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Alan Swank
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Posted: 1/3/2012 2:43 PM
OhioCatFan wrote:expand_more
The word is "Must Carry."   I think you'll find that WSAZ will do an excellent job of covering Athens County, as they used to do in the old "over the air" days.  They used to even cover stories from Columbus -- State House news kinds of things.


Carl, no one on here is clamoring for news on Athens County and SE Ohio - the desired news is that coming out of Columbus particularly that of a political variety.  We're not going to get that from WV stations and therein lies the rub.

anorris -  I didn't ask and they didn't say which stations exercised must carry (no wonder I couldn't find Muscary on a google search).
Ohio69
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Posted: 1/3/2012 4:03 PM
So, how old are these "must carry" rules?  Are they more set up for pre-cable TV era?

I assume these rules have more to do with lobbying/bribes than any practical reasons, like distance.

(And yes, I think of campaign contributions as bribes.)
Last Edited: 1/3/2012 4:04:03 PM by Ohio69
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 1/3/2012 8:55 PM
WSAZ used to have a correspondent in Columbus.  I don't know whether they will do that kind of thing now or not.  It probably depends on how many Ohio counties are affected by this change.  The more of our area's cable companies that carry their station the more resources they will devote to our issues.  And, Alan, I do think that I'm not alone in decrying the lack of coverage of Athens and SEO news on the Columbus stations and in hoping that it might be better with the West Virginia stations going forward. 
Last Edited: 1/3/2012 9:06:00 PM by OhioCatFan
bornacatfan
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Posted: 1/3/2012 10:32 PM
Alan Swank wrote:expand_more
The word is "Must Carry."   I think you'll find that WSAZ will do an excellent job of covering Athens County, as they used to do in the old "over the air" days.  They used to even cover stories from Columbus -- State House news kinds of things.


Carl, no one on here is clamoring for news on Athens County and SE Ohio - the desired news is that coming out of Columbus particularly that of a political variety.  We're not going to get that from WV stations and therein lies the rub.

anorris -  I didn't ask and they didn't say which stations exercised must carry (no wonder I couldn't find Muscary on a google search).


Boy howdy. Several parts of Indiana are so disenfranchised. Gary and the region comes out of Chicago and consider themselves part of the suburban Chi area. Evansville may as well be part of KY, Richmond is part of Dayton  and SEI gets everything from Cincy. State government is run by Indy as there is no news community  on the periphery that provides insight into the center of the state.
Last Edited: 1/3/2012 10:33:44 PM by bornacatfan
DelBobcat
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Posted: 1/3/2012 10:47 PM
bornacatfan wrote:expand_more
The word is "Must Carry."   I think you'll find that WSAZ will do an excellent job of covering Athens County, as they used to do in the old "over the air" days.  They used to even cover stories from Columbus -- State House news kinds of things.


Carl, no one on here is clamoring for news on Athens County and SE Ohio - the desired news is that coming out of Columbus particularly that of a political variety.  We're not going to get that from WV stations and therein lies the rub.

anorris -  I didn't ask and they didn't say which stations exercised must carry (no wonder I couldn't find Muscary on a google search).


Boy howdy. Several parts of Indiana are so disenfranchised. Gary and the region comes out of Chicago and consider themselves part of the suburban Chi area. Evansville may as well be part of KY, Richmond is part of Dayton  and SEI gets everything from Cincy. State government is run by Indy as there is no news community  on the periphery that provides insight into the center of the state.


I'll add that in all the time I lived in the Cincy market I never saw any news coming out of the Indiana State House. I don't remember a whole lot of news from the Kentucky State House either, but they do a good job of covering NKY issues.

Here in Delaware our news comes from Philly and they do a pretty good job covering New Castle County. I think we sometimes get the short end of the stick, but a larger portion of the population lives in PA and Jersey.
anorris
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Posted: 1/4/2012 1:58 AM
Ohio69 wrote:expand_more
So, how old are these "must carry" rules?  Are they more set up for pre-cable TV era?

I assume these rules have more to do with lobbying/bribes than any practical reasons, like distance.

(And yes, I think of campaign contributions as bribes.)
They've been updated here and there, but are largely of the era when cable was the newfangled thing (the fear was that the cable company would carry only certain broadcasters, leaving others out of the mix).

The markets are defined and can be changed based on the criteria I mentioned earlier from the law, largely distance (Huntington, Charleston, and Columbus are all virtually equidistant from Athens as the crow flies) and broadcast signal propagation (if you look at the maps in the link Alan provided, you'll find that signals from WV propagate to Athens county better than Columbus).

The market altering definitions that could be interesting in this situation are those of shopping and labor patterns and historical ratings.  I'd have to guess Athens has stronger ties in shopping and labor to Columbus, and would assume the stations there would've rated decently, given how many people (students, profs, etc.) are transplants or have some connection (even if it is the god forsaken university up there) to Columbus.  Or, if you didn't care which market it came from, you may choose Columbus news because the production quality is markedly better (but I probably over-value that aspect).
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Posted: 1/4/2012 7:49 AM
anorris wrote:expand_more
Or, if you didn't care which market it came from, you may choose Columbus news because the production quality is markedly better (but I probably over-value that aspect).


You are not alone in this!  While in Athens, I would watch the cbus stations just because the "talent" and graphics were a few steps above the WV broadcasts in quality.  I did watch WSAZ sports for Keith Morehouse (sp?) as he was pretty good and they usually had at least a Bobcat score, if not highlights.
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Posted: 1/4/2012 9:10 AM
It's too bad Athens doesn't get WTAP from Parkersburg.  Although I live in WV, I still like a mix of WV and Ohio news.  They do a really nice job of reporting both.  Also, Athens gets a lot of coverage for some reason.  I have the luxury of getting WBNS form Columbus, and WOWK, WCHS, and WSAZ from Charleston and WTAP from Parkersburg.  I rarely watch the news on any station but Parkersburg.  If I lived in Athens, I would rather have WTAP than the other WV stations. 
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Posted: 1/4/2012 9:57 AM
I watch Cols news when I am over there.....eeessshhh i thought Indianapolis was bad enough that I still keep my distant feeds from the coast on Directv till I started watching those jokers on Channel 4 and 10 in Columbus.

You want sweet...channel 8 in Indy has seriously upgraded the staff....not quite Allie LaForce type upgrades but enough that my boy commented on the watchability and quality of the new look.
Bob Haldeman
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Posted: 1/4/2012 11:28 AM
ANOrris.......I can't think of a dispute recently where it went far enough in litigation that anyone went to the actual work of doing unique/specific survey work to determine whether a county was more likely in or out of a market. Mostly, these decisions for TV markets and moving network affiliates have just wheeled off of the annual Nielsen DMA (Designated Market Area) designations.

That DMA list groups markets nationwide, segmented by whole counties, and ranks them from #1 NYC to #212 or so (Glendive, MT(?)).

Athens County has bounced back and forth between the Chas/Hunt. and Columbus markets for 30 years, though has mainly been in the former. 

If they are using only the Nielsens, which are based on local TV diaries, the statistics could be startlingly thin. The Charleston/Huntington market has 30+ counties. Assuming a ratings diary is going to a thousand homes in the market (very high estimate......likely 600 or less is the reality), this might mean that at most 50 diaries are distributed in Athens County.

Amongst those 50, say, maybe 35 even watch any meaningful local network TV or local news broadcasts. If any of them went to Stewart or Coolville, that subset of people have access the to NBC in Parkersburg (WTAP) and might watch it. So, you might have 30 homes left, for example. These 30 homes, and whether they watch more WCMH or WSAZ are likely all that is making this decision. Statistically insignificant.

(Speaking of WTAP, for bobcat695........their weatherman lives in Athens and drives over every day at 45 mph; he is obsessed with doing stories from over there as a labor saving activity. WTAP has not been on the Athens cable since 1984 or '85.)

WSAZ used to operate in such a way where they literally had a list in their newsroom of every outlying/rural county, with the date someone last reported from there. WSAZ anchor/reporter Carrie Cline literally used to have a day a week where she was forced to do 'something' in Meigs/Athens/Gallia. But this has slipped over the years.

Further, the other two Charleston stations WCHS/WVAH and WOWK won't come to Athens for much short of a quadruple murder. I am actually rather surprised that even amongst the limited Nielsen sample that the Huntington stations would remain primary to Athens County viewers.

Big picture? A phone survey, costing less than $10,000, would likely be enough to prove or disprove the above for litigation purposes and get the system or county the Columbus stations.

Alan Swank
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Posted: 1/4/2012 12:05 PM
Bob Haldeman wrote:expand_more
ANOrris.......I can't think of a dispute recently where it went far enough in litigation that anyone went to the actual work of doing unique/specific survey work to determine whether a county was more likely in or out of a market. Mostly, these decisions for TV markets and moving network affiliates have just wheeled off of the annual Nielsen DMA (Designated Market Area) designations.

That DMA list groups markets nationwide, segmented by whole counties, and ranks them from #1 NYC to #212 or so (Glendive, MT(?)).

Athens County has bounced back and forth between the Chas/Hunt. and Columbus markets for 30 years, though has mainly been in the former. 

If they are using only the Nielsens, which are based on local TV diaries, the statistics could be startlingly thin. The Charleston/Huntington market has 30+ counties. Assuming a ratings diary is going to a thousand homes in the market (very high estimate......likely 600 or less is the reality), this might mean that at most 50 diaries are distributed in Athens County.

Amongst those 50, say, maybe 35 even watch any meaningful local network TV or local news broadcasts. If any of them went to Stewart or Coolville, that subset of people have access the to NBC in Parkersburg (WTAP) and might watch it. So, you might have 30 homes left, for example. These 30 homes, and whether they watch more WCMH or WSAZ are likely all that is making this decision. Statistically insignificant.

(Speaking of WTAP, for bobcat695........their weatherman lives in Athens and drives over every day at 45 mph; he is obsessed with doing stories from over there as a labor saving activity. WTAP has not been on the Athens cable since 1984 or '85.)

WSAZ used to operate in such a way where they literally had a list in their newsroom of every outlying/rural county, with the date someone last reported from there. WSAZ anchor/reporter Carrie Cline literally used to have a day a week where she was forced to do 'something' in Meigs/Athens/Gallia. But this has slipped over the years.

Further, the other two Charleston stations WCHS/WVAH and WOWK won't come to Athens for much short of a quadruple murder. I am actually rather surprised that even amongst the limited Nielsen sample that the Huntington stations would remain primary to Athens County viewers.

Big picture? A phone survey, costing less than $10,000, would likely be enough to prove or disprove the above for litigation purposes and get the system or county the Columbus stations.



Two things - got another call from a higher up at TW this morning.  Nice guy and said that it was based on the Nielsen data.  As for a phone survey, this would be a great project for an OU class.  I'm sure there are some OU lurkers on here - how about it gals and guys?
PutnamField
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Posted: 1/4/2012 1:11 PM
Bob Haldeman wrote:expand_more
(Speaking of WTAP, for bobcat695........their weatherman lives in Athens and drives over every day at 45 mph; he is obsessed with doing stories from over there as a labor saving activity


Sorry to detour the thread, but why does Kirk Groeneveld drive 45 mph? It's a four-lane highway to PKB with a 60 mph speed limit. Just wondering.
Last Edited: 1/4/2012 1:11:50 PM by PutnamField
Bob Haldeman
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Posted: 1/4/2012 1:18 PM
PutnamField wrote:expand_more
(Speaking of WTAP, for bobcat695........their weatherman lives in Athens and drives over every day at 45 mph; he is obsessed with doing stories from over there as a labor saving activity


Sorry to detour the thread, but why does Kirk Groeneveld drive 45 mph? It's a four-lane highway to PKB with a 60 mph speed limit. Just wondering.


Actually, it's usually closer to 40. He says it's the speed for maximum gasoline efficiency.

Metaphorically, Kirker is what happens if Rachel Carson & Jimmy Carter produced a child via Petri dish & Dollar Tree turkey baster. Odd dude, but generally a good one.
PutnamField
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Posted: 1/4/2012 1:25 PM
Bob Haldeman wrote:expand_more
(Speaking of WTAP, for bobcat695........their weatherman lives in Athens and drives over every day at 45 mph; he is obsessed with doing stories from over there as a labor saving activity


Sorry to detour the thread, but why does Kirk Groeneveld drive 45 mph? It's a four-lane highway to PKB with a 60 mph speed limit. Just wondering.


Actually, it's usually closer to 40. He says it's the speed for maximum gasoline efficiency.

Metaphorically, Kirker is what happens if Rachel Carson & Jimmy Carter produced a child via Petri dish & Dollar Tree turkey baster. Odd dude, but generally a good one.


LOL! That explains a lot. What'd be the proper metaphor for Todd Baucher?

Lauren Keeling has about as much on-air personality as a terra cotta flower pot. My biggest beef in terms of the watchability of WTAP News. 
Last Edited: 1/4/2012 1:27:35 PM by PutnamField
JSF
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Posted: 1/4/2012 4:14 PM
Bob Haldeman wrote:expand_more
Actually, it's usually closer to 40. He says it's the speed for maximum gasoline efficiency.


I thought it was around 55.
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Posted: 1/4/2012 4:19 PM
I've always heard if you're between 45 and 60, you're near optimal.

Here's the government's chart:

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Posted: 1/4/2012 4:52 PM
JSF wrote:expand_more
Actually, it's usually closer to 40. He says it's the speed for maximum gasoline efficiency.


I thought it was around 55.


It depends on the aerodynamics of your car. A heavy, less aerodynamic car (SUV) would be closer to 40. A lighter, more streamlined car would be better served to travel closer to 60. People cite 55 as a good average across the board.
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Posted: 1/4/2012 5:34 PM
PutnamField wrote:expand_more
(Speaking of WTAP, for bobcat695........their weatherman lives in Athens and drives over every day at 45 mph; he is obsessed with doing stories from over there as a labor saving activity


Sorry to detour the thread, but why does Kirk Groeneveld drive 45 mph? It's a four-lane highway to PKB with a 60 mph speed limit. Just wondering.


Actually, it's usually closer to 40. He says it's the speed for maximum gasoline efficiency.

Metaphorically, Kirker is what happens if Rachel Carson & Jimmy Carter produced a child via Petri dish & Dollar Tree turkey baster. Odd dude, but generally a good one.


LOL! That explains a lot. What'd be the proper metaphor for Todd Baucher?

Lauren Keeling has about as much on-air personality as a terra cotta flower pot. My biggest beef in terms of the watchability of WTAP News. 


I remember sitting at a red light in Parkersburg years ago and looked in the rearview mirror only to see old Todd in the car behind me.  Talk about a bad broadcaster on a bad station.  Bringing that up made my day Putnam.  Thanks for the chuckle.
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Posted: 1/4/2012 8:58 PM
Another BA first....segue from TV to hypermiling. Just get a Prius and get on with it.....just keep those wheels off the painted lines when they are wet....MPG does not matter much if you resemble a turtle on it;s carapace.

I bought a Honda Si to make the trips to athens and back. No matter whether I am flogging it on 56 through Hocking Hills or flying up 35 through Chilli it always sits right on 31 mpg with miles of smiles.... at 31 MPG I care not as the truck it replaced was good to get 11.9 on a good day. If I want big Mileage to Athens the Kawasaki Councours gets me up to 45 (if I keep it under 90....after that my aerodynamic profile works agin me).  I just thank the lord I have not had to follow the weatherman on a 2 lane. EEEEESH.
Last Edited: 1/4/2012 9:06:20 PM by bornacatfan
JSF
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Posted: 1/5/2012 12:15 AM
I average 32 MPG in my Passat. I love it.
DelBobcat
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Posted: 1/5/2012 12:32 AM
I have a 2003 Chevy Cavalier. Not the prettiest car out there or the most luxurious, but on my last trip to Athens I averaged 35 mpg!
Alan Swank
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Posted: 1/5/2012 10:42 AM
I average 41 in our Smart Car.  With an 8 gallon tank, I've never spent more than $30 to fill it up.
OU_Country
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Posted: 1/5/2012 11:07 AM
bornacatfan wrote:expand_more
I watch Cols news when I am over there.....eeessshhh i thought Indianapolis was bad enough that I still keep my distant feeds from the coast on Directv till I started watching those jokers on Channel 4 and 10 in Columbus.


I live here, and I agree.  The local news channels (and Dispatch to some degree) might as well be called Buckeye TV, with a little weather, and a few shootings and four alarm fires scattered in.

On the cars, I have a Honda Fit.  I've seen what laying off the gas can do for me, and it's usually only giving me 1, no more than 2, extra mpg.  I get about 31-34 on average, and like Alan, rarely spend more than $30 to fill up.

I'm curious if JSF's Passat is a gas or diesel?  I have buddy that has a VW Golf TDI and it gets him around 40-45 mpg.
bornacatfan
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Posted: 1/5/2012 12:57 PM
Alan Swank wrote:expand_more
I average 41 in our Smart Car.  With an 8 gallon tank, I've never spent more than $30 to fill it up.


Not sure I wanna do Muncie to the MAC sites in a smart car. I 'll pay the extra or ride the bike.....sposed to be 50 tomorrow....may need to burnup some road over to Ada and then BG.

JSF
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Posted: 1/5/2012 1:47 PM
OU_Country wrote:expand_more
I'm curious if JSF's Passat is a gas or diesel?  I have buddy that has a VW Golf TDI and it gets him around 40-45 mpg.


Gas. It's a 99, so it's probably not getting optimal mileage anymore. The turbo probably hurts some too. I can actually get more in city than highway, but I drive highway a lot more.
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