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Ohio Football Topic
Topic: Wins over the last 10 years
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TWT
2/18/2017 11:31 PM
NIU 82
Ohio 75
Toledo 74
BGSU 68
CMU 67
WMU 66

Out of curiosity I decided to look at how many wins the top programs in the MAC had over the past decade. Solich takes a lot of flack on here for not winning the MACC but you've got to say 7.5 wins a year is doing a good job when its better than Toledo and BGSU over that time frame. BTW Toledo hasn't won division title over the past 10 years. Fleck averaged 9.7 wins a year in his final 3 seasons at WMU (13,8,8) and that I would say is a great job. With everyone bunched at the top interesting to see the outcomes. NIU and WMU made New Year's Bowls. BGSU and CMU won a couple of MACCs. Ohio won 4 MAC East titles.
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Monroe Slavin
2/19/2017 3:46 AM
More splinter, irrelevant fact analysis.

First, the goal is a MAC title. We play in the MAC.

Second, look at our schedule every year. Routinely packed with 4-7 teams which it would be difficult to lose to.


But, okay, keep being satisfied with the mediocrity.
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Bobcat1996
2/19/2017 7:49 AM
Maybe the poster above would prefer the Bobcats go back to the good old days where ten wins in five years was what fans could expect? Ignore his constant rants. He mocks the football program for playing a poor schedule but the basketball team does the same thing and nothing is said. Both programs are trying to schedule for success. The basketball program schedules many home games that are not exactly NCAA powers so they can have an opportunity to get to a post season tourney. The same with the football program as they want to play in a bowl game yearly. The Bobcats football program has improved drastically since Frank was hired. There are a many schools that would love to enjoy the consistency that Ohio University has accomplished the past ten plus seasons.
Last Edited: 2/19/2017 7:51:20 AM by Bobcat1996
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Buckeye to Bobcat
2/19/2017 12:50 PM
Bobcat1996 wrote:expand_more
Maybe the poster above would prefer the Bobcats go back to the good old days where ten wins in five years was what fans could expect? Ignore his constant rants. He mocks the football program for playing a poor schedule but the basketball team does the same thing and nothing is said. Both programs are trying to schedule for success. The basketball program schedules many home games that are not exactly NCAA powers so they can have an opportunity to get to a post season tourney. The same with the football program as they want to play in a bowl game yearly. The Bobcats football program has improved drastically since Frank was hired. There are a many schools that would love to enjoy the consistency that Ohio University has accomplished the past ten plus seasons.
The difference is one ACTUALLY wins a title while the other doesn't. Compare since 1969 how many MAC Titles basketball has versus football. NBD
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Jeff McKinney
2/19/2017 1:48 PM
Bobcat1996 wrote:expand_more
Maybe the poster above would prefer the Bobcats go back to the good old days where ten wins in five years was what fans could expect? Ignore his constant rants. He mocks the football program for playing a poor schedule but the basketball team does the same thing and nothing is said. Both programs are trying to schedule for success. The basketball program schedules many home games that are not exactly NCAA powers so they can have an opportunity to get to a post season tourney. The same with the football program as they want to play in a bowl game yearly. The Bobcats football program has improved drastically since Frank was hired. There are a many schools that would love to enjoy the consistency that Ohio University has accomplished the past ten plus seasons.
I think the basketball scheduling is done mainly to satisfy MAC requirements for number of home games. It's hard to get strength of schedule up at a mid major under those conditions. Participation in the Charleston, SC, tournament next year is an effort to upgrade the schedule.
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Monroe Slavin
2/19/2017 1:49 PM
You want to make your stand, your standard, that we are better than the years when we won 17 games in 11 years?

So, playing football and playing it in the MAC, winning a MAC title should not be the goal?


You can dislike me all you want. But that will not change the facts.
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TWT
2/19/2017 3:52 PM
Jeff McKinney wrote:expand_more
Maybe the poster above would prefer the Bobcats go back to the good old days where ten wins in five years was what fans could expect? Ignore his constant rants. He mocks the football program for playing a poor schedule but the basketball team does the same thing and nothing is said. Both programs are trying to schedule for success. The basketball program schedules many home games that are not exactly NCAA powers so they can have an opportunity to get to a post season tourney. The same with the football program as they want to play in a bowl game yearly. The Bobcats football program has improved drastically since Frank was hired. There are a many schools that would love to enjoy the consistency that Ohio University has accomplished the past ten plus seasons.
I think the basketball scheduling is done mainly to satisfy MAC requirements for number of home games. It's hard to get strength of schedule up at a mid major under those conditions. Participation in the Charleston, SC, tournament next year is an effort to upgrade the schedule.
2009-10 was the first year of Ohio loading up on home non-conference games with 8 of them that year. That was long before the MAC mandated 6 home game schedules. In the year before that Ohio had Temple, St. Bonaventure, Maryland, Kansas, St. John's and St. Mary's all in one year. Home scheduling has resulted in more wins for Ohio. Wins should translate into recruiting and fans.
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TWT
2/19/2017 4:06 PM
Bobcat1996 wrote:expand_more
The Bobcats football program has improved drastically since Frank was hired. There are a many schools that would love to enjoy the consistency that Ohio University has accomplished the past ten plus seasons.
Solich's pay ranks 36th out of 60 G5 coaches so to be #2 in wins in the MAC over the last 10 is good for value for the dollar. If at best a coach could walk into Athens and win 10 a year for 4-5 seasons before moving on what Frank is giving us is not bad.
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TWT
2/19/2017 5:36 PM
Monroe Slavin wrote:expand_more
You want to make your stand, your standard, that we are better than the years when we won 17 games in 11 years?

So, playing football and playing it in the MAC, winning a MAC title should not be the goal?
Don't you think its as much about the National TV appearances and being in the conference race as it is to winning every game? That we start every season with the potential to play in a New Year's Bowl with a conference race and then if Ohio is out that a bowl game? The way it was in the 80's and 90's there was no bowl unless you won the MAC. The season was usually over before homecoming. You must be one of those frustrated fans of years past who can't realize times have changed. If he was paid $4 million a year and not winning the MAC I can see grounds for anger but he isn't bad for the buck. Back-2-back 8 win seasons means he isn't going anywhere soon as a lot of us thought after he coughed up 6-6 in 2014. The department doesn't have Frank under a long term contract anymore. He's on an annual rollover with his assistants. That means no more salary increases as long as he's here. We've been too hard on him all things considered.
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Bobcat1996
2/19/2017 7:42 PM
Buckeye to Bobcat- I would suggest that the Bobcats in the last fifty years have been known as a basketball school and not a football powerhouse. Bobcat football at one time in the 1980's was the bottom of the barrel of the NCAA and I would argue that Ohio basketball has never sunk that low in that time span. Bobcat fans root for both programs, but the football program has gone through some difficult stretches compared to the hoops program. Some alumni may think that the football program has had to climb " much farther out of the basement so to speak." The MAC regular season outright titles in basketball since Larry Hunter left in the early 90's have been few and far between. The coach who is now at BC tied for the regular season but was the two seed at the MAC tourney, so basically no MAC championships in the regular season have been won outright in basketball. Football doesn't have the same opportunity to win tourney titles as sometimes an #8 seed wins in basketball. The 8 seed in football has no shot at a league championship. The two sports are different as in hoops if a team gets hot for three games in March they can claim a tourney championship and advance to the NCAA. As a "Buckeye to Bobcat" fan you must understand how the fans who cheer on that team in Columbus feel when the Buckeyes play poorly in basketball. Take this season for example. How many of those fans would be calling for the football coaches head if the Buckeyes were 5-9 in the conference in football and struggling to stay above .500? I hope that all Ohio University programs enjoy success each year and that success doesn't have to always equal a MAC title. I'm sure that even though Saul and his team didn't win the MAC last year in hoops they were excited with their 23 wins.
Last Edited: 2/19/2017 7:54:51 PM by Bobcat1996
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L.C.
2/19/2017 7:52 PM
Uncle Wes wrote:expand_more
... The department doesn't have Frank under a long term contract anymore. He's on an annual rollover with his assistants. That means no more salary increases as long as he's here. We've been too hard on him all things considered.

If it also mean no raises for the assistants, that would help explain the recent attrition. Hopefully that isn't it.
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TWT
2/19/2017 8:37 PM
L.C. wrote:expand_more
... The department doesn't have Frank under a long term contract anymore. He's on an annual rollover with his assistants. That means no more salary increases as long as he's here. We've been too hard on him all things considered.

If it also mean no raises for the assistants, that would help explain the recent attrition. Hopefully that isn't it.
Could be because a new contract with increased raise pool for assistants is not in the cards. Solich, Albin and Burrow must be at a consensus that it's alright. Solich and Burrow are close to retirement. Albin's offenses haven't performed at a high level so he's stuck.
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Bobcat1996
2/19/2017 8:58 PM
"Seven of the 10 smallest assistant salary pools are in the MAC.

Among publicly-available info, New Mexico State has the lowest assistant pool, at $707,608. After NMSU, the lowest pools are at Kent State, Bowling Green, UMass, Eastern Michigan, Miami (OH), Southern Miss, Akron, Ohio and Northern Illinois, all of which are below $925,000."

This article was pasted from The USA Today in Dec. of 2016 and may be a bit out dated. However the salaries couldn't have changed that much and I would suggest that the Bobcat assistants are in the middle of the pack MAC salary wise, but according to the stat posted above second in wins the last ten seasons behind only NIU. Is the coaching staff satisfied with their achievements over the last ten years? Probably not. Could they do better? Yes. Could it be worse? For sure. No doubt many alums can recall the past programs that won two or fewer games yearly. Ohio University doesn't pay top dollar for their coaching staff and is behind many league schools in assistant pay. However the Bobcats have the second most wins in the last ten seasons according to the poster above. If one would listen to a few Bobcat Attack posters, you would think that the football program is one of the worst in the NCAA. Maybe these negative posters would prefer the Bobcats go back to the 1980's?
Last Edited: 2/19/2017 9:32:53 PM by Bobcat1996
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The Optimist
2/19/2017 9:09 PM
Monroe Slavin wrote:expand_more
More splinter, irrelevant fact analysis.

First, the goal is a MAC title. We play in the MAC.

Second, look at our schedule every year. Routinely packed with 4-7 teams which it would be difficult to lose to.


But, okay, keep being satisfied with the mediocrity.
We play in FBS.

The goal is a national title.

You have mediocre standards.
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TWT
2/19/2017 9:21 PM
Bobcat1996 wrote:expand_more
Buckeye to Bobcat- I would suggest that the Bobcats in the last fifty years have been known as a basketball school and not a football powerhouse. Bobcat football at one time in the 1980's was the bottom of the barrel of the NCAA and I would argue that Ohio basketball has never sunk that low in that time span. Bobcat fans root for both programs, but the football program has gone through some difficult stretches compared to the hoops program. Some alumni may think that the football program has had to climb " much farther out of the basement so to speak."
Forget everything you know and look at the small Athens market. Purely on size of the market Ohio should be a program with a 10,000 seat stadium with a 4,000 seat basketball gym. A top 200 division 1 program. I knew a student while I was there, very bright student who thought if we did make the NCAA tournament it would be as a 16 seed. Lowest we've ever been seeded is 14 I believe but the point is the size of Athens reinforces the idea that it's a small athletic school. That is not reality as it's G5 school located in a good recruiting state. Then an atmosphere centered around student weekends and the 110 is in place that is the best in the MAC for basketball and football. The liberal braintrust of this school though will only allow prices and spending to go so high. Ticket prices are kept down so families can afford. We won't price our fans out of the stadium the way Boise State did. OU wouldn't put up the $2 million required to keep Groce after the sweet 16. Without the will to keep basketball coaches recruiting will never get to the point where Ohio can be playing for a Final Four. Football can make a New Year's bowl WITHOUT having to go overboard on the coaches. The athletic difference between Kansas basketball and Ohio basketball is staggering. The athletic difference between Kansas football and Ohio football is minimal. Size, weights, accolades minimal difference. Basketball you're giving up 18" on the vertical leap per player. OU is not going to pay 5 million to bring in Larry Brown and ensure we make the NCAA tournament as an at large.
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L.C.
2/19/2017 10:11 PM
The Optimist wrote:expand_more
We play in FBS.

The goal is a national title.

You have mediocre standards.

Wait, I thought that the goal of the FCS (Football Championship School) was to win a Championship? Based on nomenclature, isn't the goal of an FBS (Football Bowl School) to go to a bowl game?
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Monroe Slavin
2/20/2017 12:26 PM
Wes--You'd be okay with a coach leaving us after he won 10 games for 4-5 years? Solich has done it once in 12. But his performance at OHIO is now acceptable?

Note that in the list of lowest coaching staff pay-pools there appear to be six MAC schools below us. Again between the weak out of conf sched and the weak MAC sched, 7.5 wins a year is not a noteworthy accomplishment.
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allen
2/20/2017 12:49 PM
Solich's success will be tied to winning a MAC, he has beat the cupcakes and won some good noncoference and conference games, but so has almost every other MAC coach. I am hoping for big things in the next two years. FS loyalty may come back to bite him. he has been loyal to Abin and other even though they have underperformed. FS will either be rewarded or burned by his loyalty.
Last Edited: 2/20/2017 1:20:36 PM by allen
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Deciduous Forest Cat
2/20/2017 1:16 PM
Monroe Slavin wrote:expand_more
Wes--You'd be okay with a coach leaving us after he won 10 games for 4-5 years? Solich has done it once in 12. But his performance at OHIO is now acceptable?

Note that in the list of lowest coaching staff pay-pools there appear to be six MAC schools below us. Again between the weak out of conf sched and the weak MAC sched, 7.5 wins a year is not a noteworthy accomplishment.
Yes, we could do better, and I wish we did, but when you consider that these our our peer athletic schools (resources, fans, budget and talent that all MAC coaches say is very close across the board), You can't say we're bad because we win the games in front of us.

Again, what is your point? What is your end game? If we just all tell you're right, will you stop poisoning every thread on this board with your ... you-ness?
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Robert Fox
2/20/2017 1:31 PM
There are no cupcakes for Ohio football, at least not in the MAC. I'm not sure there are cupcakes for any MAC school. Parity in this conference is pretty tight. A genuine cupcake match-up, in my mind, requires a top-level P5 team taking on a mid-major or lower.

When Ohio beats its MAC brethren, you can't discount that and say we're playing cupcakes. We're playing our peers. Our talent peers. Our budgetary peers.
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allen
2/20/2017 1:42 PM
Robert Fox wrote:expand_more
There are no cupcakes for Ohio football, at least not in the MAC. I'm not sure there are cupcakes for any MAC school. Parity in this conference is pretty tight. A genuine cupcake match-up, in my mind, requires a top-level P5 team taking on a mid-major or lower.

When Ohio beats its MAC brethren, you can't discount that and say we're playing cupcakes. We're playing our peers. Our talent peers. Our budgetary peers.
Obviously we view the MAC different, there have been years when MAC teams have lost every MAC game, we always play the teams with losing records. The MAC East has been pretty weak besides us and Bowling Green. We can't lie to ourselves. Gardner Webb and Hampton are cupcakes. If we deal in truth, the oppostition won't have a voice, but if we lie to ourselves, the critics points become loud and clear. We have had some good wins, there is no denying that, but we have had some bad losses and debacles as well. This in my opinion was FS best year. We lost Sprague and Windham and all of our running backs and 10 db's and won the east. FS benched people, he criticized the coaching at time. He lit fires, he went for it on ffourth down and we almost won the MAC with a substandard QB and all of those injuries. Marsterful job besides EMU and Texas State. EMU will be good, but we have to win that game at home. I give FS an A- for this year. We needed to get better qb's and better athletes and I think we did that this year. Maybe Maxwell can fend off the competition, but he will have to be good to do it.
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Alan Swank
2/20/2017 2:23 PM
Robert Fox wrote:expand_more
There are no cupcakes for Ohio football, at least not in the MAC. I'm not sure there are cupcakes for any MAC school. Parity in this conference is pretty tight. A genuine cupcake match-up, in my mind, requires a top-level P5 team taking on a mid-major or lower.

When Ohio beats its MAC brethren, you can't discount that and say we're playing cupcakes. We're playing our peers. Our talent peers. Our budgetary peers.
Does the big 10 have cupcakes when it comes to football?
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allen
2/20/2017 2:55 PM
yes of course, we are playing on this year. Purdue, throw in Minnesota and Rutgers.Good point Alan
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Robert Fox
2/20/2017 3:14 PM
Alan Swank wrote:expand_more
Does the big 10 have cupcakes when it comes to football?
Not for Ohio. And to my point earlier, not so much for the top of the Big 10 either. Sometimes its a beat down, but often times, not.
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allen
2/20/2017 3:41 PM
Every conference has heavy weights and lightweights and sometimes change, we used to be a cupcake before coach Grobe came here. We can play semantics, but we all look at the schedule and count wins, the MAC East has now caught up to us, so it will be a lot more difficult, but cupcakes will be cupcakes. Can a cupcake give a good team a scare, of course. One any given saturday a team can get beat, but their are games every year where we are and should be heavily favored and that is without a dynamic QB. Ben Roethlisberger made us a cupcake. Our the last few years on offense has been our QB and on defense we have have had one corner, but we haven't had that dynamic dual like Bop White and Chip Cox. We need to have another dennis fitzgerald, brandon cade, marc stubbs, Tevel jones and Sean Williams defensive backfield. I believe we have guys with more potential than them coming in. We have recruited a no fly zone now we have to let them compete and let the best players play and hopefully we have addressed our QB situation.
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