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Ohio Basketball Topic
Topic: Jim Christian
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OUcat
7/2/2022 8:58 PM
Just wondering ... was he an abusive coachat Kent State ... Was he abusive at TCU ... Was he abusive at BC.

Was he only abusive at Ohio.

Earlier poster likely hit the mark ... just a different coach from Groce. One thing glossed over was the Ohio recruiting class JC lined up before he left. Would have been interesting to see how that would have played out.

Also, Ndour, as a talent, has to easily be one of the top 3-5 talents ever to play at Ohio. JC certainly has his warts, but a lot of REALLY good talented players signed up to be coached by him at Ohio.
Last Edited: 7/2/2022 9:00:29 PM by OUcat
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mid70sbobcat
7/3/2022 12:28 AM
FearLeon wrote:expand_more
Said it as soon as he got the BC job that he'd be back in the MAC in five years. I was off by three years. This is great news for Ohio. Let him make players in another MAC program miserable. One of the most overrated coaches in college basketball history. Ohio just got better today by Kent State hiring this guy.
And Christian lasted 7 years before back in the MAC versus your idol Groce, who lasted just 5. I get it, you hated JC and Saul and worshipped Groce and Boals.
Don't hate anyone, just know when somebody isn't the right fit. Who on this board wouldn't take Boals and Groce over Christian and Saul? Even Stevie Wonder can see that.

The highlight of the Christian Era for me was going to Memphis to watch Ohio's starting 5 turn their backs to JC during a timeout. Thought it was incredibly odd at the time and then it made more sense when you learned how he treated several players. Hopefully, he has the same relationship with Sincere Carry.
So you basically admit it .. since you claim Christian failed by not getting us to the Elite 8 it was because of immature, selfish players who couldn't deal with a coach who imposed more discipline than Groce. Got it, thanks.
Where did I ever say Christian failed by not getting us to the Elite 8? Please find that wording in any of my Christian posts and please report back to us. Christian failed because he arguably had the greatest Ohio team handed to him and he could not take them to the NCAA Tournament. And if you looked at JC's resume, it was something he did infrequently as a head coach before he got the Ohio job.

And you can rave about "JC's regular season co-championship" all you want, but ask yourself this. What do Ohio fans or college basketball fans in general remember more when it comes to the history of Ohio basketball? That "JC regular season co-championship" or Leon Williams tip-in against Buffalo or Ohio's NCAA Tournament wins over Virginia or Georgetown or Michigan or South Florida or DJ Cooper's shot from half-court hitting the rim against North Carolina that would have sent the Bobcats to the Elite 8? Sorry...out of those 6 things...that "world famous JC regular season co-championship" would come in at a distant #6. I mean Ohio fans remember Tommy's three to beat Miami at the convo more than that "JC regular season co-championship". And deservingly so.

Bottom line....the MAC regular season championship isn't what matters. Obviously, it's crazy that regular season means nothing, but that's the way it works in the MAC. Go ask Todd K or any Rockets fan if they'd rather have back-to-back regular season MAC championship banners or MAC tournament championship banners hanging from the rafters?

You can have Jimmy C's sterling 73.5% winning percentage in two years at Ohio. If that makes you feel good, have at it. What JC's two years in Athens did was help put in motion Ohio basketball being set back 6 years.

I'll take Groce and Boals accomplishments at Ohio over Jimmy C any day of the week. As would probably 99.9% of Ohio basketball fans on this board.
Haha. Avoid the focus of my post. You said the team turned their back on Christian. Right? Because he was different than Groce? Because he was more disciplined? So was Bobby Knight a bad coach too?

PS Boals has recruits leaving at a higher rate than Saul. Just FYI.

And sorry, I prefer to focus on FACTS. Have a good day. Keep your blood pressure down.


I get it...your loyalty to two mediocre/below average head coaches is strong with Saul and Jimmy C. Keep sending those Christmas cards to them each year and wearing your 2012-2013 MAC Regular Season Co-Champions" shirt with pride.

Looking at the comments in this thread it looks like 99% of the folks here have similar views as I do when it comes to your boy Jimmy C. And I'm sure the same can be said about Saul. I prefer to focus on FACTS as well.
Haha. Some players can play for tough coaches. As someone who played in the Convo I can relate to that. Did you play in your time in Athens??
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mid70sbobcat
7/3/2022 12:31 AM
OhioCatFan wrote:expand_more
My view on the great past-coach debate:

Saul is a good coach, who had bad luck here, especially in terms of some key injuries. I was not for firing him; however, I do think that Boals is an upgrade.

Jim Christian was a coach who abused his players. He apparently got the most out of them during the regular season by intimidation and fear. However, to win in the post-season one needs to have developed talent during the year and have inspirational coaching during the tournament. JC delivered neither. I was happy to see him go to those proverbial greener pastures.
Abuse, huh? Truly baffling to me the accusations people in the crowd with limited knowledge and vantage point are willing to throw out there.

It seems like there's a whole lot of room for nuance here that lives somewhere between Jim Christian is the best coach in the world and Jim Christian failed at OU because he's abusive.

My take:

Jim Christian and John Groce were stylistically quite different, and it's not surprising that a team recruited by Groce didn't mesh well with Christian. And the Sweet 16 team Christian inherited was about 2 inches away from losing to Akron in the MAC Championship game, and anybody taking over a MAC team whose line between success and failure hinges on an NCAA berth is more likely to fail than succeed.

Both Groce and Christian seem like mid-major quality basketball coaches. Both have had the chance to be more, neither has managed to make the most of it. They both have their strengths, both have their weaknesses. Groce had most of his career success at Ohio, so I'm inclined to like him more, but I don't understand why the only option people seem to think is available is to hate one and love the other.

And unless I'm missing something, accusing Christian of abuse seems like a huge stretch. Do you know something the rest of us don't?
I should have specified verbal and psychological abuse, I wasn't accusing him of of physical abuse of his players. I thought that was understood from the context, but I should have been more specific. I don't think that this is secret knowledge, I'm sure others on this board are privy to the same information.
As I said earlier .. so Bob Knight was a bad coach? You and FearLeon need to get a room. I suspect neither of you know what it's like to play at D1 level.
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71 BOBCAT
7/3/2022 9:25 AM
Obviously, there is something about this coach that has cause so much discussion, especially since he only spent 2 years with us.
On the positive side, I do remember that his contract with Ohio required him to pay us $500k if he leaves prior to the end of his contract.



GO BOBCATS
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FearLeon
7/3/2022 10:43 AM
mid70sbobcat wrote:expand_more
My view on the great past-coach debate:

Saul is a good coach, who had bad luck here, especially in terms of some key injuries. I was not for firing him; however, I do think that Boals is an upgrade.

Jim Christian was a coach who abused his players. He apparently got the most out of them during the regular season by intimidation and fear. However, to win in the post-season one needs to have developed talent during the year and have inspirational coaching during the tournament. JC delivered neither. I was happy to see him go to those proverbial greener pastures.
Abuse, huh? Truly baffling to me the accusations people in the crowd with limited knowledge and vantage point are willing to throw out there.

It seems like there's a whole lot of room for nuance here that lives somewhere between Jim Christian is the best coach in the world and Jim Christian failed at OU because he's abusive.

My take:

Jim Christian and John Groce were stylistically quite different, and it's not surprising that a team recruited by Groce didn't mesh well with Christian. And the Sweet 16 team Christian inherited was about 2 inches away from losing to Akron in the MAC Championship game, and anybody taking over a MAC team whose line between success and failure hinges on an NCAA berth is more likely to fail than succeed.

Both Groce and Christian seem like mid-major quality basketball coaches. Both have had the chance to be more, neither has managed to make the most of it. They both have their strengths, both have their weaknesses. Groce had most of his career success at Ohio, so I'm inclined to like him more, but I don't understand why the only option people seem to think is available is to hate one and love the other.

And unless I'm missing something, accusing Christian of abuse seems like a huge stretch. Do you know something the rest of us don't?
I should have specified verbal and psychological abuse, I wasn't accusing him of of physical abuse of his players. I thought that was understood from the context, but I should have been more specific. I don't think that this is secret knowledge, I'm sure others on this board are privy to the same information.
As I said earlier .. so Bob Knight was a bad coach? You and FearLeon need to get a room. I suspect neither of you know what it's like to play at D1 level.

Didn't quite make it D1, but on the Convo floor I did score a layup over Gary Trent in Larry Hunter's coaching basketball class. So I have scored against an NBA player.
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OhioCatFan
7/3/2022 5:55 PM
FearLeon wrote:expand_more
My view on the great past-coach debate:

Saul is a good coach, who had bad luck here, especially in terms of some key injuries. I was not for firing him; however, I do think that Boals is an upgrade.

Jim Christian was a coach who abused his players. He apparently got the most out of them during the regular season by intimidation and fear. However, to win in the post-season one needs to have developed talent during the year and have inspirational coaching during the tournament. JC delivered neither. I was happy to see him go to those proverbial greener pastures.
Abuse, huh? Truly baffling to me the accusations people in the crowd with limited knowledge and vantage point are willing to throw out there.

It seems like there's a whole lot of room for nuance here that lives somewhere between Jim Christian is the best coach in the world and Jim Christian failed at OU because he's abusive.

My take:

Jim Christian and John Groce were stylistically quite different, and it's not surprising that a team recruited by Groce didn't mesh well with Christian. And the Sweet 16 team Christian inherited was about 2 inches away from losing to Akron in the MAC Championship game, and anybody taking over a MAC team whose line between success and failure hinges on an NCAA berth is more likely to fail than succeed.

Both Groce and Christian seem like mid-major quality basketball coaches. Both have had the chance to be more, neither has managed to make the most of it. They both have their strengths, both have their weaknesses. Groce had most of his career success at Ohio, so I'm inclined to like him more, but I don't understand why the only option people seem to think is available is to hate one and love the other.

And unless I'm missing something, accusing Christian of abuse seems like a huge stretch. Do you know something the rest of us don't?
I should have specified verbal and psychological abuse, I wasn't accusing him of of physical abuse of his players. I thought that was understood from the context, but I should have been more specific. I don't think that this is secret knowledge, I'm sure others on this board are privy to the same information.
As I said earlier .. so Bob Knight was a bad coach? You and FearLeon need to get a room. I suspect neither of you know what it's like to play at D1 level.

Didn't quite make it D1, but on the Convo floor I did score a layup over Gary Trent in Larry Hunter's coaching basketball class. So I have scored against an NBA player.
And, I’ve scored baskets in pickup games at Grover Center. Some of those were against the all-time high scorer at Grover. HIs first name is Ralph. Grover Ball will know who I’m talking about.
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