Ohio Football Topic
Topic: Your bad
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OhioCatFan
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Posted: 12/3/2014 3:31 PM
Monroe Slavin wrote:expand_more
. . .
There seems to be this concept that current staff is composed of totally solid, experienced coaches who have this deep well of theoretical knowledge. ...
Monroe, please reread my thread about Bobcat True Confessions. You remind me so much of my attitude toward Bill Hess after a few mediocre seasons. My excuse is that I was young, immature and was at the stage in life where I thought everyone over 30 was a feeble old person ready to be put out to pasture. What's your excuse?
Last Edited: 12/3/2014 3:31:50 PM by OhioCatFan
catfan28
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Posted: 12/3/2014 3:53 PM
bobcat695 wrote:expand_more
We have a boring program, which is probably part of the recruiting problem.
Wv have a boring schedule, which turns the casual fan off.
We have a bad stadium, no video board and weak gameday operations.
Define what you mean by "boring program"?? Can you cite what a "non-boring" program looks like?

Just trying to get a handle on what you mean...

FWIW, I agree 100% on schedule. I think Peden is better than what you give it credit for. I've traveled to every MAC stadium except CMU and Peden ranks top 3 overall IMO.
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Posted: 12/3/2014 6:36 PM
catfan28 wrote:expand_more
Define what you mean by "boring program"?? Can you cite what a "non-boring" program looks like?

Just trying to get a handle on what you mean...
...

I don't understand that term, either.

As for the "boring schedule", it is what it is because it makes financial sense. The 2:1 deals of the past nearly killed the program financially. They can't go back to those. Now, I suppose they could eliminate the FCS game, and add another FBS school on a 1:1, meaning alternating years of 5 home games and 6 home games. They could also play another money game instead of the FCS game, and just go to 5 home games each year.

One disadvantage of playing only 5 home games is that it would hurt the local Athens business community. I think someone estimated that an additional home game a year brings them about $500k in extra revenue.

I can see, though, why you might like the upcoming series with UC and Kansas better than, say, Louisiana-Lafayette or New Mexico State.
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 12/3/2014 8:45 PM
Boring needs no explanation. You know it when you see it...or, more precisely, when you watch and don't see it.


It starts with us being INCREDIBLY predictable, doing the same thing over and over. If you've seen us once, you've seen all of us. Period.

Most think that's about the offense for the most part. And it is. But defense, too: Are we ever gonna see an overloaded-side blitz?



Let me counter that argument that our offense is boring, predictable, unexciting: How can you not love the qb draw on third and 12?!
bobcat695
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Posted: 12/3/2014 8:47 PM
catfan28 wrote:expand_more
We have a boring program, which is probably part of the recruiting problem.
Wv have a boring schedule, which turns the casual fan off.
We have a bad stadium, no video board and weak gameday operations.
Define what you mean by "boring program"?? Can you cite what a "non-boring" program looks like?

Just trying to get a handle on what you mean...

FWIW, I agree 100% on schedule. I think Peden is better than what you give it credit for. I've traveled to every MAC stadium except CMU and Peden ranks top 3 overall IMO.
This probably won't go over very well, but I am being honest. The program is boring based on a few thoughts. I think Frank is like a grandfather. This is fine if it's because he is calm and stoic while leading team to many victories, but when there is a need to light a fire under the team or an individual, I don't see it happening. I don't need a coach to be out of control with enthusiasm, but Solich is very dry and monotone. Personally, I am more drawn to guys like Groce and Phillips than Solich. I believe college football requires short-term bursts of motivation. In the past I thought Jason Grooms was that guy on the staff that could do that, but now he is gone.

It's been a long time since we have had a home game that would draw in a casual football fan to check out the team. By scheduling teams like Idaho, Wyoming, Louisana Lafayette, and North Texas as our big game for the year we are basically anonymous in the region. I love the Marshall series, but we haven't had a really interesting non-conference team outside of The Herd in Peden since Pitt in 2005 (maybe UConn in 2009...maybe)

I believe Solich has a say in the schedule, at least somewhat. That becomes part of the boring program, because I think he can beg to play a tougher schedule if he wants to elevate the program. If all the past few recruiting classes are chock full of talent like they say, then schedule a game or two with a good opponent the next few years when these kids are upperclassmen.

Another issue is the style of play. We have a hurry up offense that can't get a play in before the play clock runs out. We have a bunch of really good WRs, but can't get them the ball. There has not been a great QB recruited that can just step in and throw the ball all over the field. A lot of other programs in the MAC have had one or more of these guys running their offense. TT was good for a stretch, but that was really for 18 months out of the past decade. I don't understand why the staff has been unable to recruit a really good QB to Athens. Heck, even when one of our coordinators creates one, he can't even get him to want to be a part of the program. There are kids out there that want an opportunity to step right in and play 4 years in a 2nd tier league instead of riding the bench at a P5 school.

I do love Peden, but it's my home. Not everyone is drawn to it. It needs modernized. The restrooms, lighting under the stadium, concessions, ingress/egress during packed games, etc are all things that could be fixed without a ton of capital. I have been to most of the MAC stadiums as well. I think Akron and Kent in particular do a nice job of everything except the product on the field. I'd like to see food trailers/local concessions available in the stadium. We should be able to buy a beer or two during the 3.5 hours we are out in the hot sun early in the season. I'm not naive enough to think a large video board is just going to appear, so that is not an area I expect a lot of change in the near future. I live in a 100 year old house. I understand how difficult it can be to retrofit something. I like the charm of an old building, but also want some of the modern conveniences. It's why I don't complain about how close rows of seats are to each other. It's impossible to fix without tearing down the stadium. I do, however, think Peden is the least of the problems right now. It doesn't need to expand capacity. Just polish it up and add a few amenities.

I do think the department has improved in some of these areas, like promoting pregame tailgating and the banners outside Peden. Ticket Operations is a lot better than it used to be, and the Ohio Bobcat Club guys do a nice job acknowledging their donors. They are moving forward, even if it is slow.

An exciting program has people wanting more. I never miss games, but I am not really waiting anxiously for Labor Day weekend 2015. We need an infusion of energy, even if it's a little manufactured. We laughed at Row Your Boat, but look what has happened at WMU. Passion and energy are infectious and palpable.
Alan Swank
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Posted: 12/3/2014 8:58 PM
bobcat695 wrote:expand_more
We have a boring program, which is probably part of the recruiting problem.
Wv have a boring schedule, which turns the casual fan off.
We have a bad stadium, no video board and weak gameday operations.
Define what you mean by "boring program"?? Can you cite what a "non-boring" program looks like?

Just trying to get a handle on what you mean...

FWIW, I agree 100% on schedule. I think Peden is better than what you give it credit for. I've traveled to every MAC stadium except CMU and Peden ranks top 3 overall IMO.
This probably won't go over very well, but I am being honest. The program is boring based on a few thoughts. I think Frank is like a grandfather. This is fine if it's because he is calm and stoic while leading team to many victories, but when there is a need to light a fire under the team or an individual, I don't see it happening. I don't need a coach to be out of control with enthusiasm, but Solich is very dry and monotone. Personally, I am more drawn to guys like Groce and Phillips than Solich. I believe college football requires short-term bursts of motivation. In the past I thought Jason Grooms was that guy on the staff that could do that, but now he is gone.

It's been a long time since we have had a home game that would draw in a casual football fan to check out the team. By scheduling teams like Idaho, Wyoming, Louisana Lafayette, and North Texas as our big game for the year we are basically anonymous in the region. I love the Marshall series, but we haven't had a really interesting non-conference team outside of The Herd in Peden since Pitt in 2005 (maybe UConn in 2009...maybe)

I believe Solich has a say in the schedule, at least somewhat. That becomes part of the boring program, because I think he can beg to play a tougher schedule if he wants to elevate the program. If all the past few recruiting classes are chock full of talent like they say, then schedule a game or two with a good opponent the next few years when these kids are upperclassmen.

Another issue is the style of play. We have a hurry up offense that can't get a play in before the play clock runs out. We have a bunch of really good WRs, but can't get them the ball. There has not been a great QB recruited that can just step in and throw the ball all over the field. A lot of other programs in the MAC have had one or more of these guys running their offense. TT was good for a stretch, but that was really for 18 months out of the past decade. I don't understand why the staff has been unable to recruit a really good QB to Athens. Heck, even when one of our coordinators creates one, he can't even get him to want to be a part of the program. There are kids out there that want an opportunity to step right in and play 4 years in a 2nd tier league instead of riding the bench at a P5 school.

I do love Peden, but it's my home. Not everyone is drawn to it. It needs modernized. The restrooms, lighting under the stadium, concessions, ingress/egress during packed games, etc are all things that could be fixed without a ton of capital. I have been to most of the MAC stadiums as well. I think Akron and Kent in particular do a nice job of everything except the product on the field. I'd like to see food trailers/local concessions available in the stadium. We should be able to buy a beer or two during the 3.5 hours we are out in the hot sun early in the season. I'm not naive enough to think a large video board is just going to appear, so that is not an area I expect a lot of change in the near future. I live in a 100 year old house. I understand how difficult it can be to retrofit something. I like the charm of an old building, but also want some of the modern conveniences. It's why I don't complain about how close rows of seats are to each other. It's impossible to fix without tearing down the stadium. I do, however, think Peden is the least of the problems right now. It doesn't need to expand capacity. Just polish it up and add a few amenities.

I do think the department has improved in some of these areas, like promoting pregame tailgating and the banners outside Peden. Ticket Operations is a lot better than it used to be, and the Ohio Bobcat Club guys do a nice job acknowledging their donors. They are moving forward, even if it is slow.

An exciting program has people wanting more. I never miss games, but I am not really waiting anxiously for Labor Day weekend 2015. We need an infusion of energy, even if it's a little manufactured. We laughed at Row Your Boat, but look what has happened at WMU. Passion and energy are infectious and palpable.
Very well said and I'm in total agreement although the situation will probably come after us for being negative. One of the reasons we moved the visitors out of the southeast corner of the end zone is that the fan experience on that side is horrible. It's like going into the bowels of the Rubber Bowl (the posters on here who ever played there can attest to that). Toledo played Missouri at home. BG played Indiana at home. We played Idaho and Eastern Illinois at home. Without high school band day and parents weekend, we would have had a lot of empty seats.
Alan Swank
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Posted: 12/3/2014 8:58 PM
catfan28 wrote:expand_more
We have a boring program, which is probably part of the recruiting problem.
Wv have a boring schedule, which turns the casual fan off.
We have a bad stadium, no video board and weak gameday operations.
Define what you mean by "boring program"?? Can you cite what a "non-boring" program looks like?

Just trying to get a handle on what you mean...

FWIW, I agree 100% on schedule. I think Peden is better than what you give it credit for. I've traveled to every MAC stadium except CMU and Peden ranks top 3 overall IMO.
Which places are one and two? Still waiting to hear on that Jacki O's beer bet by the way.
Last Edited: 12/3/2014 8:59:04 PM by Alan Swank
Mark Lembright '85
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Posted: 12/3/2014 9:19 PM
Alan Swank wrote:expand_more
We have a boring program, which is probably part of the recruiting problem.
Wv have a boring schedule, which turns the casual fan off.
We have a bad stadium, no video board and weak gameday operations.
Define what you mean by "boring program"?? Can you cite what a "non-boring" program looks like?

Just trying to get a handle on what you mean...

FWIW, I agree 100% on schedule. I think Peden is better than what you give it credit for. I've traveled to every MAC stadium except CMU and Peden ranks top 3 overall IMO.
This probably won't go over very well, but I am being honest. The program is boring based on a few thoughts. I think Frank is like a grandfather. This is fine if it's because he is calm and stoic while leading team to many victories, but when there is a need to light a fire under the team or an individual, I don't see it happening. I don't need a coach to be out of control with enthusiasm, but Solich is very dry and monotone. Personally, I am more drawn to guys like Groce and Phillips than Solich. I believe college football requires short-term bursts of motivation. In the past I thought Jason Grooms was that guy on the staff that could do that, but now he is gone.

It's been a long time since we have had a home game that would draw in a casual football fan to check out the team. By scheduling teams like Idaho, Wyoming, Louisana Lafayette, and North Texas as our big game for the year we are basically anonymous in the region. I love the Marshall series, but we haven't had a really interesting non-conference team outside of The Herd in Peden since Pitt in 2005 (maybe UConn in 2009...maybe)

I believe Solich has a say in the schedule, at least somewhat. That becomes part of the boring program, because I think he can beg to play a tougher schedule if he wants to elevate the program. If all the past few recruiting classes are chock full of talent like they say, then schedule a game or two with a good opponent the next few years when these kids are upperclassmen.

Another issue is the style of play. We have a hurry up offense that can't get a play in before the play clock runs out. We have a bunch of really good WRs, but can't get them the ball. There has not been a great QB recruited that can just step in and throw the ball all over the field. A lot of other programs in the MAC have had one or more of these guys running their offense. TT was good for a stretch, but that was really for 18 months out of the past decade. I don't understand why the staff has been unable to recruit a really good QB to Athens. Heck, even when one of our coordinators creates one, he can't even get him to want to be a part of the program. There are kids out there that want an opportunity to step right in and play 4 years in a 2nd tier league instead of riding the bench at a P5 school.

I do love Peden, but it's my home. Not everyone is drawn to it. It needs modernized. The restrooms, lighting under the stadium, concessions, ingress/egress during packed games, etc are all things that could be fixed without a ton of capital. I have been to most of the MAC stadiums as well. I think Akron and Kent in particular do a nice job of everything except the product on the field. I'd like to see food trailers/local concessions available in the stadium. We should be able to buy a beer or two during the 3.5 hours we are out in the hot sun early in the season. I'm not naive enough to think a large video board is just going to appear, so that is not an area I expect a lot of change in the near future. I live in a 100 year old house. I understand how difficult it can be to retrofit something. I like the charm of an old building, but also want some of the modern conveniences. It's why I don't complain about how close rows of seats are to each other. It's impossible to fix without tearing down the stadium. I do, however, think Peden is the least of the problems right now. It doesn't need to expand capacity. Just polish it up and add a few amenities.

I do think the department has improved in some of these areas, like promoting pregame tailgating and the banners outside Peden. Ticket Operations is a lot better than it used to be, and the Ohio Bobcat Club guys do a nice job acknowledging their donors. They are moving forward, even if it is slow.

An exciting program has people wanting more. I never miss games, but I am not really waiting anxiously for Labor Day weekend 2015. We need an infusion of energy, even if it's a little manufactured. We laughed at Row Your Boat, but look what has happened at WMU. Passion and energy are infectious and palpable.
Very well said and I'm in total agreement although the situation will probably come after us for being negative. One of the reasons we moved the visitors out of the southeast corner of the end zone is that the fan experience on that side is horrible. It's like going into the bowels of the Rubber Bowl (the posters on here who ever played there can attest to that). Toledo played Missouri at home. BG played Indiana at home. We played Idaho and Eastern Illinois at home. Without high school band day and parents weekend, we would have had a lot of empty seats.
The Rubber Bowl! Ugh that place was a dump, a great big concrete dump!
L.C.
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Posted: 12/3/2014 9:27 PM
bobcat695 wrote:expand_more
... This is fine if it's because he is calm and stoic while leading team to many victories, but when there is a need to light a fire under the team or an individual, I don't see it happening. I don't need a coach to be out of control with enthusiasm, but Solich is very dry and monotone. Personally, I am more drawn to guys like Groce and Phillips than Solich. I believe college football requires short-term bursts of motivation.
...

Solich is more excitable than his mentor, Tom Osborne, and probably on a par with Joe Paterno. I think either kind of coach can win. There is something to be said for being able to fire up a team, but also something to be said for playing with equal intensity each week. So far as I know, only one time in over twenty years of coaching did Osborne lose to a team with a losing record, and he never lost to an FCS team. Osborne's MO was to always beat the teams he was equal to, or better than, and sometimes beat teams he shouldn't beat.

Solich follows the same plan. He tries to play each week with consistent intensity, and always beat the teams he should beat, or which he is equal to, and to sometimes beat the ones he shouldn't beat. He has not yet lost to an FCS team, and he usually beats teams with a losing record. He hasn't been as effective at it as Osborne was, though, as he has lost a few games to not very good teams, such as to Kent in 2010. On the positive side, he also has racked up some good wins along the way, like the Penn State or Pitt wins, where Ohio had a talent disadvantage, and has been close to winning in others.

Is that boring? Maybe to some it could be, I guess. Some might like more surprise wins, and more surprise losses. I think that's probably where Monroe is coming from. He wants more "exciting" i.e. more risky play calling, meaning taking more chances. Even if it means losing more games that Ohio should win, he'd be happier with it, I think.

Thanks for the reply. At least I understand more about where you are coming from, now.
Paul Graham
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Posted: 12/4/2014 1:09 AM
bobcat695 wrote:expand_more
We have a boring program, which is probably part of the recruiting problem.
Wv have a boring schedule, which turns the casual fan off.
We have a bad stadium, no video board and weak gameday operations.
Define what you mean by "boring program"?? Can you cite what a "non-boring" program looks like?

Just trying to get a handle on what you mean...

FWIW, I agree 100% on schedule. I think Peden is better than what you give it credit for. I've traveled to every MAC stadium except CMU and Peden ranks top 3 overall IMO.
This probably won't go over very well, but I am being honest. The program is boring based on a few thoughts. I think Frank is like a grandfather. This is fine if it's because he is calm and stoic while leading team to many victories, but when there is a need to light a fire under the team or an individual, I don't see it happening. I don't need a coach to be out of control with enthusiasm, but Solich is very dry and monotone. Personally, I am more drawn to guys like Groce and Phillips than Solich. I believe college football requires short-term bursts of motivation. In the past I thought Jason Grooms was that guy on the staff that could do that, but now he is gone.

It's been a long time since we have had a home game that would draw in a casual football fan to check out the team. By scheduling teams like Idaho, Wyoming, Louisana Lafayette, and North Texas as our big game for the year we are basically anonymous in the region. I love the Marshall series, but we haven't had a really interesting non-conference team outside of The Herd in Peden since Pitt in 2005 (maybe UConn in 2009...maybe)

I believe Solich has a say in the schedule, at least somewhat. That becomes part of the boring program, because I think he can beg to play a tougher schedule if he wants to elevate the program. If all the past few recruiting classes are chock full of talent like they say, then schedule a game or two with a good opponent the next few years when these kids are upperclassmen.

Another issue is the style of play. We have a hurry up offense that can't get a play in before the play clock runs out. We have a bunch of really good WRs, but can't get them the ball. There has not been a great QB recruited that can just step in and throw the ball all over the field. A lot of other programs in the MAC have had one or more of these guys running their offense. TT was good for a stretch, but that was really for 18 months out of the past decade. I don't understand why the staff has been unable to recruit a really good QB to Athens. Heck, even when one of our coordinators creates one, he can't even get him to want to be a part of the program. There are kids out there that want an opportunity to step right in and play 4 years in a 2nd tier league instead of riding the bench at a P5 school.

I do love Peden, but it's my home. Not everyone is drawn to it. It needs modernized. The restrooms, lighting under the stadium, concessions, ingress/egress during packed games, etc are all things that could be fixed without a ton of capital. I have been to most of the MAC stadiums as well. I think Akron and Kent in particular do a nice job of everything except the product on the field. I'd like to see food trailers/local concessions available in the stadium. We should be able to buy a beer or two during the 3.5 hours we are out in the hot sun early in the season. I'm not naive enough to think a large video board is just going to appear, so that is not an area I expect a lot of change in the near future. I live in a 100 year old house. I understand how difficult it can be to retrofit something. I like the charm of an old building, but also want some of the modern conveniences. It's why I don't complain about how close rows of seats are to each other. It's impossible to fix without tearing down the stadium. I do, however, think Peden is the least of the problems right now. It doesn't need to expand capacity. Just polish it up and add a few amenities.

I do think the department has improved in some of these areas, like promoting pregame tailgating and the banners outside Peden. Ticket Operations is a lot better than it used to be, and the Ohio Bobcat Club guys do a nice job acknowledging their donors. They are moving forward, even if it is slow.

An exciting program has people wanting more. I never miss games, but I am not really waiting anxiously for Labor Day weekend 2015. We need an infusion of energy, even if it's a little manufactured. We laughed at Row Your Boat, but look what has happened at WMU. Passion and energy are infectious and palpable.
Yes yes yes +100
The Situation
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Posted: 12/4/2014 9:54 AM
bobcat695 wrote:expand_more
It's been a long time since we have had a home game that would draw in a casual football fan to check out the team. By scheduling teams like Idaho, Wyoming, Louisana Lafayette, and North Texas as our big game for the year we are basically anonymous in the region. I love the Marshall series, but we haven't had a really interesting non-conference team outside of The Herd in Peden since Pitt in 2005 (maybe UConn in 2009...maybe)

I believe Solich has a say in the schedule, at least somewhat. That becomes part of the boring program, because I think he can beg to play a tougher schedule if he wants to elevate the program. If all the past few recruiting classes are chock full of talent like they say, then schedule a game or two with a good opponent the next few years when these kids are upperclassmen.
I agree with you here; the schedule has been a bore. I agree with you that Frank Solich can take action for himself to strengthen the schedule.

However, Frank has already made the positive impacts you're requesting. And I'm talking past tense as in years ago.

When Frank first came in as OHIO's head coach, he scheduled games a decade in advance. Was that the strongest move he could've made for OHIO? I don't know, but that's how they ran the business at Nebraska.

We're still playing games that were scheduled when OHIO was a bottom dweller. Only in the last year or two has the future become close enough to schedule.

And what did Frank do when he got a say in how to schedule the new OHIO of the future (not the old OHIO of the past)?

OHIO signed 1 and 1s against Cinci and Kansas a year or two ago.

I agree with your disatisfaction of the schedule. The boring schedule was penciled in a decade ago. And the schedule of the future already has two home games that are exciting.

I agree, but it sounds like your issue is about something that happened almost a decade ago.

PS,

On scheduling, I heard Schaus turned down a money game at Notre Dame in the near future.
Last Edited: 12/4/2014 10:04:41 AM by The Situation
L.C.
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Posted: 12/4/2014 10:17 AM
One of the biggest problems that posters have had who have asked for better home schedules is that they frequently fail to specify just exactly how they would like to see it improved, or they make a proposal that is fiscally impossible, such as being willing to do 2:1 deals, but not being willing to drop to 4-5 home games a year. If you do a 2:1 deal to bring in a big name team, you'll have to add 2 more money games to make up the revenue, meaning 4 road games for every home game, and there is no way to make that work with having 6 home games a year, and even 5 might be difficult.

My feeling is that Schaus is looking for attractive 1:1 deals with P5 teams where he can find them, but so is every other G5 AD in the country.
The Situation
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Posted: 12/4/2014 1:00 PM
L.C. wrote:expand_more
One of the biggest problems that posters have had who have asked for better home schedules is that they frequently fail to specify just exactly how they would like to see it improved, or they make a proposal that is fiscally impossible, such as being willing to do 2:1 deals, but not being willing to drop to 4-5 home games a year. If you do a 2:1 deal to bring in a big name team, you'll have to add 2 more money games to make up the revenue, meaning 4 road games for every home game, and there is no way to make that work with having 6 home games a year, and even 5 might be difficult.
+1
Kevin Finnegan
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Posted: 12/4/2014 1:21 PM
bobcat695 wrote:expand_more
We have a boring program, which is probably part of the recruiting problem.
Wv have a boring schedule, which turns the casual fan off.
We have a bad stadium, no video board and weak gameday operations.
Define what you mean by "boring program"?? Can you cite what a "non-boring" program looks like?

Just trying to get a handle on what you mean...

FWIW, I agree 100% on schedule. I think Peden is better than what you give it credit for. I've traveled to every MAC stadium except CMU and Peden ranks top 3 overall IMO.
This probably won't go over very well, but I am being honest. The program is boring based on a few thoughts. I think Frank is like a grandfather. This is fine if it's because he is calm and stoic while leading team to many victories, but when there is a need to light a fire under the team or an individual, I don't see it happening. I don't need a coach to be out of control with enthusiasm, but Solich is very dry and monotone. Personally, I am more drawn to guys like Groce and Phillips than Solich. I believe college football requires short-term bursts of motivation. In the past I thought Jason Grooms was that guy on the staff that could do that, but now he is gone.

It's been a long time since we have had a home game that would draw in a casual football fan to check out the team. By scheduling teams like Idaho, Wyoming, Louisana Lafayette, and North Texas as our big game for the year we are basically anonymous in the region. I love the Marshall series, but we haven't had a really interesting non-conference team outside of The Herd in Peden since Pitt in 2005 (maybe UConn in 2009...maybe)

I believe Solich has a say in the schedule, at least somewhat. That becomes part of the boring program, because I think he can beg to play a tougher schedule if he wants to elevate the program. If all the past few recruiting classes are chock full of talent like they say, then schedule a game or two with a good opponent the next few years when these kids are upperclassmen.

Another issue is the style of play. We have a hurry up offense that can't get a play in before the play clock runs out. We have a bunch of really good WRs, but can't get them the ball. There has not been a great QB recruited that can just step in and throw the ball all over the field. A lot of other programs in the MAC have had one or more of these guys running their offense. TT was good for a stretch, but that was really for 18 months out of the past decade. I don't understand why the staff has been unable to recruit a really good QB to Athens. Heck, even when one of our coordinators creates one, he can't even get him to want to be a part of the program. There are kids out there that want an opportunity to step right in and play 4 years in a 2nd tier league instead of riding the bench at a P5 school.

I do love Peden, but it's my home. Not everyone is drawn to it. It needs modernized. The restrooms, lighting under the stadium, concessions, ingress/egress during packed games, etc are all things that could be fixed without a ton of capital. I have been to most of the MAC stadiums as well. I think Akron and Kent in particular do a nice job of everything except the product on the field. I'd like to see food trailers/local concessions available in the stadium. We should be able to buy a beer or two during the 3.5 hours we are out in the hot sun early in the season. I'm not naive enough to think a large video board is just going to appear, so that is not an area I expect a lot of change in the near future. I live in a 100 year old house. I understand how difficult it can be to retrofit something. I like the charm of an old building, but also want some of the modern conveniences. It's why I don't complain about how close rows of seats are to each other. It's impossible to fix without tearing down the stadium. I do, however, think Peden is the least of the problems right now. It doesn't need to expand capacity. Just polish it up and add a few amenities.

I do think the department has improved in some of these areas, like promoting pregame tailgating and the banners outside Peden. Ticket Operations is a lot better than it used to be, and the Ohio Bobcat Club guys do a nice job acknowledging their donors. They are moving forward, even if it is slow.

An exciting program has people wanting more. I never miss games, but I am not really waiting anxiously for Labor Day weekend 2015. We need an infusion of energy, even if it's a little manufactured. We laughed at Row Your Boat, but look what has happened at WMU. Passion and energy are infectious and palpable.
I love what this says. It's right to the point on where our program has become stagnant. It needs that jolt of life. If it's not Frank, maybe it's in the assistants. I mentioned earlier in the year that Frank seems to have a fear of making big decisions. Every game we hear how this is the longest-tenured HC, OC, and DC in the country. Great, but at a level like this, that could mean that the OC and DC are not in demand elsewhere. Frank hasn't been willing to cut ties to his loyalties to make the program more successful. Following the embarrassment at the hands of Troy, he realized that our offense wasn't nearly at the level as theirs and that our defense wasn't able to keep up. He blindly assumed that the architects of our inferior offense and defense could make the changes rather than looking for people who already could perform at those levels.

I think, however, the biggest indictment towards the Solich administration is the inability to grow a QB in today's game. We have had two QBs ever in his tenure that were recruited out of HS that started games. They are Tettleton and Vick. Can anybody claim that those two vastly improved as QBs after they stepped foot on campus? Tettleton's best season was his first starting season. Vick's best game was his first start. There hasn't been marked improvement. Then you look at Bowling Green who went through a bevy of QBs this year.

--Matt Johnson (JR)--stud last year, throws for 300+ in opener, gets injured. Recruited out of HS to BGSU.
--James Knapke (SO)--comes in in relief, throws for over 2600 yards, has team in the MAC Championship. Recruited out of HS to BGSU.
--Cody Callaway (FR)--recruited out of HS after throwing for over 7,100 yards in his HS career. I'd be thrilled to see someone like that behind (maybe even under!) center at OHIO.

This doesn't even include their Texas Tech QB transfer (Clayton Nicholas).
The Situation
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Posted: 12/4/2014 1:36 PM
The three previous quarterbacks under Frank Solich before Vick set passing records at OHIO in succession.

Anyone can talk about the unimpressive record book before Frank got here. But is it not improvement when the next quarterback beat the previous? Isn't what we've seen out of Theo, then Boo, then TT the definition of improvement?

Talk about today's game all you want. Frank Solich coached a Heisman winning quarterback at Nebraska who threw for 1,500 and ran for 1,000 his senior year. Does anyone think that wouldn't work in today's game?

At the end of the day, you can't make these kids come here. There's a difference between Frank knowing what it takes to be a quarterback in "today's game" and the quarterback that has what it takes flat out choosing someone else.
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Posted: 12/4/2014 2:09 PM
The Situation wrote:expand_more
The three previous quarterbacks under Frank Solich before Vick set passing records at OHIO in succession.

Anyone can talk about the unimpressive record book before Frank got here. But is it not improvement when the next quarterback beat the previous? Isn't what we've seen out of Theo, then Boo, then TT the definition of improvement?

Talk about today's game all you want. Frank Solich coached a Heisman winning quarterback at Nebraska who threw for 1,500 and ran for 1,000 his senior year. Does anyone think that wouldn't work in today's game?

At the end of the day, you can't make these kids come here. There's a difference between Frank knowing what it takes to be a quarterback in "today's game" and the quarterback that has what it takes flat out choosing someone else.
I hate that argument simply because there almost was no passing game between the time Cleve Bryant left and when Frank took over. Sure Frank improved that aspect of it, but Ohio's record book was very underwhelming to begin with.
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Posted: 12/4/2014 2:41 PM
GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
The three previous quarterbacks under Frank Solich before Vick set passing records at OHIO in succession.

Anyone can talk about the unimpressive record book before Frank got here. But is it not improvement when the next quarterback beat the previous? Isn't what we've seen out of Theo, then Boo, then TT the definition of improvement?

Talk about today's game all you want. Frank Solich coached a Heisman winning quarterback at Nebraska who threw for 1,500 and ran for 1,000 his senior year. Does anyone think that wouldn't work in today's game?

At the end of the day, you can't make these kids come here. There's a difference between Frank knowing what it takes to be a quarterback in "today's game" and the quarterback that has what it takes flat out choosing someone else.
I hate that argument simply because there almost was no passing game between the time Cleve Bryant left and when Frank took over. Sure Frank improved that aspect of it, but Ohio's record book was very underwhelming to begin with.
With all do respect GoCats, I hate that rebuttal.

Record books, by nature, can be re-written in a single season. A century of deficiency in a particular area can be erased by just one person raising the bar to a level on par with OHIO's peers.

For example:

Tettleton passed for 3,302 yards, 2,851 yards, and 2,844 yards in three seasons. For his career he threw for 9,100 yards. He has the #1, #2, and #3 passing seasons at OHIO. TT is #1 for his career in passing at OHIO.

At NIU, Tyler Tettleton's best passing seasons would've ranked #2, #3, and #4 all time. TT would be #1 all time in NIU's record book for passing yards in a career.

At Toledo, TT has passing seasons #3, #5, and #5. TT would be #2 all time in passing at Toledo.

For BG, #5, #9, and #9. TT would be #3 all time in passing at BG.

Those are just some examples compared to some MAC peers.

I could dig deeper and blow your rebuttal up.

The reality is, Frank, this staff, found a hidden gem at QB when Tettleton signed. And despite the way things ended, OHIO's passing records are now on par with their peers.

So if these records at OHIO fall in the future, if OHIO ever gets a new #1 career passer, what happened in the last 100 years is irrelevant.
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Posted: 12/4/2014 3:01 PM
I know that this is one of my old saws, but please TS and everyone else in this thread when making arguments and comparing different generations of OHIO QBs, please use per game averages. Comparing the number of completions, passes, interceptions, or whatever for a QB who played in 12, 13 or 14 games in a season with one who played in 9 or 10 (or going way back 8) is not an apples to apples comparison. OK, I'm off my soapbox for now -- at least for a little while. ;-)
The Situation
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Posted: 12/4/2014 3:05 PM
OhioCatFan wrote:expand_more
I know that this is one of my old saws, but please TS and everyone else in this thread when making arguments and comparing different generations of OHIO QBs, please use per game averages. Comparing the number of completions, passes, interceptions, or whatever for a QB who played in 12, 13 or 14 games in a season with one who played in 9 or 10 (or going way back 8) is not an apples to apples comparison.
I agree that is fair. Per game season stats are definitely something I was wrong to overlook.

In general, the premise to my original argument remains the same.

P.S.

In the interest of fairness, perhaps stats on a per quarter basis should be the golden rule (mitigating injury, blowouts, and OT).
Last Edited: 12/4/2014 3:09:54 PM by The Situation
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 12/4/2014 3:11 PM
I also agree TS that your general premise would remain intact with a true apples to apples comparison, but the level of improvement might not be quite as dramatic. In terms of our passing game, it was at its former zenith in the days of Cleve and Todd, then went into semi hibernation for a number of years until Grobe put it into the deep freeze. It slowly emerged again after that and there has been fairly steady progression in the Solich years.
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Posted: 12/4/2014 4:21 PM
Your bad: Just win the MACC. All this about abstract statistics and comparisons blah, blah, blah. What was on the field and our record over the last 35 gamesis is not good....it's your bad. Hope is good. But hope is not proof, is not performance.

Your bad; just win the @#*&*^ MACC.
The Situation
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Posted: 12/4/2014 4:40 PM
Monroe, I thought you were going to comment on me literally using the words "I was wrong" in my last post. Something you've falsely accused me of being incapable to admit, multiple times.

But that wouldn't fit your narrative would it?

Please go on about the last x games...

Can we bet an "I am wrong" on the future MACC?

If Frank wins one before he retires you say the words I am wrong.

If Frank doesn't win one before he retires, I give you an I am wrong*.

*I'm in no way guaranteeing a MACC for OHIO under Frank. But I'll bet an "I am wrong" on Frank if it means Monroe has to publicly admit defeat.
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Posted: 12/4/2014 8:33 PM
The Situation wrote:expand_more
Monroe, I thought you were going to comment on me literally using the words "I was wrong" in my last post. Something you've falsely accused me of being incapable to admit, multiple times.

But that wouldn't fit your narrative would it?

Please go on about the last x games...

Can we bet an "I am wrong" on the future MACC?

If Frank wins one before he retires you say the words I am wrong.

If Frank doesn't win one before he retires, I give you an I am wrong*.

*I'm in no way guaranteeing a MACC for OHIO under Frank. But I'll bet an "I am wrong" on Frank if it means Monroe has to publicly admit defeat.
I'll take that bet on Frank and the MACC!



It's kinda a win-win...If he doesn't get one, it'll prove I'm correct (though not happy to be on this count) and if I lose then it means we got the MACC and ALL OF US will be happy.
Last Edited: 12/4/2014 8:34:25 PM by Monroe Slavin
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