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Ohio Basketball Topic
Topic: Sears Transfer Portal?
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BillyTheCat
3/31/2022 10:55 AM
cc-cat wrote:expand_more
BLS, for the record, I am not anti-NIL. I did though from the beginning understand that NIL was going to be a bad thing for OHIO athletics due to our demographics.
Like most everything, its not about "local" anymore. NIL looks very closely at social media impact. The opportunities for NIL are not simply with the the local bar or auto dealer, but larger social media opportunities.
In some cases yes, but in many it's local big donors, or alumni who are funneling money to hawk or represent their product. These players will be doing public appearances, show up sign some things.

https://twitter.com/i/events/1410451635881623552

https://247sports.com/LongFormArticle/Name-Image-and-Like...
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rpbobcat
3/31/2022 11:00 AM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
You continue to act like the full scholarship doesn’t itself have a lot of value! For many it’s the scholarship and education that makes a difference in their lives over the pocket change they will pick up from NIL monies
As I've posted before:

I played D1 Soccer for O.U., in the Mid 1970's.

We had 1 scholarship ,so we were all "walk-ons"

My second year we even had to have a volunteer coach.

I transferred to FDU, in Teaneck, N.J.

I wrestled D1 there.

My Senior year I got a very, small partial scholarship.
Basically, they used the remaining money in the team's budget
as partial scholarships for Seniors.
It wasn't much, but we were thrilled to get anything.

I would have given anything to have gotten a full scholarship.

I played Soccer and Wrestled because I loved the sports.
There was no chance of "going pro" in either sport.

Even if there was, I went to college to get a degree I could use for my future endeavors.
We are all very very familiar with your story. However, we are discussing 100% (100%+ with "full cost of attendance monies") scholarships, not equivalency sports.
Guess I wasn't clear.

I agree 100% about value of a full scholarship.

Unfortunately, it seems that, in many cases, athletes in "head count" sports, fail to appreciate and/or take full advantage of, what they're getting for free.

Any athlete in an "equivalency "sport would be overjoyed at getting one.
Last Edited: 3/31/2022 11:14:17 AM by rpbobcat
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shabamon
3/31/2022 11:16 AM
Pete Chouteau wrote:expand_more
Funny how y'all couldn't wait for Grainger to portal out...

Swords got two sides.
I don't know that anyone "couldn't wait" Granger to leave, but come on, they are very different situations.

In a year following a season-ending injury to Wilson and the other two centers on the roster transferring out, Colin was still passed over by two true freshmen. There were games where walk-ons got more garbage time than Colin. The writing's pretty much on the wall. Hate to say, but it appears mutually beneficial that Colin moves on.

Sears got all the playing time in the world and would continue to do so at Ohio. With Vander Plas leaving, he would have been the face of the program. But now he's leaving to pursue something that is presumably far more risky in the long and short term for reasons already mentioned here. I don't see how Mark leaving is beneficial for either party with what we already know.
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UpSan Bobcat
3/31/2022 11:44 AM
If his main reason for transferring is for a chance to get more endorsement money, then I agree that he probably will be disappointed. But similar players have transferred frequently in the past for other reasons. Many guys just want a chance to give it a try on a higher level. Ending up on the bench in such a situation doesn't mean it didn't turn out well. I doubt Jaaron Simmons is too upset with his decision. He played (even if only a few minutes) in a national championship game. He played a season oversees and now is in coaching. The end result probably would have been the same if he stayed at Ohio. It's just a matter of how you get there, and some people value different things, which is hard for us on this board to understand because all of his place a huge amount of value in allegiance to Ohio University.
Last Edited: 3/31/2022 11:45:18 AM by UpSan Bobcat
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BillyTheCat
3/31/2022 12:00 PM
rpbobcat wrote:expand_more
You continue to act like the full scholarship doesn’t itself have a lot of value! For many it’s the scholarship and education that makes a difference in their lives over the pocket change they will pick up from NIL monies
As I've posted before:

I played D1 Soccer for O.U., in the Mid 1970's.

We had 1 scholarship ,so we were all "walk-ons"

My second year we even had to have a volunteer coach.

I transferred to FDU, in Teaneck, N.J.

I wrestled D1 there.

My Senior year I got a very, small partial scholarship.
Basically, they used the remaining money in the team's budget
as partial scholarships for Seniors.
It wasn't much, but we were thrilled to get anything.

I would have given anything to have gotten a full scholarship.

I played Soccer and Wrestled because I loved the sports.
There was no chance of "going pro" in either sport.

Even if there was, I went to college to get a degree I could use for my future endeavors.
We are all very very familiar with your story. However, we are discussing 100% (100%+ with "full cost of attendance monies") scholarships, not equivalency sports.
Guess I wasn't clear.

I agree 100% about value of a full scholarship.

Unfortunately, it seems that, in many cases, athletes in "head count" sports, fail to appreciate and/or take full advantage of, what they're getting for free.

Any athlete in an "equivalency "sport would be overjoyed at getting one.
I agree 110% about that. And if you check the giving records of athletic departments, athletes who were on full scholarship give back at a much lower rate than the other sports. Statistic that I find interesting.

And yes, "equivalency" sport athletes would definitely be overjoyed at getting a full scholarship
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
3/31/2022 12:09 PM
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:expand_more
So basically you're saying we shouldn't care?

Also just wanted to point out that many NIL deals don't even involve cash. So there's that...
No. Totally fine to care. I just find it intellectually disingenuous to frame it as some moral failing of Mark Sears and his family to want to earn money.

There are a million ways to care that don't involve that.
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spongeBOB CATpants
3/31/2022 12:19 PM
Through Jan. 23, OSU athletes had disclosed 619 deals that earned a combined nearly $3 million.

Football players reported 27.4% of all of the Buckeyes’ activity, which counts as the overall number of deals, ranking the most among any of the 36 varsity sports teams.

Women’s volleyball reported the next-highest percentage of activity at 8.6%, followed by men’s basketball (5.6%), men’s tennis (5.4%) and men’s lacrosse (4.6%). Rounding out the top-10 was wrestling (4.6%), women’s swimming and diving (4.5%), women’s gymnastics (4.1%), softball (3.8%) and women’s rowing (3.7%).

The school reported that football players earned a combined $2.68 million across 173 deals, making up 89.7% of the total compensation reported by OSU athletes.

The average of $15,537 per agreement among the Buckeyes' football players is much higher than the national average for the sport at $2,741.

OSU said most deals by its athletes have been on the smaller end between $25 and $500 for each one.
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spongeBOB CATpants
3/31/2022 12:24 PM
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:expand_more
So basically you're saying we shouldn't care?

Also just wanted to point out that many NIL deals don't even involve cash. So there's that...
No. Totally fine to care. I just find it intellectually disingenuous to frame it as some moral failing of Mark Sears and his family to want to earn money.

There are a million ways to care that don't involve that.
I think its more that we feel they are misinformed and basing this decision on empty promises that a pot o gold is awaiting their family at the end of the rainbow.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
3/31/2022 12:32 PM
spongeBOB CATpants wrote:expand_more
So basically you're saying we shouldn't care?

Also just wanted to point out that many NIL deals don't even involve cash. So there's that...
No. Totally fine to care. I just find it intellectually disingenuous to frame it as some moral failing of Mark Sears and his family to want to earn money.

There are a million ways to care that don't involve that.
I think its more that we feel they are misinformed and basing this decision on empty promises that a pot o gold is awaiting their family at the end of the rainbow.
I think you're speaking too broadly by using "we." Multiple people have called Mark Sears' Mom greedy in this thread.
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BillyTheCat
3/31/2022 1:02 PM
And OSU leads the nation in NIL's for this year. The amazing thing is nationwide how little the basketball player is getting. And to some's point on this topic, there is a misunderstanding that is probably coming from bad advice, but there is not money that is going to change anyone's life or college experience coming down the pipe for 99% of these athletes.
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The Optimist
3/31/2022 1:04 PM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
BLS, for the record, I am not anti-NIL. I did though from the beginning understand that NIL was going to be a bad thing for OHIO athletics due to our demographics.
Like most everything, its not about "local" anymore. NIL looks very closely at social media impact. The opportunities for NIL are not simply with the the local bar or auto dealer, but larger social media opportunities.
In some cases yes, but in many it's local big donors, or alumni who are funneling money to hawk or represent their product. These players will be doing public appearances, show up sign some things.

https://twitter.com/i/events/1410451635881623552

https://247sports.com/LongFormArticle/Name-Image-and-Like...
In Sears' case, if Alabama is after him I would imagine they've got local donors working the NIL angle. The SEC has been paying players under the table so I'm sure this NIL stuff is easy for them.
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Jeff McKinney
3/31/2022 2:40 PM
The Optimist wrote:expand_more
What does help the mid majors though are all those recruited to big name schools that weren't playing or will lose playing time due to the transfers and then transfer out to a mid major. Difference is, they are untested to an extent.

The depth of talent in the Transfer Portal this year is unprecedented.

I'm disappointed this is what college basketball has turned into, but there's no use crying over spilled milk. Time to go out and sign some free agents.
Preach!!
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Jeff McKinney
3/31/2022 2:43 PM
Pete Chouteau wrote:expand_more
Funny how y'all couldn't wait for Grainger to portal out...

Swords got two sides.
Drop the mic, bro. Preach.
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BillyTheCat
3/31/2022 3:26 PM
Jeff McKinney wrote:expand_more
Funny how y'all couldn't wait for Grainger to portal out...

Swords got two sides.
Drop the mic, bro. Preach.
+1
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FearLeon
3/31/2022 3:36 PM
Jeff McKinney wrote:expand_more
Funny how y'all couldn't wait for Grainger to portal out...

Swords got two sides.
Drop the mic, bro. Preach.
Huh....are you really comparing a MAC POTY candidate transferring to a guy transferring who played limited minutes freshman year and didn't see the floor his sophomore year when the starting center missed the entire year?

Nobody couldn't wait for Granger to transfer. This isn't a rooting contest when it comes to Bobcats and the portal. The Granger transfer was inevitable when the calendar flipped to January 1st when he didn't see the floor in November/December.

I see zero comparison to Sears transfer and Granger transfer.
Last Edited: 3/31/2022 3:38:04 PM by FearLeon
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Pataskala
3/31/2022 4:09 PM
The Optimist wrote:expand_more
BLS, for the record, I am not anti-NIL. I did though from the beginning understand that NIL was going to be a bad thing for OHIO athletics due to our demographics.
Like most everything, its not about "local" anymore. NIL looks very closely at social media impact. The opportunities for NIL are not simply with the the local bar or auto dealer, but larger social media opportunities.
In some cases yes, but in many it's local big donors, or alumni who are funneling money to hawk or represent their product. These players will be doing public appearances, show up sign some things.

https://twitter.com/i/events/1410451635881623552

https://247sports.com/LongFormArticle/Name-Image-and-Like...
In Sears' case, if Alabama is after him I would imagine they've got local donors working the NIL angle. The SEC has been paying players under the table so I'm sure this NIL stuff is easy for them.
The vast majority of social media opportunities should be available anywhere, not just at larger schools. It's just a matter of national/international interests buying ads on your social media page. But first you need a name that's known beyond your conference, and Sears doesn't have it at the moment. JP got it after the UVA win at the Dance. A win at the CBI doesn't have the same impact. He might get it just by being on Bama's (or another "P"'s roster) but my guess is that bench players have to rely on local money.
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Kevin Finnegan
3/31/2022 4:34 PM
As a fan, I get the feeling of disappointment and that we are going to miss the next two-three years of Sears's development. But, let's say the Alabama rumors are true. Do you really fault a man for returning to his home state where his family can see him play nearly every game in person and can cheer him on, all while playing in one of the top conferences in the country? I'm going to be cheering hard for him wherever he ends up because he's a remarkable young man who gave us a lot in a short amount of time.
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Recovering Journalist
3/31/2022 4:54 PM
Kevin Finnegan wrote:expand_more
As a fan, I get the feeling of disappointment and that we are going to miss the next two-three years of Sears's development. But, let's say the Alabama rumors are true. Do you really fault a man for returning to his home state where his family can see him play nearly every game in person and can cheer him on, all while playing in one of the top conferences in the country? I'm going to be cheering hard for him wherever he ends up because he's a remarkable young man who gave us a lot in a short amount of time.
This is the right attitude. As others have said, Ohio doesn't own Mark Sears or any other player. If he'd rather be elsewhere, the system makes it easy to go elsewhere and he's done nothing to earn our enmity. Best wishes to him.

That said, the trajectory of mid-major basketball is sad. Murray State is a vivid example, but we're seeing it here too. Great seasons will be followed by mass departures. Good seasons will see top players leave. Stability coupled with success will be nearly impossible. That was somewhat true before but it feels emphatically true now. Transferring is so easy that very few MAC-level schools will be able to hold a great player for four years. Instead, any time someone emerges as elite or even potentially elite, they'll hit the portal.
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Pataskala
3/31/2022 6:35 PM
Channel 4 reports that he has interest from Auburn (Bruce Pearl maybe finally stealing an Ohio guard after trying for DJ), TxA&M and Texas, in addition to Bama. CBS reporting that WVU, Appalachian State, Creighton, Florida, Georgetown, LSU, Miami, Notre Dame, Ole Miss, Samford, and South Carolina are also interested.
Last Edited: 3/31/2022 6:36:35 PM by Pataskala
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71 BOBCAT
3/31/2022 7:57 PM
I have to ask the obvious question.......

HOW MUCH MONEY ARE WE TALKING ABOUT FOR THESE COLLEGE KIDS?




GO BOBCATS
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
3/31/2022 8:08 PM
Pataskala wrote:expand_more
Channel 4 reports that he has interest from Auburn (Bruce Pearl maybe finally stealing an Ohio guard after trying for DJ), TxA&M and Texas, in addition to Bama. CBS reporting that WVU, Appalachian State, Creighton, Florida, Georgetown, LSU, Miami, Notre Dame, Ole Miss, Samford, and South Carolina are also interested.
Good for him. Save for Appalachian State and Samford, that's an elite group.

You don't get to this level of basketball without being competitive, and I'm sure he's eager to see how he stacks up in a big time conference.
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colobobcat66
3/31/2022 8:21 PM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
And OSU leads the nation in NIL's for this year. The amazing thing is nationwide how little the basketball player is getting. And to some's point on this topic, there is a misunderstanding that is probably coming from bad advice, but there is not money that is going to change anyone's life or college experience coming down the pipe for 99% of these athletes.
I’m guessing nobody has any idea how much money is being paid to athletes outside of the “legal” NIL deals. When it was “illegal” there were later reported 6 figure deals being made. You don’t think there are still lots of under the table deals being made?
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The Optimist
3/31/2022 8:26 PM
Pataskala wrote:expand_more
BLS, for the record, I am not anti-NIL. I did though from the beginning understand that NIL was going to be a bad thing for OHIO athletics due to our demographics.
Like most everything, its not about "local" anymore. NIL looks very closely at social media impact. The opportunities for NIL are not simply with the the local bar or auto dealer, but larger social media opportunities.
In some cases yes, but in many it's local big donors, or alumni who are funneling money to hawk or represent their product. These players will be doing public appearances, show up sign some things.

https://twitter.com/i/events/1410451635881623552

https://247sports.com/LongFormArticle/Name-Image-and-Like...
In Sears' case, if Alabama is after him I would imagine they've got local donors working the NIL angle. The SEC has been paying players under the table so I'm sure this NIL stuff is easy for them.
The vast majority of social media opportunities should be available anywhere, not just at larger schools. It's just a matter of national/international interests buying ads on your social media page. But first you need a name that's known beyond your conference, and Sears doesn't have it at the moment. JP got it after the UVA win at the Dance. A win at the CBI doesn't have the same impact. He might get it just by being on Bama's (or another "P"'s roster) but my guess is that bench players have to rely on local money.

That's what I was getting at... Bama (and the SEC in general) have a process established for "local money." The boosters run deep at Bama. Sears would be taken care of there...
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
3/31/2022 9:06 PM
colobobcat66 wrote:expand_more
And OSU leads the nation in NIL's for this year. The amazing thing is nationwide how little the basketball player is getting. And to some's point on this topic, there is a misunderstanding that is probably coming from bad advice, but there is not money that is going to change anyone's life or college experience coming down the pipe for 99% of these athletes.
I’m guessing nobody has any idea how much money is being paid to athletes outside of the “legal” NIL deals. When it was “illegal” there were later reported 6 figure deals being made. You don’t think there are still lots of under the table deals being made?
What's the point of an under the table deal when you can do it out in the open?

People seem to think the black market wasn't caused by the lack of a market. The sketchiness and illegal activities were a direct result of a huge industry being so aggressively over-regulated that key value creators were left out altogether. It's legal now. I own a business. If I want to pay Sears to stay, nothing stops me from doing it. Why would I do it under the table?
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lovebobcat
3/31/2022 11:19 PM
Recovering Journalist wrote:expand_more
That said, the trajectory of mid-major basketball is sad. Murray State is a vivid example, but we're seeing it here too. Great seasons will be followed by mass departures. Good seasons will see top players leave. Stability coupled with success will be nearly impossible. That was somewhat true before but it feels emphatically true now. Transferring is so easy that very few MAC-level schools will be able to hold a great player for four years. Instead, any time someone emerges as elite or even potentially elite, they'll hit the portal.
I remember hating what Kentucky had turned into, with its one-and-done philosophy running counter to college basketball's cherished tradition of four-year players. Now the transfer portal has made the game one in which every season, EVERY team starts over and has roster churn on par with pro sports. At least in the pros, there are a few players you know will be around for a few years because of signing long-term contracts. At OU, we can't emotionally invest in a single player beyond a given season.

NIL has widened the divide between the haves and have-nots, and (as some have said on this thread) turned mid-majors into a developmental league for the P5 schools. I don't begrudge any individual for wanting to take a better opportunity for himself. But I reserve the right to mourn for what we've lost. I will always support OU sports, but the experience has changed. These are just mercenaries renting time in our jerseys. Like Seinfeld says in his routine, I'm really just rooting for clothes.
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