut that part out because I had no idea what your were talking about. I haven't visited that thread since my last post in it. I did a "Mark Forum Read" and continued on to other threads. As I said you know what you said about the Florida law restricting discussion of certain topics in the 3rd and younger grades. You know what kind of speech that was aimed at -- sex education, trangenderism, etc. You know you called me a hypocrite because I claimed to be a First Amendment absolutist but at the same time supported this law. You know that you would not give any credence to my argument that the fact children are in a captive environment in school (due to compulsory attendance laws) and that they are, in fact, children did not make this a deviation from strong First Amendment principles. When you tried to say that you didn't say these things you lost all remaining credibility with me. I had no further desire to discuss the matter with you.

It would be super easy to quote me, and worth $1000 to the charity of your choice. And while you "have no idea what I'm talking about" you quoted it and responded to it in the last thread.

It's not my lack of credibility that's on display here, my man. There's a record of our conversation and you could easily provide evidence of what you're saying. You're refusing to, despite the fact that it would be for a good cause. And now you're pretending you don't even know about the offer, despite replying to it last week.

There's no need to muddy another thread with this, but there's a conversation about this in 2 different places. If you decide to pick it up and can provide the evidence you say you can, I'm happy to hold up my end of the bargain.

Do you think it’s right for a school that doesn’t make money on athletics and has more than half of its budget come from student fees, have its coaches be the highest paid on campus?

I’m finding this back and forth and back and forth really enjoyable. But I’m stuck laughing out loud imagining the perks he might get from local businesses..

-Guac at Chipotle is not extra for TA
-50 cent beer night is half off for Coach
-Extra wienee at Larry’s Dog Shack on the house

Any others I’m missing?

In this case, consider "minimum wage" to refer to "minimum possible wage", though you might be surprised how much the annual pay would be even at the minimum legal wage, once you factor in the hours they put in. I would guess that would get you to $35-40k a year. In any case, yes, Ohio could decide that they won't pay over, say, $200k for a coach, and they can probably find a someone willing to take the job for that. For some high school coach, it would be a big step up in pay. Interestingly, though, no G5 school I am aware of has taken that approach. I wonder why not?

As far as those local perks for coaches, my impression is that they are often tied to promotions/advertising. For example, Danny Nee used to call plays on the court by signalling with his tie, and at Nebraska, worked out a deal with a menswear store allowing the store to sell "Danny Nee Ties", and other menswear, in return for which, Nee received a stipend of some kind for menswear.

Albin makes more than our president, who is at 489k. He is doing fine and if wants to go, fine.