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Topic: The War on Halftime Departures
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Paul Graham
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Posted: 10/3/2011 10:56 AM
bobcat695 wrote:expand_more
Ok, so what is your idea?


Maybe you could ask Rob Cornelius if he has any ideas. 



LOL! He's probably too busy organizing a town hall meeting on "Obamacare" at a local Denny's. :)
Paul Graham
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Posted: 10/3/2011 11:07 AM
Thanks for your responses everybody. A couple of things:

We are in the MAC and that isn't going to change. We need to figure out ways to get students to show up for Kent, Akron, Eastern, Buffalo, etc... We can't just throw our hands up and wait for another Pitt or UConn to show up. Look what that Marshall game did for our players, our recruiting, etc... The players feed off of that energy.

For my iphone/android app, I think the technology hurdles (jailbroken iphones, fake GPS coordinates, etc...) can easily be detected. You can probe the operating system and ensure that the phones are not jail broken. For instance, load program with a fake signature that would normally be rejected by the OS. If it's installed, then it's jailbroken and that user is disqualified.

JSF raised the point that not every student has a smart phone. That is true, but I don't think anyone would deny that within 5 years  almost everyone will have phones that can run 3'rd party mobile apps. So I still think it's a good idea.

If only we could sell beer. This would be a total non-issue. Instead, we'd be brainstorming how to keep students from streaking.
DayvidGallagher
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Posted: 10/3/2011 11:08 AM
giacomo wrote:expand_more
We've discussed this before many times. Most of the students don't think the MAC is that exciting and are going back somewhere to watch Ohio State, LSU, etc. on TV. If we had a higher caliber opponent come in to Peden, remember the PITT game a few years back, people stuck around.


I don't think it's fair to cite the Pitt game in concluding better opponents is the answer.  Granted they were preseason ranked that year, but when we played Uconn last year, another BE team, tons of people left at halftime, myself included. In fact, in my 5 years I never once stayed for an entire game.

That having been said here's why I left the ones that stand out in my head:

  vs. Gardner webb 2011 - Game was too late on a Saturday and my gf wanted to leave to make sure she had time to get dressed up and all that before going out to the bars.  Also, because of all the HS bands, we had to sit on the hill which was an awful experience.

  Homecoming 2009/2010 -  Had been drinking all morning, started sobering up at the game and didn't want that so we left

  MAC Divisional Championship game 2006 - Fell during finals week and was a night game so I couldn't commit 3 hours to a football game.  Not being able to commit the time was also something that came up a lot with all our Tuesday games.

In conclusion this is the best recipe for getting someone like myself to come and stay for a game:  Kick off between 2pm and 5pm on Saturday and have decent sideline seats available without great effort. Serving alcohol would also allow some flexibility in all that.

Those who leave to go watch OSU on TV are already lost souls and should just be forgotten
Ohio69
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Posted: 10/3/2011 12:29 PM
I think we overestimate the impact beer sales would have.  How many students are 21?  25% ?
The Optimist
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Posted: 10/3/2011 12:57 PM
Ohio69 wrote:expand_more
I think we overestimate the impact beer sales would have. How many students are 21? 25% ?
I'd say 50% of students in the bars Uptown at any given time are actually 21. I'm sure the lack of control athletics would have preventing underage drinking in Peden is part of administrators concerns preventing the allowance of alcohol. Make no mistake though, many students are leaving to drink... 21 or not.
Last Edited: 10/3/2011 12:58:06 PM by The Optimist
JSF
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Posted: 10/3/2011 1:11 PM
DayvidGallagher wrote:expand_more
We've discussed this before many times. Most of the students don't think the MAC is that exciting and are going back somewhere to watch Ohio State, LSU, etc. on TV. If we had a higher caliber opponent come in to Peden, remember the PITT game a few years back, people stuck around.


I don't think it's fair to cite the Pitt game in concluding better opponents is the answer.  Granted they were preseason ranked that year, but when we played Uconn last year, another BE team, tons of people left at halftime, myself included. In fact, in my 5 years I never once stayed for an entire game.


Your avatar is funny.
DelBobcat
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Posted: 10/3/2011 1:26 PM
Youngstown Bobcat wrote:expand_more
Kent sells alcohol as well. Is there an NCAA rule about the proximity of the stadium to the campus and alcohol sales at the stadium? I know Kent's stadium is a good distance from their campus. Don't know about UC.

Selling beer would definitely keep students around longer. But it has to be reasonably priced. I'm not going to pay $7 for a beer in the stadium when I can get the same thing Uptown for $2-3. 


Nippert Stadium is right in the heart of campus.
Brian Smith (No, not that one)
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Posted: 10/3/2011 1:37 PM
DelBobcat wrote:expand_more
Kent sells alcohol as well. Is there an NCAA rule about the proximity of the stadium to the campus and alcohol sales at the stadium? I know Kent's stadium is a good distance from their campus. Don't know about UC.

Selling beer would definitely keep students around longer. But it has to be reasonably priced. I'm not going to pay $7 for a beer in the stadium when I can get the same thing Uptown for $2-3. 


Nippert Stadium is right in the heart of campus.


You can't drink too much at UC games though. You really need the clarity of mind and sober dexterity to fend off the guy trying to steal your car after the game.

(Number of times on UC campus: 2. Number of times had car broken into: 1).
catfan70
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Posted: 10/3/2011 2:01 PM
Beer sales will never happen anywhere students have access to.  Could we see tower club, or touch down club sales someday? maybe, but OU hates the "party" school image, and would never run the risk of being seen as supporting an event that allowed under age students drinking.


As for gettin them to stay, good luck.  timing of the games is an issue, but it is mainly just having a good team people want to stay and watch. You also have to remember football is free for the students, so they have nothing invested in being there, so if something bettter to do is avail they will go.  half time/third quarter walk outs happen at all games at all levels if you have a blow out on either side. This year the tOSU thing seems to be less of an issue, it is so nice to hear a large cheer from the fans, when they anounced state was loosing.

But u also have to look at the scale of things at OU, the east side of the stadium is mostly students, so if 50- 80% leave you notice it. But at a tOSU game they have a lot lower ratio of students to paying fans, so if 50-80% of their students walk out, which they do if the game is a blow out. you don't notice the mass running for the gates like at Peden.
giacomo
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Posted: 10/3/2011 4:29 PM
Mr. Gallagher, your point is well taken. But I have to conclude that students at every university face the same dilemma that you do in dividing your time, including Notre Dame, the Big Ten, etc. I don't see the stadium emptying out at halftime at those games. Maybe part of it is that Peden is too close to the dorms and students haven't made a real time or cost commitment to attend a game. Do the students only have to show ID to get in?
Bobcat110alum
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Posted: 10/3/2011 4:35 PM
giacomo wrote:expand_more
Maybe part of it is that Peden is too close to the dorms and students haven't made a real time or cost commitment to attend a game. Do the students only have to show ID to get in?


Maybe the stadium being a longer distance away prevents these people from coming in the first place.  I'd rather have butts in seats during the first half, and have a good football game keep them there, than for them to not show up at all.

Here's an idea...hold a drawing at the end of the game...and the winner has to be there until the end of the game.  What does the winner get?  A free pass from OUPD when they knock on your door for a noise violation...
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 10/3/2011 4:39 PM
"Homecoming 2009/2010 -  Had been drinking all morning, started sobering up at the game and didn't want that so we left."

Dayvid, I appreciate you posting reasons you left; it helps us understand the issues better.  But, the reasoning I'm quoting above drives me crazy!

Don't mean to be pedantic, but it's sad when alcohol becomes such a controlling factor in peoples' lives.  That to me goes far beyond appropriate social drinking.  Sounds like addictive behavior.    

Have to think Giacomo makes a good point...you don't see this happening at BCS programs.  Perhaps half the students who attend just don't value MAC football.   

OTOH, thanks to the core group of students who do stay.
Brian Smith (No, not that one)
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Brian Smith (No, not that one)
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Posted: 10/3/2011 4:47 PM
Jeff McKinney wrote:expand_more
Don't mean to be pedantic, but it's sad when alcohol becomes such a controlling factor in peoples' lives.  That to me goes far beyond appropriate social drinking.  Sounds like addictive behavior.


May I suggest Ken Burns' first part of his three part prohibition series,  A Nation of Drunkards?

(Click the link to receive a free tote bag!)

Shameless PBS pimping is my game.
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 10/3/2011 4:51 PM
Don't want Prohibition.  Doesn't work.  

What...a person can't wait another hour and half to support your school at their football game because you're sobering up and "can't let that happen"?  Where are the priorities? 
Bobcatbob
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Posted: 10/3/2011 5:26 PM
Something that's given free has no value.  It can be wasted or disposed of without consequences.  If we were a BCS program or one that is modeled after a BCS program, those student seats would NOT be free. 

Therefore, they would have in them people who are themselves invested in the game.  Please don't tell me about the "activity fee", either.  I don't believe anyone equates that with sitting in a football stadium in the rain and wind when it's barely 50 degrees. 

Let's be honest.  I wasn't all that crazy about sitting out there Saturday and if my buddies and my girlfriend had been tugging on me to go to a bar, I would have hightailed it out of there, too.  Luckily, my wife is just as crazy as me so we stayed.
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 10/3/2011 5:36 PM
Bobcatbob wrote:expand_more
Something that's given free has no value.  It can be wasted or disposed of without consequences.  If we were a BCS program or one that is modeled after a BCS program, those student seats would NOT be free. 



You and a few other posters are making a very good point.  This could be a bigger factor than I had imagined. 
DayvidGallagher
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Posted: 10/3/2011 8:50 PM
Sorry to those who are upset at the reasons I posted. I guess what it all boils down to for me and the people I am with is that the football game is never THE thing to be doing, its just A thing to be doing. 

If I learned anything as an RA in the dorms its that college students are not motivated to actually show up and be engaged by prizes...of any kind.  We gave away a Wii as a raffle and only got about 7% of the students in the building to show up and most didn't do anything the whole time during the event.  So take all your ideas about raffles and drawings and contests and just forget them now.

Not that it matters but I don't think serving alcohol is the perfect answer either.  The focus needs to be on making the experience something cool that isn't just trying to turn it into a bar since students like bars. At its current entertainment value to me, if it were harder to get there or cost anything, I'd never be there in the first place.

I know I'm not doing a good job of suggesting solutions, but although I am a pretty rabid bball fan, when it comes to football I think I am like most of the student body as far as fandom so if nothing else I can let you know the things that wouldn't motivate me to stay.
Pataskala
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Posted: 10/3/2011 9:12 PM
If I had had to pay for a seat, I probably wouldn't have gone to half the games I did.  Free entertainment is still the best bargain.

And I don't think the stadium's location has much to do with it.  We walked from Lakeview (past the South Green) and didn't mind.

Start times may have a lot to do with it.  Back in the day when games started at 1:00 or 1:30, you could wake up at 11:00 after the Friday night party, grab a beer and banana for breakfast, go to the game, and be ready to party by 5:00.

If the location is a problem for some, offer free shuttle service before the game from South Green and College Green, with return service after the game.    Maybe more will stick around until the end. 

One of my favorite Yogi Berra sayings is, "If people don't want to come out, you can't stop 'em."  Well, maybe if people don't want to stay past halftime, you can't stop 'em.  There might not be a solution.
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Posted: 10/3/2011 9:47 PM
After reading all the posts I have to say that it's pretty easy to attend a Bobcat game if you're a student. Therefore, if the students don't attend or leave early, they must not care or don't like the product. Someone mentioned that at most places, the students make up a smaller percentage of the gate than at our games. If somebody travels and buys a ticket, they don't leave early. If you live at Boyd and get in free, no big deal to leave early or come late, or both. I think it's a combination of a small metro area, lack of name opponents on the schedule and student apathy. Even if we win, it's no fun to watch Gardner Webb and Eastern Michigan.
perimeterpost
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Posted: 10/3/2011 10:34 PM
OU students look at atheletics as a form of entertainment more so than as a commitment. Peden is like a house party, or a bar on Court Street, students will stay as long as they're having a good time, but if there's a better time to be had somewhere else, thats where they'll go. The score, the record and even the opponent aren't going to make much of a difference. Itss nothing personal.

Truth is, part of the appeal of going to a school like OU is that its not full of jock lovers like those in the Big 10 and SEC. Maybe my view is a little skewed because I was on campus during the Lichtenberg years but I think its going to take more than winning 8-9 games for a few season in a row to change a culture thats been around for decades.
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Posted: 10/3/2011 11:09 PM
I think there's a lot of truth in this thread, and the frank talk from DayvidGallagher is probably helpful for those of us who are long removed from our undergrad days. I think we forget what it was like to have a slew of friends, parties, and entertainment options on a Saturday. I get down to Athens a few weekends a year, and I always time my visits for athletic events. Of course I'm going to stay -- I don't have many other entertainment options. The game is a highlight of my visit, and I love it. But it wouldn't be if I was still a student. As a nostalgic grad, I wonder how these kids could miss the chance to savor the team, the 110 and what I think is a great atmosphere. Then I remember that I was just like them as a student. I'm honestly just glad to see students there and respectable numbers when I make it to games. We do better than when I was in school.

As to the people use the "basketball school" excuse, I think it's an apples/oranges comparison. Football games are much longer, exposed to the elements, and generally take place during a livelier time of year on cap. Crowding into the Convo on an icy February afternoon for a couple hours is probably a much easier sell than four hours of sitting on the bleachers on a warm sunny day in Athens.
Last Edited: 10/3/2011 11:10:07 PM by Recovering Journalist
PutnamField
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Posted: 10/3/2011 11:32 PM
Paul Graham wrote:expand_more
For my iphone/android app, I think the technology hurdles (jailbroken iphones, fake GPS coordinates, etc...) can easily be detected. You can probe the operating system and ensure that the phones are not jail broken. For instance, load program with a fake signature that would normally be rejected by the OS. If it's installed, then it's jailbroken and that user is disqualified.

JSF raised the point that not every student has a smart phone. That is true, but I don't think anyone would deny that within 5 years  almost everyone will have phones that can run 3'rd party mobile apps. So I still think it's a good idea.


Game experiences and other public events have already been diminished by the crowd frequently checking their digital devices and calling or texting people. I don't think you can effectively combat what is largely an attention-deficit and gadget-oversaturation problem by employing the most technological solution you can think of.

People used to leave OU football games early because the team wasn't good, and it became a peculiarity that people saw as an endearing badge of a college that had more important things to do. It carried over and got perpetuated by so many other games being televised and by people spontaneously organizing their whereabouts by mobile phone.

The University of Missouri's journalism school, which is supposedly one of the best in the country, recently tried to require its students to own a specific digital device (an i-pad or an i-phone, as I recall). I view this headlong rush toward every so-called communication innovation to be a poor substitute for older methods and perhaps even a distracting hindrance. It's a way of focusing on minutiae, and it doubles as a tracking and control grid.  

Don't feed the monster. Also, a heads-up you won't get too many places - microwave radiation can alter cellular DNA. It's called electrophoresis. 

I do think that there might be a creative, effective way to better retain butts in seats at Peden, but it would be less intrusive and annoying to swipe ID cards, and I'm not sure that having people "punch in" one way or another is a great approach. 
The Optimist
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Posted: 10/3/2011 11:55 PM
Students at Big 10 schools leave blowout games against lesser opponents all the time.  It happened when we visited OSU...
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 10/4/2011 12:05 AM
Not that anybody cares, but when I was an Ohio student -- back in the Dark Ages of the 1960s -- we went to the games and unless it was a real blowout stayed to the end.  We had enough self-restraint to wait until after the game to hit the Court Street bar scene.  Oh yes, a few enterprising students figured out ways to sneak booze into the stadium, but for the most part we went to football games to actually watch the game and to root for our school.  What a crazy, antiquated notion that seems to be. 
Last Edited: 10/4/2011 12:08:32 AM by OhioCatFan
DelBobcat
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Posted: 10/4/2011 12:58 AM
We could just give away $5,000....

http://www.bluehens.com/cockpit/
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