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Ohio Basketball Topic
Topic: Is Saul Phillips really the right fit for Ohio ?
Page: 6 of 6
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FearLeon
6/4/2018 1:58 PM
Recovering Journalist wrote:expand_more
I would also be surprised if the next coach wasn't an up and comer like Groce was when he was hired. Strong assistant at a Power 5 school. They should also look at Boals for his ties to Ohio and ability to recruit the state. Plus, you can't put a price tag on the head coaching experience he's getting now.
You can't call for Saul's head and pine for Jeff Boals at the same time. He just went 13-19 in the America East Conference.
I never said I was "pining" or "begging" for Boals. But I doubt I'm the only one on this board who doesn't think Ohio should at least give him a call when the time comes.
Last Edited: 6/4/2018 1:59:54 PM by FearLeon
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BobcatSports
6/4/2018 4:33 PM
As the Powers to Be struggle with cutting costs jacking up tuition and room and board may prove to be tough. A survey today in Cleveland.com lists the most expensive public colleges in Ohio combining in-state tuition and room and board.

OUr beloved institution ranks second at about 23 grand a year trailing Khaki U by about 6 grand. I’m stunned there hasn’t been an outrage from the masses to give them an option to opt out of student fees supporting athletics when even an honest eyeball test shows the overwhelming majority of the student body gives a rat’s -ss about attending these athletic endeavors which supposedly are in place to “enhance” the collegiate experience.

Long story short we aren’t buying out Saul or anyone else anytime soon. IF Saul is not extended I believe he will be allowed to finish his contract and then be told good luck in your future endeavors. I would then expect Schaus will be instructed to look for a much lower paid up and comer OR a discarded retread looking for any opportunity at a bargain price. Schaus swung for the fences with the Saul hire. IF he doesn’t work out and the jury is certainly out I’m of the opinion Sshaus will be dealing with far less money latitude on his next search.
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FearLeon
6/4/2018 5:44 PM
BobcatSports wrote:expand_more
IF Saul is not extended I believe he will be allowed to finish his contract and then be told good luck in your future endeavors.

Umm...Saul is entering the 5th and final year of a 5 year contract. It's pretty simple...he's either signing a new contract after next season or getting fired. He's currently being allowed to finish out his contract right now.
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TWT
6/4/2018 6:43 PM
BobcatSports wrote:expand_more
Long story short we aren’t buying out Saul or anyone else anytime soon. IF Saul is not extended I believe he will be allowed to finish his contract and then be told good luck in your future endeavors. I would then expect Schaus will be instructed to look for a much lower paid up and comer OR a discarded retread looking for any opportunity at a bargain price. Schaus swung for the fences with the Saul hire. IF he doesn’t work out and the jury is certainly out I’m of the opinion Sshaus will be dealing with far less money latitude on his next search.
I don't see that. The low majors are spending 300k on coaches these days. What is a bargain price for OU's competitive level? Its about what we are spending now. For that reason I expect Schaus to hang on to Saul a few extra years.
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TWT
6/4/2018 6:55 PM
Recovering Journalist wrote:expand_more
First, I completely agree with the sentiment of your post.

Can you explain briefly the enrollment, financial struggles, and cuts you mention? I quickly searched the enrollment issue looks like 1 year decline with at least a decade of record growth before that, right? Since moving out of state I don't seem to catch these news articles as much anymore. Are there projections for additional decline? Have there been new cuts or are you referring to the athletic program cuts from ~2006?
Here's a recent story on cuts:
https://www.athensnews.com/news/campus/university-reaches...

You're right that Ohio has bucked a statewide trend on enrollment, but the demographics don't show an easy road ahead. Ohio is producing fewer high school graduates, so on a whole, all the state schools will suffer. OU may have already peaked (though one semester is not a trend).

https://www.athensnews.com/news/campus/ou-spring-enrollme...
Having to close a gap of $8.4 million over 3-4 years is not that big of an issue. Half of that load is going to be administrative. $4.2 million on a $163 million dollar administrative budget is a handful of position cuts. If anything it might be the new president's attitude toward college basketball. Glidden and McDavis were very supportive of athletics.
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Recovering Journalist
6/5/2018 8:11 AM
Uncle Wes wrote:expand_more
Having to close a gap of $8.4 million over 3-4 years is not that big of an issue. Half of that load is going to be administrative. $4.2 million on a $163 million dollar administrative budget is a handful of position cuts. If anything it might be the new president's attitude toward college basketball. Glidden and McDavis were very supportive of athletics.
Beyond the fact that you're misreading some of these numbers to make them look better (for example, that $163 million needs to come down by 5.1% NOT $4.2 million), you're missing some key points. First and foremost, these cuts are already affecting the core mission of the university: They involve eliminating or not filling student-facing positions.

Any continued decline in enrollment will exacerbate the budget issues.

You're very mistaken if you think that this will not put downward pressure on the entire athletics budget. As others have pointed out, student interest in athletics is waning, which doesn't help sell the benefit of a high-paid coach either. Finally, we've been paying champagne prices for our coach and getting Natty Light results, so it's not like we've been proving that paying more equals getting more. At best, the next coach will make a similar salary to SP, and even that will be a hard sell.
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greencat
6/5/2018 10:00 AM
Recovering Journalist wrote:expand_more
Having to close a gap of $8.4 million over 3-4 years is not that big of an issue. Half of that load is going to be administrative. $4.2 million on a $163 million dollar administrative budget is a handful of position cuts. If anything it might be the new president's attitude toward college basketball. Glidden and McDavis were very supportive of athletics.
Beyond the fact that you're misreading some of these numbers to make them look better (for example, that $163 million needs to come down by 5.1% NOT $4.2 million), you're missing some key points. First and foremost, these cuts are already affecting the core mission of the university: They involve eliminating or not filling student-facing positions.

Any continued decline in enrollment will exacerbate the budget issues.

You're very mistaken if you think that this will not put downward pressure on the entire athletics budget. As others have pointed out, student interest in athletics is waning, which doesn't help sell the benefit of a high-paid coach either. Finally, we've been paying champagne prices for our coach and getting Natty Light results, so it's not like we've been proving that paying more equals getting more. At best, the next coach will make a similar salary to SP, and even that will be a hard sell.
Better have your sights set on a juco coach then. A good mid-major coach isn't going to take much less than SP is getting...

quote:
Ford signed a five-year contract on Thursday which runs through March 31, 2023. Ford's base salary is set at $375,000 for the first two seasons at Missouri State. The final three years, Ford will be owed $425,000 annually.
https://www.news-leader.com/story/sports/college/msu/2018... /
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Recovering Journalist
6/5/2018 10:18 AM
greencat wrote:expand_more
Better have your sights set on a juco coach then. A good mid-major coach isn't going to take much less than SP is getting...
I'm not saying it's what I want. I'm saying that the landscape is a lot different now than when we signed SP.

Western Kentucky is facing much more daunting budget issues than Ohio and it's affecting their athletics budget, which is already one of the lowest in CUSA:
http://www.wbko.com/content/sports/BISHOP--WKU-athletics-...
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Maddog13
6/5/2018 12:02 PM
I don't see why Ohio could not attract a lot of up and coming assistant coaches with a base salary, built in incentives, and, of course, being given a chance to become a head coach at a solid university with some notable sports history to it. After all, it is not like the cost of living in Athens is astronomical. Perhaps, the University could offer up some land with a nice view to help sweeten the deal as well. I mean, the booze in Athens is ever flowing, the food fresh, the women pretty, and living in Southeastern Ohio certainly has its charm. Oh, yeah, the Convo is a pretty nice sports facility. For God's sake, I used to live across the street from the University of California, Northridge, in Southern California, and that tiny arena is little more than a gloried middle school gym, even though they have direct access to an amazing source of talent through out Los Angeles. Perhaps, we could even get Frank Solich to coach basketball too. Just a thought.
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allen
6/5/2018 4:02 PM
greencat wrote:expand_more
[QUOTE=Uncle Wes]
Having to close a gap of $8.4 million over 3-4 years is not that big of an issue. Half of that load is going to be administrative. $4.2 million on a $163 million dollar administrative budget is a handful of position cuts. If anything it might be the new president's attitude toward college basketball. Glidden and McDavis were very supportive of athletics.
Beyond the fact that you're misreading some of these numbers to make them look better (for example, that $163 million needs to come down by 5.1% NOT $4.2 million), you're missing some key points. First and foremost, these cuts are already affecting the core mission of the university: They involve eliminating or not filling student-facing positions.

Any continued decline in enrollment will exacerbate the budget issues.

You're very mistaken if you think that this will not put downward pressure on the entire athletics budget. As others have pointed out, student interest in athletics is waning, which doesn't help sell the benefit of a high-paid coach either. Finally, we've been paying champagne prices for our coach and getting Natty Light results, so it's not like we've been proving that paying more equals getting more. At best, the next coach will make a similar salary to SP, and even that will be a hard sell. [/
Better have your sights set on a juco coach then. A good mid-major coach isn't going to take much less than SP is getting...

quote:
Ford signed a five-year contract on Thursday which runs through March 31, 2023. Ford's base salary is set at $375,000 for the first two seasons at Missouri State. The final three years, Ford will be owed $425,000 annually.
https://www.news-leader.com/story/sports/college/msu/2018... /

QUOTE]
You can’t scare us into keeping Saul, he has to win. There are a lot of coaches that would love to make 575k at Ohio University
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GoCats105
6/5/2018 4:17 PM
A lot is going to keep hinging on how much TV money the MAC is going to get. We can't keep upping the contract Saul has now (to him or anyone) unless Ohio keeps winning and butts are in the seats and the TV deal keep bringing in dollars.

It's a big year for Ohio basketball. Big, big year.
Last Edited: 6/5/2018 4:17:52 PM by GoCats105
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greencat
6/6/2018 11:21 AM
allen wrote:expand_more
[QUOTE=Uncle Wes]
Having to close a gap of $8.4 million over 3-4 years is not that big of an issue. Half of that load is going to be administrative. $4.2 million on a $163 million dollar administrative budget is a handful of position cuts. If anything it might be the new president's attitude toward college basketball. Glidden and McDavis were very supportive of athletics.
Beyond the fact that you're misreading some of these numbers to make them look better (for example, that $163 million needs to come down by 5.1% NOT $4.2 million), you're missing some key points. First and foremost, these cuts are already affecting the core mission of the university: They involve eliminating or not filling student-facing positions.

Any continued decline in enrollment will exacerbate the budget issues.

You're very mistaken if you think that this will not put downward pressure on the entire athletics budget. As others have pointed out, student interest in athletics is waning, which doesn't help sell the benefit of a high-paid coach either. Finally, we've been paying champagne prices for our coach and getting Natty Light results, so it's not like we've been proving that paying more equals getting more. At best, the next coach will make a similar salary to SP, and even that will be a hard sell. [/
Better have your sights set on a juco coach then. A good mid-major coach isn't going to take much less than SP is getting...
-------------------------------------------------

this part was me... not the other

quote:
Ford signed a five-year contract on Thursday which runs through March 31, 2023. Ford's base salary is set at $375,000 for the first two seasons at Missouri State. The final three years, Ford will be owed $425,000 annually.
https://www.news-leader.com/story/sports/college/msu/2018... /

---------------------------------------

QUOTE]
You can’t scare us into keeping Saul, he has to win. There are a lot of coaches that would love to make 575k at Ohio University
I'm the LAST person who would want him to get a contract extension, much of that based on the incoming class of scantly recruited obscure kids. (Except Cowart who was ranked as a top 100 juco player). To beat a dead horse...as I've posted ad nauseum... the current recruiting trend is a recipe for disaster.

That post was mostly a caveat that to get (for example) the coach that replaced Dana Ford at TSU in a few years... it won't be on the order of "el cheapo."
Last Edited: 6/6/2018 11:23:33 AM by greencat
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