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Ohio Basketball Topic
Topic: Official Game 1 Thread: Wilberforce
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OUBobcat13
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Posted: 11/7/2018 11:16 PM
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FearLeon wrote:expand_more
OR...perhaps the freshman are playing better or are further along than expected. Maybe he WAS recruited to contribute more than 9 minutes to give freshman more time to develop. OR perhaps the thought was he could develop this year to possibly fill the hole Block leaves.

Basically, I think your argument and rationale is ignorant at best.
ohio9704
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Posted: 11/7/2018 11:17 PM
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I liked Vander Plas and Preston a lot. Murrell missed his shots, but stroke does look good, rail thin. Carter and Kirk will need to carry this team early, but can be hopeful with the pieces in this group. Think I will like this team better in 365 days with a year of growth. Think this group will grow throughout the year. They better for our HC.
OU_Country
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Posted: 11/8/2018 12:17 AM
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ohio9704 wrote:expand_more
I liked Vander Plas and Preston a lot. Murrell missed his shots, but stroke does look good, rail thin. Carter and Kirk will need to carry this team early, but can be hopeful with the pieces in this group. Think I will like this team better in 365 days with a year of growth. Think this group will grow throughout the year. They better for our HC.
In 365 days, we won't have Taylor, Dartis or Block after graduation.
allen
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Posted: 11/8/2018 2:54 AM
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FearLeon wrote:expand_more
Very concerned about outside shooting without Dartis or Gollon. You have to figure opponents will stack the paint and make us shoot from outside.
This^^^^. Who is going to make the outside shot consistently with these guys out? And Murrell didn't get into the game until 9 minutes left? Please tell me we didn't recruit a JUCO shooting guard who can't even crack the rotation with Dartis and Gollon sidelined???
You mean the guy that had 9pts, 5 ast, and 4 boards?
Yes...9 points in garbage time against an NAIA school. You totally missed my point. Very early...but he doesn’t appear to be in the rotation.
He started and played 23 minutes.

Jeesh...what part of Murrell did you guys miss with my post? I'm not talking about Cowart.
You stated "tell me we didnt recruit a JUCO SG that cant crack the rotation". You implied Saul cant recruit. I'm pointing out that we got 2 JUCOs, and I believe Murrell was recruited as a SF. Cowart, I believe, is going to be very good. I dont think we should be too worried about our 3 point shooting after 1 game. Would you be making these same statements if he hd gone 2-4 from 3?
When you recruit a JUCO...you do so with the expectation that he will contribute right away. My point with Murrell....and I know it's only one game...is that it's not a good sign if he's getting in with only 9 minutes left against an NAIA school. Especially when he's supposedly one of the best shooters on the team and we have our two best 3 point shooters sidelined with injuries. That is my point.
Murrell was the 10th or 11th man last year and he had a foot injury. The good news is that if his shot ever starts falling, he can give us some good minutes. BVP looks like he can give us good minutes at the four and he seems to have a nice stroke. Dartis would be a great drive and kick guy for Kirk and cowart. Saul has a pleothra of ball handlers that can creat their own shot. Hopefully we can get dartis and gollon back and block has a better year shooting the basketball. The clock may run out on Saul, with other teams looking like they have leveled up.
Bobcat1998
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Posted: 11/8/2018 6:54 AM
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I liked what I saw from McMurray and James. James seems smooth and athletic. His outside shot didn't look bad so maybe he can be a guy who can shoot. McMurray hustles and looks comfortable already. If Dartis and Gollon can't come back for some reason I definitely feel like we've got capable guys 9 deep with Murrell being No. 10 who can contribute. I didn't feel that way the past few years with guys who ultimately transferred.
shabamon
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Posted: 11/8/2018 7:31 AM
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Having McMurray and James serviceable in the rotation is huge for bridging the gap until when/if Dartis and Gollon return.

No minutes for Springs in an NAIA blowout. Clear that unless there's an emergency, he's redshirting.
100%Cat
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Posted: 11/8/2018 7:36 AM
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Who was that guy the other day gloating on Murrell making every shot in warmups? Oh yea, me. Then he gets in for 9 minutes and goes 0-6 and a few of the misses were putrid. Yikes.
GoCats105
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Posted: 11/8/2018 8:09 AM
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A few things to keep in mind with Murrell:

-He was a PG in high school and grew to where he is now in the past 2 years, like 3 or 4 inches. I've never had a growth spurt like that, but I have to imagine it's not easy getting used to.

-allen already mentioned the foot injury, which he had surgery for in May. Probably still some slow recovery.

-He's not a normal JUCO. He's a redshirt sophomore. I think I would expect more from a JUCO Junior or Senior, but we've got a year to get him acclimated.

-Plus, once (if) Jimmy G and Jordy come back, where are the minutes for him anyway? Cowart, BVP, Preston and James all look ready to go. There are only so many minutes to go around. Unless we end up redshirting one of the freshmen other than Springs, but I can't see that happening as of today.
bigtillyoopsupsideurhead
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Posted: 11/8/2018 8:20 AM
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FearLeon wrote:expand_more
When you recruit a JUCO...you do so with the expectation that he will contribute right away. My point with Murrell....and I know it's only one game...is that it's not a good sign if he's getting in with only 9 minutes left against an NAIA school. Especially when he's supposedly one of the best shooters on the team and we have our two best 3 point shooters sidelined with injuries. That is my point.
Not all 13 guys are going to play, why does it matter if the last guy on the bench is a Freshman or a Sophomore. If Murrell was getting James or Preston's minutes would you just be complaining that Saul whiffed on those guys?
GoCats105
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Posted: 11/8/2018 8:22 AM
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Other thoughts:

-Having BVP and Carter on the floor at the same time is going to be fun to watch. Two really smart, heady players who know where the ball is supposed to go. Both look really good on defense too picking up rotations and hedging.

-Love what Cowart is bringing to the table. He could have a quietly great season. If defenses are focusing on stopping Dartis, Taylor, TK and Carter, Cowart could be right there as Ohio's ace in the hole.

-If we get solid, active minutes from TJ and McMurray off the bench I think we'll be happy. It's like having two freshmen year Ivo Baltics out there. Clean up the glass, play good D, get easy buckets when you can.

-Kinda loving the all-white uniform look with the socks and shoes on some of the guys. Was I the only one who caught that? Seems like we've always had dark shoes lately.

-Looked like the scoreboard was being run with player stats and replays. Anyone know how it was used for promotions during TOs?
FearLeon
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Posted: 11/8/2018 8:28 AM
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bigtillyoopsupsideurhead wrote:expand_more
When you recruit a JUCO...you do so with the expectation that he will contribute right away. My point with Murrell....and I know it's only one game...is that it's not a good sign if he's getting in with only 9 minutes left against an NAIA school. Especially when he's supposedly one of the best shooters on the team and we have our two best 3 point shooters sidelined with injuries. That is my point.
Not all 13 guys are going to play, why does it matter if the last guy on the bench is a Freshman or a Sophomore. If Murrell was getting James or Preston's minutes would you just be complaining that Saul whiffed on those guys?
Nobody said there is a "whiff" here. Just a game one observation on where he looks to be rotation wise.
shabamon
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Posted: 11/8/2018 8:33 AM
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GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
Other thoughts:

-Love what Cowart is bringing to the table. He could have a quietly great season. If defenses are focusing on stopping Dartis, Taylor, TK and Carter, Cowart could be right there as Ohio's ace in the hole.
Cowart is exactly the kind of player we needed, in a few different ways.
shabamon
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Posted: 11/8/2018 8:40 AM
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Box score observations:

-Jason Carter attempting nine free throws when he's neither a slasher nor an uber-athlete is really, really good.

-Only nine fouls against us is also a good sign. Can't draw any conclusions against low competition, but it's a good sign nonetheless.

-21 assists on 39 made baskets - room for improvement, but it was an improvement from Rio. To be fair, there were lots of second chance points scored.
ohio9704
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Posted: 11/8/2018 9:04 AM
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OU_Country wrote:expand_more
I liked Vander Plas and Preston a lot. Murrell missed his shots, but stroke does look good, rail thin. Carter and Kirk will need to carry this team early, but can be hopeful with the pieces in this group. Think I will like this team better in 365 days with a year of growth. Think this group will grow throughout the year. They better for our HC.
In 365 days, we won't have Taylor, Dartis or Block after graduation.
I get that, but as a group they will be better with the pieces thay arent seniors in 365 days. Block has become a role player, Taylor seems to be the same player each year (a little better each year from knee injury in HS), and I dont count any Dartis impact until he hits the floor. I think the core of freshmen and sophomores have a lot to like and a lot of room to grow.
longtiimelurker
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Posted: 11/8/2018 9:16 AM
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100%Cat wrote:expand_more
Who was that guy the other day gloating on Murrell making every shot in warmups? Oh yea, me. Then he gets in for 9 minutes and goes 0-6 and a few of the misses were putrid. Yikes.
I like a guy who admits he might have been wr, wro, er Not right. Hope you are wrong about being not right going forward.
OU_Country
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Posted: 11/8/2018 9:29 AM
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bigtillyoopsupsideurhead wrote:expand_more
Can anyone tell me why this game is at the same time as our football game against Miami?

Are they trying to ensure no one shows up or watches?

Just a puzzling dumb decision.
Instead of on Saturday, when at least some people would come because it's a day in Athens on campus...(scratches head).
You're aware that the opponent has to agree to the date/time as well, right?
And it would have been devastating if Wilberforce backed out. Seriously, tell them we're playing on Thursday or the game's off. It would have made more sense to play at 5 pm today even.
Exactly - its WILBERFORCE, and Ohio is likely paying them to be there, right? There's no way there isn't someone that would have played on Thurs/Fri/Sat that is a non-D1 school. Arkley commented to me that the two teams don't check each other's schedules when making them. In this case, they should. The Miami football game Ohio had no control over. This game, Ohio did. So they got to play what probably amounted to a secret scrimmage in front of nearly no one while the football team played a big game.
OU_Country
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Posted: 11/8/2018 9:40 AM
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I didn't get to see the game, but it's good to read all the positive comments about many of the new faces. Looking forward to seeing how we play against and guard Clemens from Campbell on Monday.
cc-cat
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Posted: 11/8/2018 10:51 AM
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No Springs in box score.

Was he dressed? Has he already officially taken a red shirt (though he could have played last night regardless).
GoCats105
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Posted: 11/8/2018 11:15 AM
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cc-cat wrote:expand_more
No Springs in box score.

Was he dressed? Has he already officially taken a red shirt (though he could have played last night regardless).
He dressed. I think we can all put 2+2 together.
OUVan
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Posted: 11/8/2018 12:19 PM
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cc-cat wrote:expand_more
No Springs in box score.

Was he dressed? Has he already officially taken a red shirt (though he could have played last night regardless).
I think he's been a planned redshirt from day one. The size and athleticism is intriguing but he's a project. I like that he looked engaged and positive.
Bobcat1998
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Posted: 11/8/2018 12:20 PM
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GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
Other thoughts:

-Having BVP and Carter on the floor at the same time is going to be fun to watch. Two really smart, heady players who know where the ball is supposed to go. Both look really good on defense too picking up rotations and hedging.

-Love what Cowart is bringing to the table. He could have a quietly great season. If defenses are focusing on stopping Dartis, Taylor, TK and Carter, Cowart could be right there as Ohio's ace in the hole.

-If we get solid, active minutes from TJ and McMurray off the bench I think we'll be happy. It's like having two freshmen year Ivo Baltics out there. Clean up the glass, play good D, get easy buckets when you can.

-Kinda loving the all-white uniform look with the socks and shoes on some of the guys. Was I the only one who caught that? Seems like we've always had dark shoes lately.

-Looked like the scoreboard was being run with player stats and replays. Anyone know how it was used for promotions during TOs?
I agree about BVP and Carter. You know what shows me BVP is going to be special? He spent a year redshirted and has definitely put the work into molding his body and getting in shape. Look at the guys who have not made it here. Loved the energy from Ellis Dozier the last few years but dude never looked any different strength wise from year to year. That shows dedication. Carter is going to be MAC POY by next year if not this year!

Cowart looks to me like he's doing the right thing: trying to hold back a bit to find his place. That's a JUCO vet. Once he discovers that he is able to go buck wild he is going to be Walt Lite at the very least.

Love the 2nd lineup with subs we had last night after the start with Kirk (6-4), Cowart (rangy 6-2), Block (6-7), Carter (6-8) and BVP (6-8). Also loved that when they went into a zone our young guys looked awesome passing. Saw McMurray, James and Preston cutting, making extra passes and moving the ball. Saw our vets trusting these guys as well.

Once again, it's only Wilberforce but I feel like we have 9 solid bodies where at this point last year we had 6!!!!
cc-cat
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Posted: 11/8/2018 12:25 PM
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OUVan wrote:expand_more
No Springs in box score.

Was he dressed? Has he already officially taken a red shirt (though he could have played last night regardless).
I think he's been a planned redshirt from day one. The size and athleticism is intriguing but he's a project. I like that he looked engaged and positive.
No question. But why not let him play in these games - can still protect his redshirt but allow him a bit of a taste. Though understand we are trying to get s look at those who will be on the active roster.
Last Edited: 11/8/2018 12:26:39 PM by cc-cat
OUVan
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Posted: 11/8/2018 12:25 PM
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GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
-Having BVP and Carter on the floor at the same time is going to be fun to watch. Two really smart, heady players who know where the ball is supposed to go. Both look really good on defense too picking up rotations and hedging.
I found myself thinking that BVP, James and Preston had very good coaching before they got to Ohio. Can see the offense running through BVP at the high post.
Kevin Finnegan
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Posted: 11/8/2018 12:26 PM
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Does college basketball have a change in their redshirt policy like football does? I know in football, you can appear in 4 games and still be redshirted. Is there a similar formula in hoops?
cc-cat
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Posted: 11/8/2018 12:31 PM
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finnOhio wrote:expand_more
Does college basketball have a change in their redshirt policy like football does? I know in football, you can appear in 4 games and still be redshirted. Is there a similar formula in hoops?
Good question - quick search showed up the following:

For an athlete to receive a standard redshirt, the NCAA requires that player not be involved in any competition for the year he is redshirted. Any amount of competition time, even 1 minute on a basketball court during a regular season game, for example, counts as a season of eligibility.

Assuming it is still the case - answers my question why he did not play.
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