Ohio Football Topic
Topic: Skipping bowl games
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cbus cat fan
12/20/2016 11:37 PM
Thanks Allen for the info. Incoming players salaries have been pretty high for at least a couple of decades, I just wonder what was the straw that broke the camel's back to force all of this talk about skipping end of season conference/bowl games? Why now and not a couple of decades ago? If this is the trend, there is even going to be more fan consternation in the college football/NFL world.
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cc-cat
12/20/2016 11:55 PM
Unless you were outraged by Tom Herman leaving Houston for Texas before their bowl game (and at every other coach that has done the same thing for decades), you have no room to be outraged by what these players are doing.
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OhioStunter
12/21/2016 12:45 AM
Insurance policies aren't the silver bullet. In this case, the bowl game injury cost him about $15M -- even with insurance:

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2016/12/jaylon-smith-christian-mc...

If I offered all of you a truckload of cash totaling $15M -- enough to buy Court Street -- but I told you you had to play a bowl game first and not get injured, what would you do?
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ShoreCat
12/21/2016 7:45 AM
I can't quantify how many millions McCaffrey and Fournette made their respective schools. However, between jersey sales, putting butts in the seats, TV exposure, etc., they certainly played a part in earning money for their school. And yes, I know they received a full-ride education.

And "meaningless" is defined by the player. Neither of those players felt that playing in a lower-tier bowl game was worth the risk to their long-term future. I'm sure it would have been different if they were playing in a national championship game. I'm not saying that all bowl games are "meaningless". You can't apply to same standard to all players in all bowl games. It's an individual choice and I don't think they should be criticized for looking out for their long-term future.
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rpbobcat
12/21/2016 8:26 AM
When I first read about this I felt that the players were being selfish and not fair to their teammates.

No question its selfish on their part,but,it really isn't much different then a coach taking a job at another school and not coaching his team in their bowl game.
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Robert Fox
12/21/2016 8:31 AM
rpbobcat wrote:expand_more
When I first read about this I felt that the players were being selfish and not fair to their teammates.

No question its selfish on their part,but,it really isn't much different then a coach taking a job at another school and not coaching his team in their bowl game.
Agree it's no different. But I don't like either thing. They're both a sign of the times: me first.
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cbus cat fan
12/21/2016 8:49 AM
Well said Robert!
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rpbobcat
12/21/2016 9:03 AM
Robert Fox wrote:expand_more
When I first read about this I felt that the players were being selfish and not fair to their teammates.

No question its selfish on their part,but,it really isn't much different then a coach taking a job at another school and not coaching his team in their bowl game.
Agree it's no different. But I don't like either thing. They're both a sign of the times: me first.
I should have included that.
I don't like either thing either.(The grammar police will probably yell at me for that sentence)
Last Edited: 12/21/2016 9:04:21 AM by rpbobcat
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Good cat Good cat
12/21/2016 9:17 AM
Yes - I see both sides. Just depressing as to what things have evolved into.
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GoCats105
12/21/2016 9:18 AM
L.C. wrote:expand_more
...If I were an NFL coach I would think twice about Fournette for him doing this in the first place.....

Indeed, this is the flip side.

In any case, it's hard to fault the players, though, when the coaches started it first. If coaches can head off to a better job, rather that working a "meaningless bowl", why can't players do the same?
Ding and DING.

This is the question that NEVER gets brought up in the national media. Ever.
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GoCats105
12/21/2016 9:22 AM
Scott Woods wrote:expand_more
Had this game had some actual meaning to it (Playoff, NY6) I could see the reason for staying and playing, but not for this game. But the Citrus Bowl essentially is meaningless for a guy like him.
In the context of this discussion, how do the NY6 games have any more meaning than the other bowls?
I guess they really don't come to think of it. More lucrative payouts and more on the line I guess? Even then I still might not see an issue with the guy leaving.
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SBH
12/21/2016 9:59 AM
cc-cat wrote:expand_more
Unless you were outraged by Tom Herman leaving Houston for Texas before their bowl game (and at every other coach that has done the same thing for decades), you have no room to be outraged by what these players are doing.
Let's see, "Um, coach, because some other coaches at other programs used their contract provisions to bail on their players, I'm going to bail on you."

Seems like I learned a lesson about this back in third or fourth grade. Just a sad state of affairs.
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giacomo
12/21/2016 10:04 AM
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ShoreCat
12/21/2016 10:11 AM
If I was offered my dream job and had a chance to significantly improve my salary, I'd be gone in a heartbeat, no matter what commitment I've made to my co-workers. And they would do the same. Sorry if that comes across as selfish, but I've learned that if you don't look out for #1, nobody else will.

You may not like the current state of affairs, but you can't criticize McCaffrey and Fournette for doing what they did.
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Robert Fox
12/21/2016 10:16 AM
BayCat wrote:expand_more
You may not like the current state of affairs, but you can't criticize McCaffrey and Fournette for doing what they did.
Sure you can.
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Monroe Slavin
12/21/2016 10:24 AM
SBH wrote:expand_more
Unless you were outraged by Tom Herman leaving Houston for Texas before their bowl game (and at every other coach that has done the same thing for decades), you have no room to be outraged by what these players are doing.
Let's see, "Um, coach, because some other coaches at other programs used their contract provisions to bail on their players, I'm going to bail on you."

Seems like I learned a lesson about this back in third or fourth grade. Just a sad state of affairs.

You show poor business skills.

You say more inappropriate things than appropriate things.
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ShoreCat
12/21/2016 10:33 AM
I agree with Starkey's article but I don't agree with the blanket statement about "phony" bowl games. That's a case-by-case, personal assessment for each player and coach to make.

My guess is that no Ohio players are calling the Dollar General Bowl a "phony" bowl game. It's a chance for Basham to make a statement on national TV and improve his draft status.

But for McCaffrey and Fournette, the situations are completely different. I don't think their character should be questioned.
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Pataskala
12/21/2016 11:43 AM
BayCat wrote:expand_more
I agree with Starkey's article but I don't agree with the blanket statement about "phony" bowl games. That's a case-by-case, personal assessment for each player and coach to make.

My guess is that no Ohio players are calling the Dollar General Bowl a "phony" bowl game. It's a chance for Basham to make a statement on national TV and improve his draft status.

But for McCaffrey and Fournette, the situations are completely different. I don't think their character should be questioned.
I've seen coaches and teams who were so disappointed in not getting what is now a NY6 bowl, that they basically phoned in their performance in their own bowl. So I can see how some might view "lesser" bowls as "phony." And I can see how someone like Fournette -- who'd missed nearly half the season and had very sub-par performances in his last three games because of injury -- not want to screw up his NFL chances by making a high-ankle sprain even worse. And I guess any coach would think twice about having a player -- even one of McCaffrey's talent -- on his squad if the kid has already mentally moved on to the NFL. For our guys, the Mobile game is a chance to put a great end to a season and for some a career.
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cbus cat fan
12/21/2016 11:59 AM
Calling bowl games phony and seeing players skipping games is going to make some long for the days when there was no playoff and hordes of money to be made by a handful of schools.
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cc-cat
12/21/2016 12:05 PM
SBH wrote:expand_more
Unless you were outraged by Tom Herman leaving Houston for Texas before their bowl game (and at every other coach that has done the same thing for decades), you have no room to be outraged by what these players are doing.
Let's see, "Um, coach, because some other coaches at other programs used their contract provisions to bail on their players, I'm going to bail on you."

Seems like I learned a lesson about this back in third or fourth grade. Just a sad state of affairs.
Let's see, countless coaches bail on their team before their bowl game (and have done so for decades. And it is covered by "contract provision" - yet players start to make decisions based on their long-term opportunity and it is the fall of college athletics.
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Alan Swank
12/21/2016 12:14 PM
giacomo wrote:expand_more
When i first started this thread, I really didn't know exactly how I felt about skipping bowls. After reading all of these posts and this article, this paragraph pretty well sums it up:

The Sun Bowl?

Is that what we’re talking about here? A meaningless, made-for-television exhibition game that delivers a nice paycheck to the boss (Sun Bowl director Bernie Olivas made $158,500 in 2012) and to Stanford University ($2.15 million) but gives nothing to the players besides maybe a PlayStation, a refrigerator magnet and the sweet memory of playing in the Sun Bowl?
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bobcat695
12/21/2016 12:21 PM
SBH wrote:expand_more
So much for taking one for the team. What a sham college sports have become.
College in general is the last piece of education one receives before going into the workforce. For premier athletes that will be earning a living playing professionally, college sports is their interview.

No other workplace environment scrutinizes people's ascent to the top of their profession like sports. Players take a risk reducing their draft stock based on a perceived character flaw for skipping a bowl game, but I seriously doubt it would be anywhere close to the drop if they shredded an ACL in that game. There is a risk/reward component to almost every major life decision. It's selfish of me to watch the game from my couch and be critical of someone who is eliminating the biggest potential risk of financial ruin that faces them before they earn a lot of money. The academic piece of the argument means different things to different people. For professional athletes, college is more like a trade school than academic enrichment for lifetime learning.
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OU_Country
12/21/2016 3:06 PM
Monroe Slavin wrote:expand_more
Unless you were outraged by Tom Herman leaving Houston for Texas before their bowl game (and at every other coach that has done the same thing for decades), you have no room to be outraged by what these players are doing.
Let's see, "Um, coach, because some other coaches at other programs used their contract provisions to bail on their players, I'm going to bail on you."

Seems like I learned a lesson about this back in third or fourth grade. Just a sad state of affairs.

You show poor business skills.

You say more inappropriate things than appropriate things.
It doesn't always happen, but I totally agree with Monroe.

Blasting kids for this decision doesn't make much sense to me. The only people they owe anything to are their team, and their family. If those parties are okay with the decision, then there's not much more to be said in my opinion. Times change. Not every lesson I learned in 3rd grade applies anymore.

College Sports, if you think it's in a sad state of affairs, is there not because of these select few young men choosing to make this decision. Instead it is because of a greedy few university presidents and NCAA administrators who have taken the golden goose that is (or was, dependent on perspective) TV Money, and allowed it to rule every decision they've made for a decade or more. Now, these players are looking at that big rookie contract as their chance at a piece of the pie. For the sake of their health and future career, I get why they're doing this.
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GoCats105
12/21/2016 3:17 PM
OU_Country wrote:expand_more
Unless you were outraged by Tom Herman leaving Houston for Texas before their bowl game (and at every other coach that has done the same thing for decades), you have no room to be outraged by what these players are doing.
Let's see, "Um, coach, because some other coaches at other programs used their contract provisions to bail on their players, I'm going to bail on you."

Seems like I learned a lesson about this back in third or fourth grade. Just a sad state of affairs.

You show poor business skills.

You say more inappropriate things than appropriate things.



Blasting kids for this decision doesn't make much sense to me. The only people they owe anything to are their team, and their family. If those parties are okay with the decision, then there's not much more to be said in my opinion.
This is the thing I don't get. Stanford players have come out and said they totally support McCaffrey's decision. Yet somehow people think he's letting them down? OK.
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OU_Country
12/21/2016 3:19 PM
Robert Fox wrote:expand_more
You may not like the current state of affairs, but you can't criticize McCaffrey and Fournette for doing what they did.
Sure you can. [/QUOTE]
You can, but the only people looking bad are the ones doing the criticizing.


[QUOTE=cc-cat]

Let's see, countless coaches bail on their team before their bowl game (and have done so for decades. And it is covered by "contract provision" - yet players start to make decisions based on their long-term opportunity and it is the fall of college athletics.
Exactly. If it's okay for Tom Herman, or Brian Kelly to bail on their teams before a bowl game - i.e. THE PAID ADULTS - then a player shouldn't be held to any different of a standard.
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