Ohio Basketball Topic
Topic: Here We Go... Basketball BE Members Talk Split
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C Money
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Posted: 12/13/2012 12:53 PM
PalmerFest wrote:expand_more
Is there any downside for the MAC in at least making an offer to those schools in limbo?  Yes, we could be laughed at but we usually are anyway.


If they accept, we become a 17-team revenue sports conference, which is too big. Kick out EMU and we get down to 16, a nice round number but probably still too big.

Edit: I'm wrong. UMass being football-only, we'd be a 17-team football conference and a 16 team basketball conference, unless we could cajole UMass into joining for all sports.
Last Edited: 12/13/2012 12:55:36 PM by C Money
mf279801
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Posted: 12/13/2012 3:48 PM
First, I readily admit that I might be completely off on my intrepretation of the rules, but according to Brett McMurphy's article on the subject (http://espn.go.com/college-sports/story/_/id/8742607/seven-catholic-schools-leaning-leaving-big-east-sources-say) ..., well, let me go through my rational step by step:

(1) It takes a 2/3 majority vote to dissolve the Big East
(2) Due to the teams leaving and joining the league, there are only 10 members eligible to vote on disolving the conference (the 7 Catholic schools + Cincinnati, UCONN, and USF...Temple does NOT get a vote because its not yet a full member), meaning that the 7 Catholic NON-FBS schools have the votes to dissolve the league
(3) McMurphy states "If the seven schools decide to move to a new league, they would keep their automatic berth in the NCAA tournament. NCAA rules state that as long as a group of seven universities have been in the same league for five years, they would keep their bid after a move together."

Leaving aside what happens with the name or previously earned NCAA tournament monies, I think this means that the 7 BB-only schools could vote to dissolve the league and "instantly" reform it around themselves, with or without the addition of varied other members (e.g. Dayton, Xavier, Butler, etc) without worry of losing their conference's NCAA-autobid.

If I read the rule correctly, it also means that the remaining schools (or Big East Refugees as CMoney named them) would NOT immediately have an automatic NCAA-tournament spot were they to try to form a standalone league: among the current-future Big East membership, there is no combination of 7 schools that have been in the same conference as one-another for 5 years.
JSF
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Posted: 12/14/2012 3:21 AM
This seems virtually inevitable. And I love it. Suck it, football!
rpbobcat
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Posted: 12/14/2012 7:12 AM
According to today's papers and sports talk radio out here,the seven Catholic Scools are looking to form a new "Basketball Centric" league with Butler, Xavier and possibly 3 other schools.
 
A couple of interesting points:

1.The Catholic schools can leave the Big East without penalties

2.There is a question who has the right to use the name "Big East".
   
3.Even though these are basketball only schools,there are rumors that, even with additional football schools coming in,the BE could loose its automatic BCS bid .
C Money
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Posted: 12/14/2012 7:45 AM
rpbobcat wrote:expand_more
3.Even though these are basketball only schools,there are rumors that, even with additional football schools coming in,the BE could loose its automatic BCS bid .


It's not a rumor. It's been the plan since the playoff format was rolled out. Beginning 2014, the Big East and the MAC are (or is it "were" now?) on equal footing with auto-bids. And this is why every team that left a conference for the Big East was stupid. The relationship was unsustainable, the breakdown was inevitable, and the bridges back are toast. 

I don't have the highest opinion of Oliver Luck, but I'm starting to think he had a point. The conference has been grossly mismanaged, and now looks like it's finally about to die.
rpbobcat
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Posted: 12/14/2012 8:21 AM
C Money wrote:expand_more
3.Even though these are basketball only schools,there are rumors that, even with additional football schools coming in,the BE could loose its automatic BCS bid .


It's not a rumor. It's been the plan since the playoff format was rolled out. Beginning 2014, the Big East and the MAC are (or is it "were" now?) on equal footing with auto-bids. And this is why every team that left a conference for the Big East was stupid. The relationship was unsustainable, the breakdown was inevitable, and the bridges back are toast. 

I don't have the highest opinion of Oliver Luck, but I'm starting to think he had a point. The conference has been grossly mismanaged, and now looks like it's finally about to die.


Sorry,I wasn't clear.
The rumor is that the automatic BCS Bid may be gone for 2013.
Ohio69
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Posted: 12/14/2012 9:09 AM
C Money wrote:expand_more
The conference has been grossly mismanaged, and now looks like it's finally about to die.


The Big East was started as a basketball conference.  I say the mismanagement started the second it tried to transform itself into a football conference in a region of the country that is much more interested by the NFL and not college football. 

Also, the NCAA's antiquated rules regarding basketball automatic bids has caused a lot of problems.  Common sense says if the Big East splits the two entities should both get automatic bids.  But, no.....

As a native Connectican and Uconn fan, I now wish for UConn to try to stick with the Georgetowns and Villanovas and figure out a football only home for football.  Like the MAC.  Or FCS.  That's just not gonna happen however.
Pataskala
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Posted: 12/14/2012 1:34 PM
rpbobcat wrote:expand_more
3.Even though these are basketball only schools,there are rumors that, even with additional football schools coming in,the BE could loose its automatic BCS bid .


It's not a rumor. It's been the plan since the playoff format was rolled out. Beginning 2014, the Big East and the MAC are (or is it "were" now?) on equal footing with auto-bids. And this is why every team that left a conference for the Big East was stupid. The relationship was unsustainable, the breakdown was inevitable, and the bridges back are toast. 

I don't have the highest opinion of Oliver Luck, but I'm starting to think he had a point. The conference has been grossly mismanaged, and now looks like it's finally about to die.


Sorry,I wasn't clear.
The rumor is that the automatic BCS Bid may be gone for 2013.


I think when they talk about 2014, they mean the BCS games that are played in 2014, at the end of the 2013 season.
JSF
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Posted: 12/14/2012 2:37 PM
Ohio69 wrote:expand_more
Common sense says if the Big East splits the two entities should both get automatic bids.  But, no.....


I disagree. This helps prevent things like the WAC getting backstabbed in an airport.
TheBikeman
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Posted: 12/14/2012 4:34 PM
I think Duquesne would be included because of the Pittsburgh TV market, Dayton doesn't have  market and Butler doesn't either.  I think the Catholic schools should work together and leave Richmond URI out of it
Bobcat110alum
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Posted: 12/14/2012 4:45 PM
SonnyDrysdale wrote:expand_more
I think Duquesne would be included because of the Pittsburgh TV market, Dayton doesn't have  market and Butler doesn't either.  I think the Catholic schools should work together and leave Richmond URI out of it


I may be mistaken, but I would assume that the new basketball league would not be interested in TV markets.  A strictly basketball driven league would be nuts to include Duquesne and not Butler.  
giacomo
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Posted: 12/14/2012 4:48 PM
Butler has the Indianapolis market, while Duquesne is not even on the radar screen in Pittsburgh(sorry John Rhodes). They draw poorly to their 6k seat arena. Pitt dominates the news and it will only get worse when they are playing an ACC schedule. In the Post Gazette, Pitt gets a pro-like box score and front sports page coverage. Duquesne gets middle page and high school type box score. When Duquesne beats WVU and Roethlisberger gets a hang nail, the hang nail gets more coverage.
BobcatSports
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Posted: 12/14/2012 7:53 PM
The NYPost is reporting that the A10 has scheduled a meeting for next Thursday to take roll call about who is still committed since the BE Gang of Seven has decided to strike out on their own.

It reports that Creighton has already been contacted by the soon to be departed Catholic Schools about their interest and naturally Xavier and Butler are already reported to have "one foot out the door".

Sonny: you may be on to something with Duquesne. The report also states that the Dukes have become a "team of interest" as well.

No doubt change is a comin.
bn9
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Posted: 12/14/2012 9:09 PM
Tyler Charles wrote:expand_more
I think Duquesne would be included because of the Pittsburgh TV market, Dayton doesn't have market and Butler doesn't either. I think the Catholic schools should work together and leave Richmond URI out of it


I may be mistaken, but I would assume that the new basketball league would not be interested in TV markets. A strictly basketball driven league would be nuts to include Duquesne and not Butler.
Right, it seems like the hoops schools are going to be more concerned about NCAA win shares than tv contracts.
bornacatfan
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Posted: 12/15/2012 12:01 AM
Interesting, over on the Xavier board they are very excited about these developments. Catholic league or staying in the A10 they feel they are sitting in the drivers seat. and incedentally, they feel they should be in a league that "sheilds them from the cluster ... that is football"

CIncy  and the other BE 's with football seem to be out in the cold for now.
Pete Chouteau
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Posted: 12/15/2012 12:24 PM
Xavier should be excited. It's absurd, but contextually understandable, that the Catholics have never gotten on the same page.

If you think about who XU was playing and how many people they did it in front of 20 years ago in the Cincinnati Gardens, you understand.
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