Ohio Football Topic
Topic: The Tower Experience
Page: 4 of 5
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BillyTheCat
9/17/2016 10:04 PM
Concessions is limited by space of stands, lack of cooking stations and no room in the concourse for lines or fans.
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Monroe Slavin
9/17/2016 10:23 PM
Some people are totally negative all the time.









jk
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CA Bobcat
9/17/2016 11:42 PM
Monroe Slavin wrote:expand_more
Some people are totally negative all the time.









jk
Great point, water boy!
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OhioStunter
9/18/2016 1:08 AM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
Concessions is limited by space of stands, lack of cooking stations and no room in the concourse for lines or fans.
Perhaps, but if concessions can be run efficiently out of a trailer at a fair, a 10x10 tent at a festival or in a packed city street with a food truck, there shouldn't be any excuse for not finding a way to be more resourceful and provide a better fan experience without costly infrastructure improvements.
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BillyTheCat
9/18/2016 12:04 PM
OhioStunter wrote:expand_more
Concessions is limited by space of stands, lack of cooking stations and no room in the concourse for lines or fans.
Perhaps, but if concessions can be run efficiently out of a trailer at a fair, a 10x10 tent at a festival or in a packed city street with a food truck, there shouldn't be any excuse for not finding a way to be more resourceful and provide a better fan experience without costly infrastructure improvements.

When was the last time you were at an event with 20,000 people as saw them serve concessions out of 5 trailer size concessions? How did that work? We are limited by our physical structure, even to the extent that we cannot bring other trucks or carts really into the north end of the stands. Now is the time to go big!!!! 35,000-45,000 Interest is up, season tickets are at a record number. We need to think big! We have a new project going up in the North EZ, we can tie the new stadium right into that building, wider concourses, up to date facilities, rest rooms, and more importantly we can get to the 2nd largest arena in OHIO.
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TWT
9/18/2016 10:08 PM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
Concessions is limited by space of stands, lack of cooking stations and no room in the concourse for lines or fans.
Perhaps, but if concessions can be run efficiently out of a trailer at a fair, a 10x10 tent at a festival or in a packed city street with a food truck, there shouldn't be any excuse for not finding a way to be more resourceful and provide a better fan experience without costly infrastructure improvements.

When was the last time you were at an event with 20,000 people as saw them serve concessions out of 5 trailer size concessions? How did that work? We are limited by our physical structure, even to the extent that we cannot bring other trucks or carts really into the north end of the stands. Now is the time to go big!!!! 35,000-45,000 Interest is up, season tickets are at a record number. We need to think big! We have a new project going up in the North EZ, we can tie the new stadium right into that building, wider concourses, up to date facilities, rest rooms, and more importantly we can get to the 2nd largest arena in OHIO.
Move to the SEC and I guarantee the RV lot in the ridges fills up..:)
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OU_Country
9/19/2016 11:58 AM
35,000-45,000 seats for Ohio Football? So we can have 25,000 empty seats on a Wednesday night in November? The demand is there for maybe two home games a year. The rest of the year, the demand is actually less than what Peden currently offers. Dress up, and clean up what we have now. I agree that it needs addressed, and needs to be modernized in terms of concessions, restrooms, and audio/video. But adding 10k or more in capacity would be an unwise investment that probably would not pay for itself in my lifetime.
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BillyTheCat
9/19/2016 12:23 PM
OU_Country wrote:expand_more
35,000-45,000 seats for Ohio Football? So we can have 25,000 empty seats on a Wednesday night in November? The demand is there for maybe two home games a year. The rest of the year, the demand is actually less than what Peden currently offers. Dress up, and clean up what we have now. I agree that it needs addressed, and needs to be modernized in terms of concessions, restrooms, and audio/video. But adding 10k or more in capacity would be an unwise investment that probably would not pay for itself in my lifetime.
Pretty sure that is what they said about the Convo 45 years ago.
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OU_Country
9/19/2016 12:35 PM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
35,000-45,000 seats for Ohio Football? So we can have 25,000 empty seats on a Wednesday night in November? The demand is there for maybe two home games a year. The rest of the year, the demand is actually less than what Peden currently offers. Dress up, and clean up what we have now. I agree that it needs addressed, and needs to be modernized in terms of concessions, restrooms, and audio/video. But adding 10k or more in capacity would be an unwise investment that probably would not pay for itself in my lifetime.
Pretty sure that is what they said about the Convo 45 years ago.
Maybe they did, I don't know. What I do know is that this is a different era, one that generally demonstrates that adding capacity isn't a good investment. If those Wednesday night games were approaching capacity, they I'd quickly agree with you. Capacity in the mid 20k's is more than enough in Athens until proven otherwise in my opinion. MAC Championships, big wins over P5 teams, or being allowed to participate in big boy bowls sometime in the future might change all of that. Making the building look like it's from the current century is more important in my opinion.
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Recovering Journalist
9/19/2016 1:07 PM
OU_Country wrote:expand_more
Maybe they did, I don't know. What I do know is that this is a different era, one that generally demonstrates that adding capacity isn't a good investment. If those Wednesday night games were approaching capacity, they I'd quickly agree with you. Capacity in the mid 20k's is more than enough in Athens until proven otherwise in my opinion. MAC Championships, big wins over P5 teams, or being allowed to participate in big boy bowls sometime in the future might change all of that. Making the building look like it's from the current century is more important in my opinion.
I strongly agree with this, and I'll pile on with a few more reasons it's a bad idea with a hugely negative ROI. First, college football attendance has declined FIVE straight years overall. That's not a blip and you can blame whatever you like, but adding capacity is not a great response to that trend. Second, college football is still in the midst of a major shakeout as the P5 is making its own rules and "cost of attendance" is a clear slope to "paychecks." Schools like Ohio that lose money already will not be able to lose more, so they'll just fall farther behind, stop playing or make the junior nature of the G5 league official. Finally, looking farther ahead, say 10-20 years, football itself is very likely to see a boxing-like decline in popularity as fewer kids play because the deleterious nature of the game is becoming more obvious and understood every day.
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OU_Country
9/19/2016 3:12 PM
Recovering Journalist wrote:expand_more
Maybe they did, I don't know. What I do know is that this is a different era, one that generally demonstrates that adding capacity isn't a good investment. If those Wednesday night games were approaching capacity, they I'd quickly agree with you. Capacity in the mid 20k's is more than enough in Athens until proven otherwise in my opinion. MAC Championships, big wins over P5 teams, or being allowed to participate in big boy bowls sometime in the future might change all of that. Making the building look like it's from the current century is more important in my opinion.
I strongly agree with this, and I'll pile on with a few more reasons it's a bad idea with a hugely negative ROI. First, college football attendance has declined FIVE straight years overall. That's not a blip and you can blame whatever you like, but adding capacity is not a great response to that trend. Second, college football is still in the midst of a major shakeout as the P5 is making its own rules and "cost of attendance" is a clear slope to "paychecks." Schools like Ohio that lose money already will not be able to lose more, so they'll just fall farther behind, stop playing or make the junior nature of the G5 league official. Finally, looking farther ahead, say 10-20 years, football itself is very likely to see a boxing-like decline in popularity as fewer kids play because the deleterious nature of the game is becoming more obvious and understood every day.

All good additions to the reasons why not to add. I still think doing something to improve what's there now is important. Or, if it's deemed that renovations to the student side would be more costly than a demolition and rebuild, so be it. Capacity, in my mind, isn't as important as getting more out of the facility, and number of seats that are there now.
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OUcats82
9/19/2016 4:14 PM
Quote:expand_more
All good additions to the reasons why not to add. I still think doing something to improve what's there now is important. Or, if it's deemed that renovations to the student side would be more costly than a demolition and rebuild, so be it. Capacity, in my mind, isn't as important as getting more out of the facility, and number of seats that are there now.
I'm with you here. Capacity is, as much as I don't like saying this, more than fine for the demand right now. I'd like to see something along the lines of what they did at Wrigley Field where they did a major overhaul to an existing structure. Not a true apples to apples but the best I can think of right now. Footprint may or may not be large enough but I have to think some improvements could be made.

Until MACtion goes away we will struggle to fill the back end of our home schedule with much more than half capacity. I don't have the ability to travel to Athens for a game unless it is on a Saturday or maybe like a Black Friday situation. Peden is a destination for someone committed to attending-we don't have the benefit of a large population who may casually choose to come to a game for something to do on a week night. Even Toledo doesn't have huge crowds for MACtion from what I have seen on TV and I would argue they have the best combination of a high quality product on the field and proximity to a larger population in the MAC.
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TWT
9/19/2016 9:00 PM
The way its supposed to work is Ohio is in contention for a MACC going into November and locals get on board with the cheap MACtion tickets. The truth of the matter is Ohio hasn't been in contention in November going on about 5 years. There are plenty enough people in a 30 mile radius of Athens and students on campus to put 24,000 in the house on a Tuesday night if there was something to play for.
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BillyTheCat
9/19/2016 9:21 PM
What some are ignoring is that tearing down the East stands is probably a cheaper alternative than providing the work needed over there.
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OU_Country
9/20/2016 10:43 AM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
What some are ignoring is that tearing down the East stands is probably a cheaper alternative than providing the work needed over there.
And if that's the case, I say tear it down and build a simple, but functional two deck structure in it's place that has a similar capacity. I'm just not on board with the idea of adding 10,000 to 15,000 more seats that really aren't necessary. In another thread, I mentioned the look that App State has at their stadium opposite thier tower side. I got to see it this summer when I was in Boone, and it's pretty simple, but it would be an upgrade. How expensive it is, I've no idea. Their capacity is around that of Peden in the 23k range.


http://appalachianmagazine.org/sites/default/files/storie...

https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7398/11802847914_b6c803e3a4...
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BillyTheCat
9/20/2016 11:13 AM
OU_Country wrote:expand_more
What some are ignoring is that tearing down the East stands is probably a cheaper alternative than providing the work needed over there.
And if that's the case, I say tear it down and build a simple, but functional two deck structure in it's place that has a similar capacity. I'm just not on board with the idea of adding 10,000 to 15,000 more seats that really aren't necessary. In another thread, I mentioned the look that App State has at their stadium opposite thier tower side. I got to see it this summer when I was in Boone, and it's pretty simple, but it would be an upgrade. How expensive it is, I've no idea. Their capacity is around that of Peden in the 23k range.


http://appalachianmagazine.org/sites/default/files/storie...

https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7398/11802847914_b6c803e3a4...

A two deck structure that seats 8,000 people and is 100 yards in length, that would look worse than UB's stadium.
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ou79
9/20/2016 12:42 PM
I agree with BTC, we should level the student section and start over. Quite frankly, I would be shocked if it was not as cheap if not cheaper to simply eliminate the student side stands and build something in their place. Further, I wonder if it is too late to rethink the proposed Student Center in the north end zone? A better move would be to level the two (2) stands that are there now and build an entirely new north end zone incorporating both the Student Center and stands which would then tie into a new set of stands on the student side of the stadium. I would also make that a two (2) level/deck seating section with seriously upgraded facilities/concessions and locker rooms for visiting teams. As for the Tower side, outside of adding maybe a limited amount of additional seating, I am not sure what else could be done there. Finally, I would look to expand to somewhere in the 35,000 to 45,000 range. Perhaps 35,000 permanent seats with Victory Hill and other areas giving a more realistic SRO capacity of approximately 40,000. Remember, this is not something we will be doing every 10 or 20 years, so do it right. Or finally, level the entire stadium and start all over again. Sorry, but Peden right now is a dump and there is not a lot you can do to fix it up. Kind of like putting a band aide on a bleeding artery.
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SBH
9/20/2016 1:19 PM
ou79 wrote:expand_more
I wonder if it is too late to rethink the proposed Student Center in the north end zone?

Answer: Yes, too late. It has taken years to get the funds/go-ahead. They're not going to change plans now.

I would like to see the corner sections extended down to the field along with a corresponding center section below the new academic center. Sort of complete the "bowl" configuration. Perhaps would add 1,500 seats as well.
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OU_Country
9/20/2016 1:45 PM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
What some are ignoring is that tearing down the East stands is probably a cheaper alternative than providing the work needed over there.
And if that's the case, I say tear it down and build a simple, but functional two deck structure in it's place that has a similar capacity. I'm just not on board with the idea of adding 10,000 to 15,000 more seats that really aren't necessary. In another thread, I mentioned the look that App State has at their stadium opposite thier tower side. I got to see it this summer when I was in Boone, and it's pretty simple, but it would be an upgrade. How expensive it is, I've no idea. Their capacity is around that of Peden in the 23k range.


http://appalachianmagazine.org/sites/default/files/storie...

https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7398/11802847914_b6c803e3a4...

A two deck structure that seats 8,000 people and is 100 yards in length, that would look worse than UB's stadium.

Consider both they, and App State have a track in between the field and the stands. I think a two deck approach would be better because it would offer increased space for concourses, restrooms, concessions. Also has the potential to get more people closer to the field.
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ou79
9/20/2016 3:10 PM
Not a bad idea SBH about the north end zone. Just do something to make that area "blend" and look a little better. I understand about the Student Center, just too far into the project to change now.
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BillyTheCat
9/20/2016 11:08 PM
OU_Country wrote:expand_more
What some are ignoring is that tearing down the East stands is probably a cheaper alternative than providing the work needed over there.
And if that's the case, I say tear it down and build a simple, but functional two deck structure in it's place that has a similar capacity. I'm just not on board with the idea of adding 10,000 to 15,000 more seats that really aren't necessary. In another thread, I mentioned the look that App State has at their stadium opposite thier tower side. I got to see it this summer when I was in Boone, and it's pretty simple, but it would be an upgrade. How expensive it is, I've no idea. Their capacity is around that of Peden in the 23k range.


http://appalachianmagazine.org/sites/default/files/storie...

https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7398/11802847914_b6c803e3a4...

A two deck structure that seats 8,000 people and is 100 yards in length, that would look worse than UB's stadium.

Consider both they, and App State have a track in between the field and the stands. I think a two deck approach would be better because it would offer increased space for concourses, restrooms, concessions. Also has the potential to get more people closer to the field.
When you are averaging 16 rows per deck and it sits right upon tops the field, with no track, the angles will be steep and lead to being a non pleasant experience.
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RSBobcat
9/21/2016 1:09 AM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
What some are ignoring is that tearing down the East stands is probably a cheaper alternative than providing the work needed over there.
And if that's the case, I say tear it down and build a simple, but functional two deck structure in it's place that has a similar capacity. I'm just not on board with the idea of adding 10,000 to 15,000 more seats that really aren't necessary. In another thread, I mentioned the look that App State has at their stadium opposite thier tower side. I got to see it this summer when I was in Boone, and it's pretty simple, but it would be an upgrade. How expensive it is, I've no idea. Their capacity is around that of Peden in the 23k range.


http://appalachianmagazine.org/sites/default/files/storie...

https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7398/11802847914_b6c803e3a4...

A two deck structure that seats 8,000 people and is 100 yards in length, that would look worse than UB's stadium.

Consider both they, and App State have a track in between the field and the stands. I think a two deck approach would be better because it would offer increased space for concourses, restrooms, concessions. Also has the potential to get more people closer to the field.
When you are averaging 16 rows per deck and it sits right upon tops the field, with no track, the angles will be steep and lead to being a non pleasant experience.
But it's only for one half........
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100%Cat
9/21/2016 8:41 AM
OU_Country wrote:expand_more
What some are ignoring is that tearing down the East stands is probably a cheaper alternative than providing the work needed over there.
And if that's the case, I say tear it down and build a simple, but functional two deck structure in it's place that has a similar capacity. I'm just not on board with the idea of adding 10,000 to 15,000 more seats that really aren't necessary. In another thread, I mentioned the look that App State has at their stadium opposite thier tower side. I got to see it this summer when I was in Boone, and it's pretty simple, but it would be an upgrade. How expensive it is, I've no idea. Their capacity is around that of Peden in the 23k range.


http://appalachianmagazine.org/sites/default/files/storie...

https://c2.staticflickr.com/8/7398/11802847914_b6c803e3a4...

A two deck structure that seats 8,000 people and is 100 yards in length, that would look worse than UB's stadium.

Consider both they, and App State have a track in between the field and the stands. I think a two deck approach would be better because it would offer increased space for concourses, restrooms, concessions. Also has the potential to get more people closer to the field.
Restrooms? You mean that place with the troughs you pee in?
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OU_Country
9/21/2016 11:45 AM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
When you are averaging 16 rows per deck and it sits right upon tops the field, with no track, the angles will be steep and lead to being a non pleasant experience.

[/QUOTE]Help me understand how a little steeper angle is related to a non-pleasant experience? For many of us, it means we can see better. For the stadium, it might make it a little louder.




[QUOTE=100%Cat]

Restrooms? You mean that place with the troughs you pee in?

A change away from that would be a welcome one, I agree.
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Mark Lembright '85
9/21/2016 12:30 PM
SBH wrote:expand_more
I wonder if it is too late to rethink the proposed Student Center in the north end zone?

Answer: Yes, too late. It has taken years to get the funds/go-ahead. They're not going to change plans now.

I would like to see the corner sections extended down to the field along with a corresponding center section below the new academic center. Sort of complete the "bowl" configuration. Perhaps would add 1,500 seats as well.
+1
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