Ohio Football Topic
Topic: So who are you firing this weekend?
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C Money
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Posted: 11/12/2013 11:30 PM
Bobcat Grad 86
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Posted: 11/13/2013 7:25 AM
bn9 wrote:expand_more
My choice for the weekly firing is whoever is in charge of the stadium music.  The pregame music was absolutely horrid - bad 80s hair band stuff that no one had ever heard before and never wants to hear again.  And then there really wasn't an entrance song for the team.  I loved the Kanye West "Power" entrance song.  Seemed to get the crowd pumped.  Last night the team just ran into the stadium randomly during a Kip Winger track.  Difficult to get pumped up for that.  Awful.  


That is my only gripe.  Other than that, great day in Athens.  Weather was perfect, great student turnout and participation, a win and even saw Frankie Muniz from Malcolm in the Middle randomly walking outside of Jackie O's.  Very weird. 


I think the timing was off due to the kids forming the tunnel.  Took a little longer that they thought to get it organized.  Plus, there was a slight delay when Rufus couldn't get the motorcycle going.

On a side note, I thought it was great that they let the kids on the field to form the tunnel.  My son who is almost five was absolutely thrilled to be able to do that.


Reminded me of an entrance that reflects their football team:  http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=cavalier+falls+off+horse&FORM=HDRSC3#view=detail&mid=76B116047F122F28440A76B116047F122F28440A
JHSbobcat08
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Posted: 11/13/2013 6:46 PM
In all seriousness, Albin and Burrows. And I can not believe that I thought this last night, but now I know why Nebraska dumped Frank. He has gotten us to a point of where we expect to win, and win often. But it seems that he cannot get us to the next step. I hate thinking and typing these things out, but it appears true to me. We cannot get to the next step in our programs progression.
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Posted: 11/13/2013 10:17 PM
JHSbobcat08 wrote:expand_more
In all seriousness, Albin and Burrows. And I can not believe that I thought this last night, but now I know why Nebraska dumped Frank. He has gotten us to a point of where we expect to win, and win often. But it seems that he cannot get us to the next step. I hate thinking and typing these things out, but it appears true to me. We cannot get to the next step in our programs progression.

I do not agree with this.  The Bobcats should have won the MACC in 2011.  In the second half it is likely that had one of these players made just one of these four plays and the Bobcats would have eeked out a victory against a solid opponent. 
1. LaVon didn't come up with the catch in the endzone
2. Believe it was Carpenter didn't come up with the easy pick which with his speed may have been a picsix.
3. Tettleton making an easy first down pass on one particular drive that the receiver was open but the ball sailed away. Make the first down and kill another two minutes or time outs that were needed.
4.  The punter not having the worst shank of his season.

The coaches can help get them there but they cannot make the plays for the players.  It is on their shoulders.

In 2008 the Bobcats may have upset the hated Buckeyes had two players made simple plays.  Field a punt and not let it turn into a quick score for the Bucks.  And Boo scrambles and finds a receiver streaking past all defenders for a sure 6 but the ball hit him in the hands--you know a very bad spot.  Players make those two plays and one of the earlier four and Solich fans would be everywhere.

BUT I'm not defending what's going on now.  I'm just saying that he helped get them in a position to win the Championship and win a HUGE game.  FS has also taken a program a long way from where it once was and not that long ago.  Perhaps it is time for FS to take a pilgrimage around to another program, check it out and bring back some needed strategic changes in play style and coaching personnel.

 
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 11/13/2013 10:35 PM
MonroeClassmate wrote:expand_more
 . . . Perhaps it is time for FS to take a pilgrimage around to another program, check it out and bring back some needed strategic changes in play style and coaching personnel.  


This would be very Frank like.  He did this before he took the OHIO job.  Then innovated again after the Troy bowl loss.  Us vintage 1944 guys are nothing if we're not innovative and forward thinking.  It's those baby boomers that you've got to watch out for! 
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 11/14/2013 12:17 AM
I"m of the opinion that we lost the 2011 MAC title game because we got up big and got incredibly conservative on offense.

A lack of imagination and thinking similar to what we have seen most of this season.

I think a pretty good % of posters share this point of view--mostly coaching, not players then and now.
Robert Fox
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Posted: 11/14/2013 8:13 AM
MonroeClassmate wrote:expand_more
In all seriousness, Albin and Burrows. And I can not believe that I thought this last night, but now I know why Nebraska dumped Frank. He has gotten us to a point of where we expect to win, and win often. But it seems that he cannot get us to the next step. I hate thinking and typing these things out, but it appears true to me. We cannot get to the next step in our programs progression.

I do not agree with this.  The Bobcats should have won the MACC in 2011.  In the second half it is likely that had one of these players made just one of these four plays and the Bobcats would have eeked out a victory against a solid opponent. 
1. LaVon didn't come up with the catch in the endzone
2. Believe it was Carpenter didn't come up with the easy pick which with his speed may have been a picsix.
3. Tettleton making an easy first down pass on one particular drive that the receiver was open but the ball sailed away. Make the first down and kill another two minutes or time outs that were needed.
4.  The punter not having the worst shank of his season.

The coaches can help get them there but they cannot make the plays for the players.  It is on their shoulders.

In 2008 the Bobcats may have upset the hated Buckeyes had two players made simple plays.  Field a punt and not let it turn into a quick score for the Bucks.  And Boo scrambles and finds a receiver streaking past all defenders for a sure 6 but the ball hit him in the hands--you know a very bad spot.  Players make those two plays and one of the earlier four and Solich fans would be everywhere.

BUT I'm not defending what's going on now.  I'm just saying that he helped get them in a position to win the Championship and win a HUGE game.  FS has also taken a program a long way from where it once was and not that long ago.  Perhaps it is time for FS to take a pilgrimage around to another program, check it out and bring back some needed strategic changes in play style and coaching personnel.

 


Very well said!
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Posted: 11/14/2013 12:50 PM
JHSbobcat08 wrote:expand_more
In all seriousness, Albin and Burrows. And I can not believe that I thought this last night, but now I know why Nebraska dumped Frank. He has gotten us to a point of where we expect to win, and win often. But it seems that he cannot get us to the next step. I hate thinking and typing these things out, but it appears true to me. We cannot get to the next step in our programs progression.

Actually this was not the reason why Nebraska fired Solich. There are far more differences than similarities in the situation. Some differences:
1. At Nebraska, they had a long time tradition of winning, and when he took over, they were coming off on National Championships, and had great athletes on the team. Solich had no reputation to recruits, and was an unknown, so there was an immediate drop in the quality of recruits, and then a slow recovery after that, but that meant that 4-5 years down the road, teams steadily got worse as Solich recruits worked into the system. At the point he was fired, it was near a bottom, with only Solich recruits, and from there should have improved.

At Ohio they were coming off a losing tradition, and recruiting had not been very good. Knorr had recruited a few great players, like Muncy, Cohen, and McRae, but many of his recruits never played, so there was little depth. At Ohio, therefore, most of the initial teams (2004-2008) were not that great, but steadily improved as Solich recruits worked into the system.

2. At Nebraska most Solich assistant coaches were holdovers from Osborne, and were older. As they retired, there was a transition that was not always smooth. On bump along the way was that he hired a new defensive coordinator who, while capable, had some personal issues, and had to be replaced after a year. The replacement, Bo Pelini, everyone knows. His first try, Craig Bohl, has demonstrated in the years since then that he was a good coach, too, with what he has done at N. Dakota State. At the other extreme, at Ohio he has had essentially the same staff with only minor changes from day one.

3. At Nebraska a new AD had some very different attitudes from the Ohio AD.

4. At Nebraska, under Solich, there were some very high highs, as well as low lows. He did, after all, get to a National Championship game.  At Ohio he's won some big games (Pitt, Illinois, Penn State), but lost some games badly (Loisville, BG, Buffalo this year).  It's been a lot of highs and lows. Right now is a low time, after two miserable losses.

Thus, I don't see the situations as very similar at all. Still, the question is the same. Should Solich retire? Should he be asked to retire? Those are questions I can't go into. It's up to Solich to decide if he wants to retire, and up to Ohio fans and the Ohio AD to decide if they want to ask him to retire.

As for your other question, whether Ohio had plateaued, I think I'll make a separate thread.
Casper71
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Posted: 11/14/2013 1:01 PM
The program is where it is now after 9 years with a pretty stable staff?  What makes you think the next 9 would be any different?
Mike Johnson
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Posted: 11/14/2013 3:18 PM
If memory is serving well, Coach Solich signed a 5-year extension within recent months...

Here is something that I find interesting.  After being fired at NE, Solich spent a year visiting other programs - college and NFL.  That's pretty strong evidence that he was eager to observe and learn and perhaps alter his thinking.

After the debacle against Troy, he again demonstrated an ability to initiate significant change.

I now find puzzling his apparent reluctance to initiate change when it is so clearly needed. 
L.C.
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Posted: 11/14/2013 4:33 PM
Mike Johnson wrote:expand_more
If memory is serving well, Coach Solich signed a 5-year extension within recent months...

Here is something that I find interesting.  After being fired at NE, Solich spent a year visiting other programs - college and NFL.  That's pretty strong evidence that he was eager to observe and learn and perhaps alter his thinking.

After the debacle against Troy, he again demonstrated an ability to initiate significant change.

I now find puzzling his apparent reluctance to initiate change when it is so clearly needed. 

He also made some dramatic changes after his bad 2002 season at Nebraska, hiring a new offensive and defensive coordinator.

I would say that, if he things changes are in order, he'll make changes now, too. If he does make them, it will most likely be after the season, however. Lineup changes between now and Kent wouldn't surprise me, but coaching changes would.
Last Edited: 11/14/2013 5:32:57 PM by L.C.
L.C.
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Posted: 11/14/2013 4:43 PM
Duplicate post deleted.
Last Edited: 11/14/2013 5:33:18 PM by L.C.
Bcat2
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Posted: 11/14/2013 5:56 PM
Mike Johnson wrote:expand_more
If memory is serving well, Coach Solich signed a 5-year extension within recent months...

Here is something that I find interesting.  After being fired at NE, Solich spent a year visiting other programs - college and NFL.  That's pretty strong evidence that he was eager to observe and learn and perhaps alter his thinking.

After the debacle against Troy, he again demonstrated an ability to initiate significant change.

I now find puzzling his apparent reluctance to initiate change when it is so clearly needed. 


Sir, you seem to be expecting dramatic scheme changes mid game. Well I don't believe it works that way.  Let us see how this shakes out and what coach Solich does at the end of the season.  Ohio fans are posting like OSU or Nebraska fans.
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 11/14/2013 9:40 PM
This has nothing to do with other schools or their fans.  We're posting out of justifiable anger after the last two blowouts in key games.

Just should not have happened.

Saying that we're behaving like fans of other teams strikes me as an absolute failure to face obvious reality and to put responsibility where it belongs.


You can't ALWAYS credit the players and coaches yet never assign the least bit of blame to them.
Last Edited: 11/14/2013 9:41:29 PM by Monroe Slavin
Mike Johnson
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Posted: 11/14/2013 11:34 PM
Bcat2 wrote:expand_more
If memory is serving well, Coach Solich signed a 5-year extension within recent months...

Here is something that I find interesting.  After being fired at NE, Solich spent a year visiting other programs - college and NFL.  That's pretty strong evidence that he was eager to observe and learn and perhaps alter his thinking.

After the debacle against Troy, he again demonstrated an ability to initiate significant change.

I now find puzzling his apparent reluctance to initiate change when it is so clearly needed. 


Sir, you seem to be expecting dramatic scheme changes mid game. Well I don't believe it works that way.  Let us see how this shakes out and what coach Solich does at the end of the season.  Ohio fans are posting like OSU or Nebraska fans.


Perhaps the changes I have in mind you would deem dramatic.  Here are things I'd like to see happen - or learn later that they happened:
* Coach Solich, Coach Albin and TT sit down together and have an unhurried, mutually respectful, air-clearing conversation.  From such a conversation comes agreement that TT  will run more OR that TT won't run more and that Vick will get more snaps.  Vick is immediately informed of the outcome of said conversation. 
* Next comes meetings with Coach  Solich and the various units.  He asks who wants to play their hearts out against Kent and who doesn't.  Those who are "brave" enough to say they  aren't ready or willing are told they will sit. 
* Coach Solich and his assistants agree that, at the first sign of a lack of acceptable effort by any Ohio player in the Kent game, said player will be pulled and told to sit for the duration.  The players are so informed. 

Will such discussions take place?  Next Tuesday should provide ample evidence.

A closing comment: If Coaches Solich and Albin agree that they don't want either QB to run more, I just might find it easy to decide not to drive to Athens the day after Thanksgiving.
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Posted: 11/14/2013 11:44 PM
Bcat2 wrote:expand_more
Ohio fans are posting like OSU or Nebraska fans.


Screw you, dude. Where do you get off posting crap like this? I'm sorry those of us outside the Cult of Frank Solich don't blindly love everything the man does. Even though I'm not a fan of football, I respect my fellow Bobcats' passion and desire to see their school's team do well. If you can't complain after consecutive blowouts to division opponents, when can you complain?

Of course, you don't get that because you don't care about us. You care about one man. And when he's gone, you will be, too.
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Posted: 11/15/2013 12:06 AM
For the record, I see nothing wrong with complaining about how the team played the last game and a half. Something has been very wrong because we know they are better than that - they played significantly better against NTSU and Marshall, both of which are very comparable to Buffalo and BG, perhaps better. I think fans had every reason to expect a better performance than they saw.

The complaints that I thought were out of line were the ones complaining about not winning by enough, or devaluing player performances against the likes of EMU and Miami. I know that players are told not to read message boards, and I hope Ohio's players don't read this one, but some probably do. It can't help their morale when they win by 20-30 points, some have career days and, even then the fans say it isn't good enough

I don't think we'll ever know what caused the internal issues that led to the results we saw the last couple weeks, but I hope this team can regroup and finish with some wins.
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Posted: 11/15/2013 2:04 AM
JSF wrote:expand_more
Ohio fans are posting like OSU or Nebraska fans.


Screw you, dude. Where do you get off posting crap like this? I'm sorry those of us outside the Cult of Frank Solich don't blindly love everything the man does. Even though I'm not a fan of football, I respect my fellow Bobcats' passion and desire to see their school's team do well. If you can't complain after consecutive blowouts to division opponents, when can you complain?

Of course, you don't get that because you don't care about us. You care about one man. And when he's gone, you will be, too.
Dude, it's just a game!
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Posted: 11/15/2013 8:55 AM
Monroe Slavin wrote:expand_more
This has nothing to do with other schools or their fans.  We're posting out of justifiable anger after the last two blowouts in key games.

Just should not have happened.

Saying that we're behaving like fans of other teams strikes me as an absolute failure to face obvious reality and to put responsibility where it belongs.


You can't ALWAYS credit the players and coaches yet never assign the least bit of blame to them.


Monroe, very good, if I am as you describe above, then, you got me, guilty as charged. Yes my game is to support in the manner Bcat describes in his thread. I get it. Your game is the "blame game."  Win or lose, there you are dissatisfied with something.  Blaming.  After a loss some need a day or so to sort their thoughts.  Not Monroe. There you are  caps locked, answering your own posts what was it six, seven, eight in a row, ranting.  I have never seen anything like it from OSU or Nebraska. You are the best. Congratulations. After losses if there were good individual performances those should be mentioned.  I have not seen many the past two weeks.  Don't expect me to pile on with you if things don't go well.  These are not pros, yet they devote years to Ohio, practicing, lifting, injured, rehabbing.  A football player is rarely without pain. We used to say it will get better after the season.  Now there is the constant expectation to get bigger, stronger and  faster.  Beau, after a monster season, worked harder than ever to come back better. I expect his back, shoulders and legs are always talking to him.  Monroe, you say you have "justifiable anger." Knock yourself out.  I am sad sometimes when things don't go well, but, angry at these young men who have been a big part of making Ohio matter, I can not get there.  Go ahead revel in your anger.  Fix blame.  You sure don't need my help.
Last Edited: 11/15/2013 9:03:32 AM by Bcat2
JSF
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Posted: 11/15/2013 9:10 AM
Bcat2 wrote:expand_more
Monroe, very good, if I am as you describe above, then, you got me, guilty as charged. Yes my game is to support in the manner Bcat describes in his thread. I get it. Your game is the "blame game."


Actually, his "game" is to donate a good amount of money to the university and occasionally make a cross-country trip to see them play. How does your courageous message board white knighting compare?
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Posted: 11/15/2013 9:31 AM
Mike Johnson wrote:expand_more
If memory is serving well, Coach Solich signed a 5-year extension within recent months...

Here is something that I find interesting.  After being fired at NE, Solich spent a year visiting other programs - college and NFL.  That's pretty strong evidence that he was eager to observe and learn and perhaps alter his thinking.

After the debacle against Troy, he again demonstrated an ability to initiate significant change.

I now find puzzling his apparent reluctance to initiate change when it is so clearly needed. 


Sir, you seem to be expecting dramatic scheme changes mid game. Well I don't believe it works that way.  Let us see how this shakes out and what coach Solich does at the end of the season.  Ohio fans are posting like OSU or Nebraska fans.


Perhaps the changes I have in mind you would deem dramatic.  Here are things I'd like to see happen - or learn later that they happened:
* Coach Solich, Coach Albin and TT sit down together and have an unhurried, mutually respectful, air-clearing conversation.  From such a conversation comes agreement that TT  will run more OR that TT won't run more and that Vick will get more snaps.  Vick is immediately informed of the outcome of said conversation. 
* Next comes meetings with Coach  Solich and the various units.  He asks who wants to play their hearts out against Kent and who doesn't.  Those who are "brave" enough to say they  aren't ready or willing are told they will sit. 
* Coach Solich and his assistants agree that, at the first sign of a lack of acceptable effort by any Ohio player in the Kent game, said player will be pulled and told to sit for the duration.  The players are so informed. 

Will such discussions take place?  Next Tuesday should provide ample evidence.

A closing comment: If Coaches Solich and Albin agree that they don't want either QB to run more, I just might find it easy to decide not to drive to Athens the day after Thanksgiving.


Mike. I hope there are coach/player conversations as you describe.  This could only be healthy and helpful.  I am not so sure that the key to success is lots of running by the QB.  I believe there is a scheme change afoot away from it.   It just seems, in my observations, the OL, TEs and WRs are being assembled to lean toward passing.  Gdowski has TT passing extremely well and that was not at all his game coming to Ohio. Since coach Gdowski has been with Ohio each succeeding QB has been more efficient.  There have been no plateaus in that regard.  Eventually coach Gdowski will receive an offer he can't refuse. I hope Mr. Vick gets to finish with him.  
Robert Fox
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Posted: 11/15/2013 9:33 AM
Wow, JSF. I don't get your response. I looked twice at Bcat's comment to see what set you off, but I just don't get it. Chill.
Tim Burke
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Posted: 11/15/2013 9:54 AM
Mike Johnson wrote:expand_more
I now find puzzling his apparent reluctance to initiate change when it is so clearly needed. 


He's old? This is what old people do?
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Posted: 11/15/2013 10:10 AM
Tim Burke wrote:expand_more
I now find puzzling his apparent reluctance to initiate change when it is so clearly needed. 


He's old? This is what old people do?

Ummm...at what age do you regard someone as old?  

As a senior citizen - a scant year younger than Coach Solich - actuarial tables clearly see me as old.  But I don't feel old and I don't think I think old.  Of course, I concede that plenty of others might disagree with my self-assessment.






 
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 11/15/2013 10:46 AM
Bcat2 wrote:expand_more
This has nothing to do with other schools or their fans.  We're posting out of justifiable anger after the last two blowouts in key games.

Just should not have happened.

Saying that we're behaving like fans of other teams strikes me as an absolute failure to face obvious reality and to put responsibility where it belongs.


You can't ALWAYS credit the players and coaches yet never assign the least bit of blame to them.


Monroe, very good, if I am as you describe above, then, you got me, guilty as charged. Yes my game is to support in the manner Bcat describes in his thread. I get it. Your game is the "blame game."  Win or lose, there you are dissatisfied with something.  Blaming.  After a loss some need a day or so to sort their thoughts.  Not Monroe. There you are  caps locked, answering your own posts what was it six, seven, eight in a row, ranting.  I have never seen anything like it from OSU or Nebraska. You are the best. Congratulations. After losses if there were good individual performances those should be mentioned.  I have not seen many the past two weeks.  Don't expect me to pile on with you if things don't go well.  These are not pros, yet they devote years to Ohio, practicing, lifting, injured, rehabbing.  A football player is rarely without pain. We used to say it will get better after the season.  Now there is the constant expectation to get bigger, stronger and  faster.  Beau, after a monster season, worked harder than ever to come back better. I expect his back, shoulders and legs are always talking to him.  Monroe, you say you have "justifiable anger." Knock yourself out.  I am sad sometimes when things don't go well, but, angry at these young men who have been a big part of making Ohio matter, I can not get there.  Go ahead revel in your anger.  Fix blame.  You sure don't need my help.

Let's stop with the falsehoods, okay?

My game is not blame.   My game is reasonably objective analysis coupled with expecting us to play to a reasonable % of our capability.  I said that we played well against NTSU and stupd cow ...and also said that aspects of our play vs CMU and EMU portended poorly for the upcoming games against the lesser schools.  You saw everything as 100%, absolutely, perfectly in order.

Hey, what happened vs. Beefs and BG?  Who turned out to be correct.  Do you read anything here--my all caps rant against the start vs. BG was both appropriate and in line with 95% of the sentiment on this board.

Also, note that my complaints are very little directed to any given player.  They are mostly directed to game approach/philosophy.

The 'these are not pros' thought--No kidding.  Thanks for the news...Sorry, we all realize that, have realized it for centuries.  It's perhaps unfortunate, but certainly true, that the players life is not easy, yet they get scholarships and know the atmosphere in which they play.

To not have some disappointed reaction after the last two weeks is a rather fringe reaction.



 
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