menu
Logo
Ohio Football Topic
Topic: Keller in trouble
Page: 2 of 3
C Money
General User
Member Since: 8/28/2010
Post Count: 3,420
mail
C Money
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 4:00 PM
Granted, I never did $91,000 of damage to anything, but thank God there weren't (a) cell phone cameras, (b) text messages, or (c) easily traceable debit cards back when I used to mix alcohol and stupid ideas on a somewhat frequent basis.
JSF
General User
Member Since: 1/29/2005
Location: Houston, TX
Post Count: 6,580
mail
JSF
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 4:21 PM
I'm in the "this is funny" camp.
mf279801
General User
M279801
Member Since: 8/6/2010
Location: Newark, DE
Post Count: 2,486
person
mail
mf279801
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 4:54 PM
C Money wrote:expand_more
Granted, I never did $91,000 of damage to anything, but thank God there weren't (a) cell phone cameras, (b) text messages, or (c) easily traceable debit cards back when I used to mix alcohol and stupid ideas on a somewhat frequent basis.


I've gotta think that cell phone cameras + youtube + a few of our Mod games would have gotten us in deeeeep trouble with ResLife, and none of that stuff came anywhere near $91,000 dollars.
L.C.
General User
LC
Member Since: 9/1/2005
Post Count: 10,584
person
mail
L.C.
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 6:37 PM
As I read through the pdf, it struck me as just something stupid they did. I am not left with the feeling that they set out to destroy the field, nor even that they had any clue they would do $91,000 damage. In an intoxicated state, it seemed like a fun thing to do, but in fact it ended up turning out very badly. Note that Keller, and prior to finding out how much trouble he was in, said "I feel really bad about the fence, too. I want to go fix it.", and they were hoping they hadn't caused any damage to the field.

In real life we all make choices - some turn out, some don't, and we have to live with the consequences.
Paul Graham
General User
Member Since: 1/18/2005
Location: The Plains, OH
Post Count: 1,424
mail
Paul Graham
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 6:53 PM
1.) Doing "donuts" (or whatever) on a VERY NICE baseball field is not a normal thing to do. 

2.) They did other damage, including some person's fence that they destroyed. Which is what one of them felt bad about.

3.) No reasonable person could have thought that you wouldn't do SIGNIFICANT damage to the field. Even in a highly intoxicated state.

4.) How intoxicated were they? They managed to drive over to Walmart to buy bolt cutters. They weren't blacked-out drunk.

Finally, how pathetic is this? The guy was a pre-med major, all-conference football player, etc... and now he's back in his hometown pulling pranks that are beneath a high schooler. It's just sad and lame. He's 24 years old for God's sake.


Doc Bobcat
General User
DB
Member Since: 12/20/2004
Post Count: 4,421
person
mail
Doc Bobcat
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 7:23 PM
Paul Graham wrote:expand_more
1.) Doing "donuts" (or whatever) on a VERY NICE baseball field is not a normal thing to do. 

2.) They did other damage, including some person's fence that they destroyed. Which is what one of them felt bad about.

3.) No reasonable person could have thought that you wouldn't do SIGNIFICANT damage to the field. Even in a highly intoxicated state.

4.) How intoxicated were they? They managed to drive over to Walmart to buy bolt cutters. They weren't blacked-out drunk.

Finally, how pathetic is this? The guy was a pre-med major, all-conference football player, etc... and now he's back in his hometown pulling pranks that are beneath a high schooler. It's just sad and lame. He's 24 years old for God's sake.




Well I may be the only one.... he needs of course to pay for his crime....but for me I was also really stupid when I was 24.
Pataskala
General User
P
Member Since: 7/8/2010
Location: At least six feet away from anybody else
Post Count: 9,465
person
mail
Pataskala
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 7:34 PM
Bcat2 wrote:expand_more
The crime itself isn't that disturbing.  It's not like he beat someone up or robbed someone or was dealing drugs.  He caused property damage that can (and will) be repaired, with the funds coming either from him and the others or  insurance.  He'll likely get probation plus community service if he pays for his share of the damage or minimal jail time if he doesn't.  And if he hasn't had any priors, he might not spend any time in jail.  It's a felony only because of the amount of damage.

The disturbing part is who did it.  He has better character than that.  Hope he gets straightened out.


So if you are rich enough to pay damages you can go around causing felony level damage to other's property and it is no big deal.  Sounds like you have experience with this.  How much and who paid, you or your parents?


I didn't say it's not a big deal.  It's a felony, which makes it a big deal because it may affect his future.  I said it was property damage instead of doing physical injury to someone else, which makes the act less disturbing.  It's stuff that can be repaired, either by him directly or through insurance, which would mean he and probably his folks would be sued over it.  But since he did something where the damage can be repaired, I'm more concerned about what's going on with him and how this might affect his future.
BillyTheCat
General User
BTC
Member Since: 10/6/2012
Post Count: 10,802
person
mail
BillyTheCat
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 8:37 PM
However we also have a case that could have led to bodily harm and or death. They were driving drunk, drunk enough that they thought this was funny. If anything they are lucky no lives were lost.
cc-cat
General User
C
Member Since: 4/5/2006
Location: matthews, NC
Post Count: 4,016
person
mail
cc-cat
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 9:52 PM
It is somewhat understandable to get drunk and do something stupid (e.g., drive by a ball field and say, "hey let's...")

It is another thing to not be able to do said stupid thing and then, go to a store, and buy bolt cutters so that you could return and do said stupid thing.

This starts to fall outside things you do at age 24.
C Money
General User
Member Since: 8/28/2010
Post Count: 3,420
mail
C Money
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 9:59 PM
cc cat wrote:expand_more
This starts to fall outside things you do at age 24.


24 is the new 14.
cc-cat
General User
C
Member Since: 4/5/2006
Location: matthews, NC
Post Count: 4,016
person
mail
cc-cat
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 10:31 PM
C Money wrote:expand_more
This starts to fall outside things you do at age 24.


24 is the new 14.


God help me - I have a 15-year-old!
OhioCatFan
General User
Member Since: 12/20/2004
Location: Athens, OH
Post Count: 15,699
mail
OhioCatFan
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 10:38 PM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
However we also have a case that could have led to bodily harm and or death. They were driving drunk, drunk enough that they thought this was funny. If anything they are lucky no lives were lost.


+100 -- This is exactly the point, that many here seem to be missing.  And, drinking generally doesn't make you do things you wouldn't want to do otherwise, it just removes some of the internal prohibitions that might keep you from doing the same dumb thing when sober.  This incident indicates the need for a lot of mental health therapy and/or pastoral counseling.  This is sick behavior by some sick people.  I met Keller once, after a defeat in the MACC, he seemed a rather reasonable young man at the time.  I saw his family too, and they all seemed like loving people.  Their son needs a lot of love right now as well as the aforementioned opportunity to get appropriate mental and spiritual help.
L.C.
General User
LC
Member Since: 9/1/2005
Post Count: 10,584
person
mail
L.C.
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 10:41 PM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
However we also have a case that could have led to bodily harm and or death. They were driving drunk, drunk enough that they thought this was funny. If anything they are lucky no lives were lost.

Exactly. Perhaps they can't charge them since they have no test that shows their exact level, but i'm fairly sure that whoever was driving was well over the limit. Drunk driving is a serious offense, and could have led to other very, very serious consequences. I hope that whatever plea bargain they end up with includes some punishment for this, too.

No one here is saying that these kids shouldn't be indicted, convicted, and punished. Obviously it was a stupid thing to do. Obviously they are going to have to pay for it. I would guess that besides paying for it, they will have to do some community service, and repairing the fence will be the least of it.. I would also guess they learned a lesson from it. I don't think that they will likely ever do anything like this again. On the other hand, I think that even having done this, they can still turn out to be useful members of society. So, I say, let the legal system work. That's what it's there for.
Mike Johnson
General User
Member Since: 11/11/2004
Location: North Canton, OH
Post Count: 1,756
mail
Mike Johnson
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 11:11 PM
Doc Bobcat wrote:expand_more
1.) Doing "donuts" (or whatever) on a VERY NICE baseball field is not a normal thing to do. 

2.) They did other damage, including some person's fence that they destroyed. Which is what one of them felt bad about.

3.) No reasonable person could have thought that you wouldn't do SIGNIFICANT damage to the field. Even in a highly intoxicated state.

4.) How intoxicated were they? They managed to drive over to Walmart to buy bolt cutters. They weren't blacked-out drunk.

Finally, how pathetic is this? The guy was a pre-med major, all-conference football player, etc... and now he's back in his hometown pulling pranks that are beneath a high schooler. It's just sad and lame. He's 24 years old for God's sake.




Well I may be the only one.... he needs of course to pay for his crime....but for me I was also really stupid when I was 24.


Doc/Larry, what I'm about to say I do not mean as flippant, caustic or demeaning.  At 24 I was soldiering in Korea.  It wasn't fun, but it was maturing.  Those experiences are why I believe it would benefit our nation if EVERY young man and woman was obligated to perform some kind of national service - either military or civilian.  Few experiences speed maturation like having to work - and succeed - to someone else's high standards with no excuses accepted.  Okay, I'll climb down from the soapbox.
perimeterpost
General User
Member Since: 7/6/2010
Post Count: 3,165
mail
perimeterpost
mail
Posted: 12/12/2012 11:36 PM
at 24 if I was stuck in Nowheresville Nebraska I wouldn't need to be hammer drunk to be talked into to doing donuts with Jerry Sandusky on Halloween.
mf279801
General User
M279801
Member Since: 8/6/2010
Location: Newark, DE
Post Count: 2,486
person
mail
mf279801
mail
Posted: 12/13/2012 12:06 AM
Mike Johnson wrote:expand_more
1.) Doing "donuts" (or whatever) on a VERY NICE baseball field is not a normal thing to do. 

2.) They did other damage, including some person's fence that they destroyed. Which is what one of them felt bad about.

3.) No reasonable person could have thought that you wouldn't do SIGNIFICANT damage to the field. Even in a highly intoxicated state.

4.) How intoxicated were they? They managed to drive over to Walmart to buy bolt cutters. They weren't blacked-out drunk.

Finally, how pathetic is this? The guy was a pre-med major, all-conference football player, etc... and now he's back in his hometown pulling pranks that are beneath a high schooler. It's just sad and lame. He's 24 years old for God's sake.




Well I may be the only one.... he needs of course to pay for his crime....but for me I was also really stupid when I was 24.


Doc/Larry, what I'm about to say I do not mean as flippant, caustic or demeaning.  At 24 I was soldiering in Korea.  It wasn't fun, but it was maturing.  Those experiences are why I believe it would benefit our nation if EVERY young man and woman was obligated to perform some kind of national service - either military or civilian.  Few experiences speed maturation like having to work - and succeed - to someone else's high standards with no excuses accepted.  Okay, I'll climb down from the soapbox.


Nope, I'm adamantly, 100% opposed to compulsory civilian national service. Without question. Its wrong morally (slavery anyone?), I don't think it would be at all effective in its output/work product (I can imagine several ways to apply the simple version of Gresham's Law to this), I don't think it would do anything to "mature" young adults to any sort of standards, and it invites rampant governmental expansion both in terms of mission creep and featherbedding ("All of those 'volunteers' need supervisors, don't they?"). For the record, I'm less opposed to universal military service (e.g. of a Swiss or Israeli model), but I still think its generally a poor idea for reasons of effectiveness and budget, Civil War/WWI/WWII type situations excepted.
Last Edited: 12/13/2012 12:06:46 AM by mf279801
MonroeClassmate
General User
MC
Member Since: 8/31/2010
Post Count: 2,325
person
mail
MonroeClassmate
mail
Posted: 12/13/2012 7:57 PM
Buster wrote:expand_more
I blame concussions for this.


Nah, most likely the tatoos.
Cats-22
General User
C22
Member Since: 9/30/2006
Post Count: 370
person
mail
Cats-22
mail
Posted: 12/13/2012 8:54 PM
perimeterpost wrote:expand_more
at 24 if I was stuck in Nowheresville Nebraska I wouldn't need to be hammer drunk to be talked into to doing donuts with Jerry Sandusky on Halloween.


Yeah.  I think if drunk driving was really involved here that does make it a much worse crime.  But I'm not convinced the driver in particular was above the legal limit.  Alcohol isn't strictly required for stupid behavior, it just makes it much easier.
Doc Bobcat
General User
DB
Member Since: 12/20/2004
Post Count: 4,421
person
mail
Doc Bobcat
mail
Posted: 12/13/2012 9:40 PM
Mike Johnson wrote:expand_more
1.) Doing "donuts" (or whatever) on a VERY NICE baseball field is not a normal thing to do. 

2.) They did other damage, including some person's fence that they destroyed. Which is what one of them felt bad about.

3.) No reasonable person could have thought that you wouldn't do SIGNIFICANT damage to the field. Even in a highly intoxicated state.

4.) How intoxicated were they? They managed to drive over to Walmart to buy bolt cutters. They weren't blacked-out drunk.

Finally, how pathetic is this? The guy was a pre-med major, all-conference football player, etc... and now he's back in his hometown pulling pranks that are beneath a high schooler. It's just sad and lame. He's 24 years old for God's sake.




Well I may be the only one.... he needs of course to pay for his crime....but for me I was also really stupid when I was 24.


Doc/Larry, what I'm about to say I do not mean as flippant, caustic or demeaning.  At 24 I was soldiering in Korea.  It wasn't fun, but it was maturing.  Those experiences are why I believe it would benefit our nation if EVERY young man and woman was obligated to perform some kind of national service - either military or civilian.  Few experiences speed maturation like having to work - and succeed - to someone else's high standards with no excuses accepted.  Okay, I'll climb down from the soapbox.


And I applaud you.... my  youngest son was fixing B-1 bombers that flew to Afghanistan when he was 24 and my eldest son died at 19 when a 23 year old decided speeding around a curve at about 60 was a wise choice.

My stupidity remardk were just about my own....and it dealt with interpersonal relationships....not donuts and damage and alcohol....and I agree with your national service idea.

Alan Swank
General User
AS
Member Since: 12/12/2004
Location: Athens, OH
Post Count: 7,375
person
mail
Alan Swank
mail
Posted: 12/13/2012 10:18 PM
mf279801 wrote:expand_more
1.) Doing "donuts" (or whatever) on a VERY NICE baseball field is not a normal thing to do. 

2.) They did other damage, including some person's fence that they destroyed. Which is what one of them felt bad about.

3.) No reasonable person could have thought that you wouldn't do SIGNIFICANT damage to the field. Even in a highly intoxicated state.

4.) How intoxicated were they? They managed to drive over to Walmart to buy bolt cutters. They weren't blacked-out drunk.

Finally, how pathetic is this? The guy was a pre-med major, all-conference football player, etc... and now he's back in his hometown pulling pranks that are beneath a high schooler. It's just sad and lame. He's 24 years old for God's sake.




Well I may be the only one.... he needs of course to pay for his crime....but for me I was also really stupid when I was 24.


Doc/Larry, what I'm about to say I do not mean as flippant, caustic or demeaning.  At 24 I was soldiering in Korea.  It wasn't fun, but it was maturing.  Those experiences are why I believe it would benefit our nation if EVERY young man and woman was obligated to perform some kind of national service - either military or civilian.  Few experiences speed maturation like having to work - and succeed - to someone else's high standards with no excuses accepted.  Okay, I'll climb down from the soapbox.


Nope, I'm adamantly, 100% opposed to compulsory civilian national service. Without question. Its wrong morally (slavery anyone?), I don't think it would be at all effective in its output/work product (I can imagine several ways to apply the simple version of Gresham's Law to this), I don't think it would do anything to "mature" young adults to any sort of standards, and it invites rampant governmental expansion both in terms of mission creep and featherbedding ("All of those 'volunteers' need supervisors, don't they?"). For the record, I'm less opposed to universal military service (e.g. of a Swiss or Israeli model), but I still think its generally a poor idea for reasons of effectiveness and budget, Civil War/WWI/WWII type situations excepted.


Have to differ with you on this one.  My wife has been saying this for years.   Many if not most 18 year olds who go to college aren't ready to benefit from what college is supposed to be about.  It's taken me some time but I now agree with her.  In my job, I deal with high school seniors in many states on a daily basis and many if not most aren't ready for what a college education is suppose to be about.   Call it what you want but it certainly isn't government expansion.  It's common sense based on what we have in America today.  Go help your neighbor and if you find that higher education is for you, then enroll.  My bet is that you will be much better prepared for school than the typical kid coming out of high school today plus the world we be a better place based on the service that you provide to your neighbor an mine for the two years you serve after high school.
The Optimist
General User
Member Since: 3/16/2007
Location: CLE
Post Count: 5,611
mail
The Optimist
mail
Posted: 12/13/2012 11:34 PM
I'm not going to speculate on whether kids 40 years ago were driving their trucks onto baseball fields doing cookies, but I will speculate that they probably weren't getting caught if they were.  The clear devil here are these phone letters and those youtubes.  They are the real problem with kids today.
Mike Johnson
General User
Member Since: 11/11/2004
Location: North Canton, OH
Post Count: 1,756
mail
Mike Johnson
mail
Posted: 12/13/2012 11:38 PM
mf279801 wrote:expand_more
1.) Doing "donuts" (or whatever) on a VERY NICE baseball field is not a normal thing to do. 

2.) They did other damage, including some person's fence that they destroyed. Which is what one of them felt bad about.

3.) No reasonable person could have thought that you wouldn't do SIGNIFICANT damage to the field. Even in a highly intoxicated state.

4.) How intoxicated were they? They managed to drive over to Walmart to buy bolt cutters. They weren't blacked-out drunk.

Finally, how pathetic is this? The guy was a pre-med major, all-conference football player, etc... and now he's back in his hometown pulling pranks that are beneath a high schooler. It's just sad and lame. He's 24 years old for God's sake.




Well I may be the only one.... he needs of course to pay for his crime....but for me I was also really stupid when I was 24.


Doc/Larry, what I'm about to say I do not mean as flippant, caustic or demeaning.  At 24 I was soldiering in Korea.  It wasn't fun, but it was maturing.  Those experiences are why I believe it would benefit our nation if EVERY young man and woman was obligated to perform some kind of national service - either military or civilian.  Few experiences speed maturation like having to work - and succeed - to someone else's high standards with no excuses accepted.  Okay, I'll climb down from the soapbox.


Nope, I'm adamantly, 100% opposed to compulsory civilian national service. Without question. Its wrong morally (slavery anyone?), I don't think it would be at all effective in its output/work product (I can imagine several ways to apply the simple version of Gresham's Law to this), I don't think it would do anything to "mature" young adults to any sort of standards, and it invites rampant governmental expansion both in terms of mission creep and featherbedding ("All of those 'volunteers' need supervisors, don't they?"). For the record, I'm less opposed to universal military service (e.g. of a Swiss or Israeli model), but I still think its generally a poor idea for reasons of effectiveness and budget, Civil War/WWI/WWII type situations excepted.


We disagree in part, but I respect your thinking. 

You can add Singapore and Korea to nations with compulsory military service. 
Jeff McKinney
Moderator
JM
Member Since: 11/12/2004
Post Count: 6,163
person
mail
Jeff McKinney
mail
Posted: 12/14/2012 9:53 AM
Mike Johnson wrote:expand_more
1.) Doing "donuts" (or whatever) on a VERY NICE baseball field is not a normal thing to do. 

2.) They did other damage, including some person's fence that they destroyed. Which is what one of them felt bad about.

3.) No reasonable person could have thought that you wouldn't do SIGNIFICANT damage to the field. Even in a highly intoxicated state.

4.) How intoxicated were they? They managed to drive over to Walmart to buy bolt cutters. They weren't blacked-out drunk.

Finally, how pathetic is this? The guy was a pre-med major, all-conference football player, etc... and now he's back in his hometown pulling pranks that are beneath a high schooler. It's just sad and lame. He's 24 years old for God's sake.




Well I may be the only one.... he needs of course to pay for his crime....but for me I was also really stupid when I was 24.


Doc/Larry, what I'm about to say I do not mean as flippant, caustic or demeaning.  At 24 I was soldiering in Korea.  It wasn't fun, but it was maturing.  Those experiences are why I believe it would benefit our nation if EVERY young man and woman was obligated to perform some kind of national service - either military or civilian.  Few experiences speed maturation like having to work - and succeed - to someone else's high standards with no excuses accepted.  Okay, I'll climb down from the soapbox.


Agree, Mike. 
Robert Fox
General User
RF
Member Since: 11/17/2004
Location: Knoxville, TN
Post Count: 2,039
person
mail
Robert Fox
mail
Posted: 12/14/2012 9:53 AM
Doc Bobcat wrote:expand_more
my eldest son died at 19 when a 23 year old decided speeding around a curve at about 60 was a wise choice.


Very hard to imagine. What a horrible tragedy. I have no fear bigger than that. Sorry to hear it.
Jeff McKinney
Moderator
JM
Member Since: 11/12/2004
Post Count: 6,163
person
mail
Jeff McKinney
mail
Posted: 12/14/2012 9:56 AM
Alan Swank wrote:expand_more
1.) Doing "donuts" (or whatever) on a VERY NICE baseball field is not a normal thing to do. 

2.) They did other damage, including some person's fence that they destroyed. Which is what one of them felt bad about.

3.) No reasonable person could have thought that you wouldn't do SIGNIFICANT damage to the field. Even in a highly intoxicated state.

4.) How intoxicated were they? They managed to drive over to Walmart to buy bolt cutters. They weren't blacked-out drunk.

Finally, how pathetic is this? The guy was a pre-med major, all-conference football player, etc... and now he's back in his hometown pulling pranks that are beneath a high schooler. It's just sad and lame. He's 24 years old for God's sake.




Well I may be the only one.... he needs of course to pay for his crime....but for me I was also really stupid when I was 24.


Doc/Larry, what I'm about to say I do not mean as flippant, caustic or demeaning.  At 24 I was soldiering in Korea.  It wasn't fun, but it was maturing.  Those experiences are why I believe it would benefit our nation if EVERY young man and woman was obligated to perform some kind of national service - either military or civilian.  Few experiences speed maturation like having to work - and succeed - to someone else's high standards with no excuses accepted.  Okay, I'll climb down from the soapbox.


Nope, I'm adamantly, 100% opposed to compulsory civilian national service. Without question. Its wrong morally (slavery anyone?), I don't think it would be at all effective in its output/work product (I can imagine several ways to apply the simple version of Gresham's Law to this), I don't think it would do anything to "mature" young adults to any sort of standards, and it invites rampant governmental expansion both in terms of mission creep and featherbedding ("All of those 'volunteers' need supervisors, don't they?"). For the record, I'm less opposed to universal military service (e.g. of a Swiss or Israeli model), but I still think its generally a poor idea for reasons of effectiveness and budget, Civil War/WWI/WWII type situations excepted.


Have to differ with you on this one.  My wife has been saying this for years.   Many if not most 18 year olds who go to college aren't ready to benefit from what college is supposed to be about.  It's taken me some time but I now agree with her.  In my job, I deal with high school seniors in many states on a daily basis and many if not most aren't ready for what a college education is suppose to be about.   Call it what you want but it certainly isn't government expansion.  It's common sense based on what we have in America today.  Go help your neighbor and if you find that higher education is for you, then enroll.  My bet is that you will be much better prepared for school than the typical kid coming out of high school today plus the world we be a better place based on the service that you provide to your neighbor an mine for the two years you serve after high school.


Completely agree with you, Alan.
Showing Messages: 26 - 50 of 63
MAC News Links



extra small (< 576px)
small (>= 576px)
medium (>= 768px)
large (>= 992px)
x-large (>= 1200px)
xx-large (>= 1400px)