This is nothing against Saul. I think he's doing a great job.

Where is the money coming from? TV? Attendance? Money games on the road? Local media market? Donations?

It's coming from student fees.

The amount paid in the coaches' contracts and the attendance and W/L aren't always going to correlate. It literally happens all over D1 basketball on a daily/weekly/monthly/annual basis. I would hope we can all understand that. I would also assume you can understand that the cards dealt to Saul haven't exactly been an easy hand to work with in some cases. How many of the previous three coaches have had seasons where they lost one their best two players (or both of the two) to grad transfer or injury? The last one prior to Saul being here that I can think of is Jeremy Fears in 2005-06 when he left midseason. And we cheered him when he came back and was introduced at halftime a month ago. Or at least myself and many of the people around me did.

Don't get me wrong, the injury bug is not the only flaw causing the current regime's setbacks. Defensive struggles, some recruiting setbacks, and holding certain players accountable are too. But at the end of the day, good players make coaches look good, and losing chunks of, or whole seasons with Campbell, Simmons, Dartis, Carter, and Vanden Plas have had huge effects on the end results. Those five guys are arguably among the best 8 players to have played here since 2014.

Also, if we all want to bitch about and compare the ROI to W/L and attendance we should then complain that JC, who got paid more than Groce, also "failed" in the eyes of this board, and then left two years into his contract. Oh wait, we've already done that in the past as well. At least we're consistent around here.

Listen, at the end of the season, Saul more than likely moves on to some other gig, and we get another coach. Hopefully the other coach plays a different style, better defense, and most importantly, makes all the naysayer's on Bobcat Attack happier.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=54BCLYNkFKg

At this point after being dangled in the air for a season, I wonder if the relationship would be bad enough that even if Saul pulls out a MAC tourney win would he do a lateral move after the season even if then offered an extension?

No extension will be offered. Period. Ohio has made its decision. If they were going to extend him, they would have already.

Even if he miraculously win the MAC Tourney, he'd bolt for another job.

The marriage is over.

It's been a disappointing tenure to say the least. As it's been stated over and over on this site, he was not dealt the best hand over the last five years.

But even when he's had a competitive team on the floor ... the shortcomings were obvious. They are not an athletic team ... not a gritty team. And I would love for someone to go back and look up how many double-digit runs Ohio has let up in the SaulBall Era. It's remarkable how almost every game Ohio allows a 12-0 or 21-4 run. It's almost like clockwork.

I think Saul is a great dude ... and I really wished it worked out. But this program needs a new face for a laundry list of reasons.

Here's hoping they can squeeze out a 9-9 MAC season ... but I'm not holding my breath.

To be batting .472 in MAC play heading into year 5 is just mind boggling.

I've been saying it for awhile now with regards to Saul - he is Billy Hahn.

Great guy. Likeable guy. Players like him. Questions about accountability/discipline at times. Had some great individual players. Never had much actual on-court success at OU (or at least it's been mediocre at best). Their winning percentages are quite similar.

Snyder doesn’t make the NCAA until year 12 of his tenure. What does that tell you? He was considered a professor and was paid like one. No one got all riled up that we didn’t get what we paid for.

It tells me they did NOT take 64 teams, infact, when Coach Snyder began coaching only 8 teams even made the tournament. The first year he made the tournament was 59-60, and a whopping 25 teams made the tournament with 3 teams getting a bye. When he retired a whopping 32 teams were in the tournament. So let’s please make decent comparisons!

Interesting note, only Danny and Larry had higher MAC winning percentage than OOC winning percentage. Oh to have the days where we challenged ourselves a few times OOC

I'm going to pretend that I just didn't read a Saul-Snyder comparison and quietly move on. #2-1/2Months

Since a year or so ago, you and I have mostly disagreed on this topic. But now, your summary here pretty well covers it. I don't see a way that a 6th and 7th year happens realistically. I want it to from the human being side of it. From the first year, I think the Phillips family has been a perfect fit for Ohio, and Athens. Other than a few potential "if this happens" scenarios, I don't see additional years happening on the basketball side of things, and it probably shouldn't.

To be honest, at this point in the conversation, the thing I'm most frustrated about is that the AD and the University have allowed this season in limbo to occur. If you're serious about your programs, you don't play this game with an out of contract coach at the end of this season. I know, I know, there's all the conversations about "Ohio doesn't have the money", etc., which reportedly isn't wrong. It is worth thinking about, for those who have very lofty expectations of this program, that, if Ohio wasn't willing to essentially buy out the last year of Saul's contract, or extend it for two years and take the risk of eating the last year, should we continue to have lofty expectations if seemingly, the AD and university don't also? I'm not saying we should, or should not, but it's food for thought.

At this point, I'm all in on cheering them on to the end of the year to have the best year they can, hoping like hell they get to Thurs/Fri/Sat in Cleveland, knowing full well it's highly likely that next year the whole thing gets blown up and we're starting over for what could be another 'wilderness campaign'.

/\ Fair point /\

But, a point that comes with a "what happens this year"?

If Saul were responsible for a Sweet 16 banner hanging in the Convo and a win over Georgetown in another NCAA Tourney...I would care less what his MAC record is as well.