But maybe that's not the most surprising stat here...


Ohio University--Athens
13. Ohio University--Athens
Athens, OH
$19,566 Tuition
23,571 Enrolled
540 Avg SAT Reading
540 Avg SAT Math
520 Avg SAT Writing
“Academically, OHIO has something for everyone, from astrophysics to the history of rock and roll,” students at this large state-run university boast. And students have an equally wide range of choices when it comes to committing themselves to ...


Ohio State University--Columbus

14. Ohio State University--Columbus
Columbus, OH
$26,943 Tuition
44,741 Enrolled
600 Avg SAT Reading
680 Avg SAT Math
610 Avg SAT Writing
Opportunities abound at the Ohio State University in Columbus, Ohio. Located “in a growing city,” OSU has the distinction of being one of the largest schools in the United States. The “amazing opportunities” that come from such a large campus extend ...

http://www.princetonreview.com/college-rankings?rankings=...

They are probably only counting the scores of students admitted as freshmen. O$U keeps their freshmen acceptance rate low so it looks good in these rankings, but almost anyone can get in as a transfer.

Avg SAT for math of 680 is very difficult to believe.

Yep. Made the difference for me. I was guaranteed a full tuition merit-based scholarship at OUr fair university. osu was the only other school I seriously considered, and they could only guarantee me $1,200 (they did give me the opportunity to enter a competition for additional scholarship money, but they couldn't promise me anything). That sealed the deal on me being a Bobcat.

But IIRC, OUr administration consciously lowered admissions standards and cut merit-based aid about 8 years ago, with the idea that we would be able to increase enrollment numbers with need-based aid.

I find that hard to believe given their overall admissions stats. Some schools like Oklahoma and Alabama do give full scholarships to any National Merit Scholar to try and improve their standings and competitiveness. Maybe Ohio State just doesn't put much weight on it. Most highly selective schools don't really do anything for NMS in and of itself. NMS Finalists are just put into the general merit scholarship pool. Here's an article on Michigan's approach.

http://www.michigandaily.com/node/35361

"For many schools, the title of Merit Scholar Designee gives students a lift up from the rest of the competition. Several schools, such as the University of Kansas and the University of Arkansas, heavily recruit the scholars, giving them personal tours of campus or free tuition and room and board.

But officials here said the University of Michigan is not as impressed with National Merit Scholars as other schools might be. Associate Provost for Academic Affairs Lester Monts said the expectations set for merit scholars are lower than the standards the University expects its incoming class to set."

"The number of freshman designated as National Merit Scholars enrolled at the University increased from 45 in 2000 to 64 this year, a "marginal" number according to the National Merit Scholarship Corporation."

And I found a similar approach on OSU's website.
http://undergrad.osu.edu/money-matters/scholarships.html

"Ohio State does not participate in the Merit Scholarship Program (administered by the National Merit Scholarship Corporation). We admire the outstanding academic achievements of our National Merit Finalists; many prove to be strong candidates for university-administered scholarships, including those described on this page. The university will honor Corporate National Merit scholarships for students who accept admission to Ohio State."

In any event, I find it hard that a school that attracted 62 in 2012 to suddenly have zero.

http://mup.asu.edu/MUP-TARU-Part-III-Top-200-Institutions...

It's a far cry from the way things were 20 years ago, when it seemed like EVERYONE was admitted to OSU. I don't have to like everything about the place, but they do know what they're doing.

Just a few thoughts on various colleges' student profiles.

I have 3 alma maters and feel good about all of them. That said, I tend to believe that what is more significant than overall profiles are the profiles of students admitted to particular programs within a university.

For example, although many tend to denigrate Akron, it's polymer engineering program is regarded as first rate. At Kent, its design programs - fashion, graphic arts - are well regarded and funded. I'm guessing the profiles of students admitted to those programs bear little resemblance to the general student profiles at those universities.

I tend to think the same holds for the profiles of students admitted to the Russ College and the E.W. Scripps School and perhaps other strong Ohio programs. Early this year I learned that two high school seniors-to-be, one in Mountain Lakes, NJ and the other in Latrobe, PA, are interested in engineering. Both had googled engineering programs, both were impressed by what they learned about Russ, and both decided they wanted to visit Russ. Which they both did in early April. And, yes, both youngsters are top HS students.

Yes, it would be nice to be able to brag about Ohio frosh having higher ACT/SAT scores. But it is comforting to know that, so far, Ohio has been able to continue increasing enrollment, unlike other universities, including Akron, Kent and YSU and many small private schools.

That's interesting, but I think the info that I showed is a pretty solid explanation as to why NMS Finalists are no big deal to some schools. To look at that list from an OHIO perspective, the cause for concern is why are so many going to UC.

I'm glad too that Ohio hasn't suffered from stagnant or declining enrollment but, rather, has actually grown. What's worried me is that growth has not driven an increase in quality. Ohio seems to be falling further and further behind OSU and Miami in competitiveness and is in danger of being passed by UC.

The underlying question in all this is why does OHIO have only 3 million dollars in merit aid to offer, which is 1/12 what is available at Miami when the endowments are of similar size. Has McDavis ever publicly addressed this challenge, and what is he doing to deal with it?

We seem to be getting dwarfed in merit aid by many peer institutions, and that is a good question, where is all the foundation money going for, or what is the future plan? Besides buying a new house

I was also informed that OHIO is now waiving the out of state part of tuition for the children of alumni.

But still a lot of work to do apparently.

Don't forget that OHIO has the largest branch campus system in the state with 8 campuses and 13,000 students.

Did some research, and it's actually somewhat easier to transfer into Ohio than OSU. Both have a base requirement of a 2.0 (which I think is standardized by the regents. OSU requires a full year (30 semester hours) while Ohio only requires 20. OSU's website specifically outlines that their branch campus transfers must meet the same criteria. At Ohio, it's called "relocating" and I can't find what the requirements are anywhere on either the Athens or branch campus websites. It sounds like one just changes campus designations if they're in good standing, but I don't know. I'd be really interested if somebody has the exact procedure.

Some colleges at both schools require a higher GPA. At Ohio: Business (2.5) Scripps (3.0) and Russ (2.5)

At OSU, the following all require a 3.0: business, engineering, architecture and John Glenn (public affairs).

One other uncomfortable aspect to this is that OSU is sending kids with 24, 25 and even 26 on their ACT off to a branch campus. Those kids would be automatic admits at Ohio.

My point in all this is that you just can't hide behind "oh OSU just lets them in a year later" as if that negates everything and somehow makes Ohio superior. If Ohio really wants to consider itself a peer to OSU and Miami in more than just McDavis' speeches, it needs to accept that there is a huge challenge ahead and look at why it's where it is and how it can turn things around. I'd love to see a real focused fundraising campaign for undergraduate scholarships both need and merit based. I just don't sense that it's a priority of McDavis. Certainly the results haven't been shown yet if it is.

We may have addressed it, but we are still behind, and not keeping up, and in some areas falling farther behind.

Correct, my bad as I intended to say "for", not "in".