Ohio Basketball Topic
Topic: The Next Level
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The Optimist
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Posted: 3/7/2013 7:54 PM
KyleWvr13 wrote:expand_more

MAC would not let us be football only,.  

 

Why not?
 

Temple was football only. UMass is football only.
 

Why would the MAC not let Ohio be football only?
 

What are they going to do? Kick us out?



I feel like since we are an all-sports member, they would be less inclined for us to let us leave for everything expect for football.  I would imagine that we would have to pay a premium exit fee if we stayed for Football.  But this is just a feeling.

 

Speaking to only basketball, I bet we could find donors willing to pay a pretty sizable exit fee if it meant Ohio in the MVC in men's hoops.  I could certainly see all the sports besides football and hoops being an issue... I doubt the MVC is as strong or as close as the MAC in the Olympic sports, but I have no idea.

Speaker of Truth
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Posted: 3/7/2013 8:05 PM
Answer me these questions:

Why would the MVC want us?

How would we pay the exit fees?

How would be we pay the huge increase in travel?

Would Athletics be able to justify student fees by building awareness in the region and being a fundraising tool if our "big" games were at Wichita State and Southern Illinois?

Is that move worth souring our relationship with our counterparts in the MAC?  This would be beyond athletics?

Do we really have that much power in the MAC?

Is it more important for OU to be semi known in he MVC and their demographics? Or have a strong hold on the current MAC footprint?

Do you really know something that Schaus(History with the MVC) and McDavis(Serves on multiple NCAA commitees) don't know?

Why fix what isn't broke?

I think when you answer these questions, you will see it is not in the best interest of OU to make the jump to the MVC.  The Big East would have many of the same exspense problems and are also very unstable.

Columbus_Bobcat
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Posted: 3/7/2013 9:25 PM
I'm pretty sure #MACtion has been mentioned more than. Lets watch that Missouri Valley Conference game! WOO!

Let's see how good we do the next four years and see what the conferences are offering and what our expenses will be with exit fees and travel. 
Mark Lembright '85
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Posted: 3/7/2013 9:34 PM
The Optimist wrote:expand_more

MAC would not let us be football only,.  

 

Why not?
 

Temple was football only. UMass is football only.
 

Why would the MAC not let Ohio be football only?
 

What are they going to do? Kick us out?



Not that the MAC could stop a move by Ohio in the long run, the MAC won't willingly let Ohio leave in b-ball (or football for that matter) so freely; Ohio's a founding member of the MAC and one of its flagship members.
JSF
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Posted: 3/7/2013 9:52 PM
Bobcats_828 wrote:expand_more
I'm pretty sure #MACtion has been mentioned more than. Lets watch that Missouri Valley Conference game! WOO!


I wonder how often CBS will say #MACtion while broadcasting the MVC finals...

By the way, MVC has a pretty darn good TV package and excellent attendance. As far as basketball goes, the MAC can't touch it.
ClevelandCat '11
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Posted: 3/7/2013 10:14 PM
JSF wrote:expand_more
I'm pretty sure #MACtion has been mentioned more than. Lets watch that Missouri Valley Conference game! WOO!


I wonder how often CBS will say #MACtion while broadcasting the MVC finals...

By the way, MVC has a pretty darn good TV package and excellent attendance. As far as basketball goes, the MAC can't touch it.


MVC>MAC basketball. Its not even close. The only negative is that it would increase travel for our team, but the level of play and recognition is way higher than in the MAC
Athens
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Posted: 3/8/2013 12:32 AM
For comparison purposes having a 20,000 seat arena in basketball is like having a 100,000 seat stadium in football. At a 5 to 1 ratio averaging 7,000 in basketball is like averaging 35,000 in football. Ohio is the basketball version of East Carolina with fan support that is too big to ignore despite the small market. The average would be even higher if it wasn't for the fact the school plays so many home games in November and December. Its a huge asset to have, That is why Ohio would get a look before Akron at another conference like ECU did with Big East before Charlotte. I know that fans on this board admire the MVC but the A10 would be a better fit from a geography perspective. That league is tied into the big markets of the East Coast where Ohio wants to recruit its out of state students from. Ohio has no problem recruiting students in state without athletics so playing in the MAC doesn't do anything for school. Its the same story every year in the MAC. Two very good teams contending for the NCAAs. Can one of them earn an at-large? Nope once they drop a game on the road to the likes of Buffalo. Akron wins 19 in a row and is on the outside looking in with 1 loss. Its different level in the A10. UMass has a conference record of 8-7 with an RPI of #55 higher than Ohio's. Temple has a record of 22-8 the same has Ohio but the RPI is #43.  The basketball program is ready to make a move let's home something happens
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 3/8/2013 1:38 AM
Yes!  Another thread about the Bobcats moving to a new conference...despite there being not a scintilla of evidence that there's a chance that it will happen or that anyone who can make it happen is considering it.

Party on!
KyleWvr13
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Posted: 3/8/2013 2:07 AM

Last Edited: 3/8/2013 2:08:50 AM by KyleWvr13
OUVan
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Posted: 3/8/2013 5:18 AM
Monroe Slavin wrote:expand_more
Yes!  Another thread about the Bobcats moving to a new conference...despite there being not a scintilla of evidence that there's a chance that it will happen or that anyone who can make it happen is considering it.

Party on!


I challenge you to find the most recent one on the basketball board.   Well, at least we know the Content Police are hard at work.  If you could please forward me the list of acceptable topics.  The only one I seem to be able to remember is "Random one or two word catch phrases blurted out for no reason."  
Columbus_Bobcat
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Posted: 3/8/2013 7:55 PM
I do think the MAC has some talent, in which this Akron and Kent State game shows, but if Creighton were to stay in the MVC and the MVC were to get another good team like Murray State, I would think we should look into going into the MVC. Multi-team bid conference. MAC hasn't had two teams since 1999.
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 3/9/2013 2:17 AM
OUVan wrote:expand_more
Yes!  Another thread about the Bobcats moving to a new conference...despite there being not a scintilla of evidence that there's a chance that it will happen or that anyone who can make it happen is considering it.

Party on!


I challenge you to find the most recent one on the basketball board.   Well, at least we know the Content Police are hard at work.  If you could please forward me the list of acceptable topics.  The only one I seem to be able to remember is "Random one or two word catch phrases blurted out for no reason."  



This must be a great day for you.  Once again, you put up a worthless post knocking on me.  Oh.  Apparently that's your top acceptable.

Stop being boring.
MissouriStateBears
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Posted: 3/12/2013 4:39 PM
Hey Guys, I can tell you right now that the MVC would love to add you to basketball along with Akron and Kent State. You 3 would be a solid addition. The only question is where you would park your football program?

I think if we could do that and maybe pick up a Dayton as well, that we would be a very powerful force to reckon with.
bornacatfan
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Posted: 3/12/2013 5:00 PM
MissouriStateBears wrote:expand_more
Hey Guys, I can tell you right now that the MVC would love to add you to basketball along with Akron and Kent State. You 3 would be a solid addition. The only question is where you would park your football program?

I think if we could do that and maybe pick up a Dayton as well, that we would be a very powerful force to reckon with.


welcome to the board.

Glad to see others are outside looking in.
Athens
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Posted: 3/12/2013 6:16 PM
MissouriStateBears wrote:expand_more
I think if we could do that and maybe pick up a Dayton as well, that we would be a very powerful force to reckon with.


Dayton if they don't end up in the Catholic League should take Creighton's opening in the Missouri Valley. A perfect replacement school in available. The geography to me doesn't work for Ohio to the MVC. Unless the MVC wants to invite Miami, BG and Kent State along with us then it would be okay.
LoganElm_grad09
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Posted: 3/12/2013 6:24 PM
MissouriStateBears wrote:expand_more
Hey Guys, I can tell you right now that the MVC would love to add you to basketball along with Akron and Kent State. You 3 would be a solid addition. The only question is where you would park your football program?

I think if we could do that and maybe pick up a Dayton as well, that we would be a very powerful force to reckon with.


It's great to have outside perspectives come to Bobcatattack.  Welcome aboard!

Question:  when you say the MVC would love to add our basketball, is this more of a word of mouth thing, something on message boards, or an article of some kind?
greencat
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Posted: 3/12/2013 6:35 PM
OUVan wrote:expand_more
In a basketball only scenario, wouldn't Murray State or Belmont be better?


Why would they be better fits?  Both are much smaller schools with smaller basketball budgets.  Plus we've already stepped up our financial commitment to levels closer to MVC schools.  Both Murray State and Belmont have had nice runs but that doesn't mean they are now basketball schools. Both have relatively new rinky-dink arenas.  We are a much better candidate than either.


I don't think Belmont will leave the OVC which geographically is perfect for them... however, being in a population and media center does make them an attractive candidate as well as being academically respected.  Their new arena is nice buy only holds about 5500 (3000 less than Murray)...however when Belmont was NAIA rivals with nearby Lipscomb, they actually sold out a Belmont-Lipscomb "battle of the boulevard" game in Vandy's gym once - over 14,000 local sports fans showed up.  Belmont could also play some games at Nash. Municipal where they just played Murray (9,000+ capacity) or Bridgestone Arena (17,000)

With MTSU going to C-USA, the MAC should consider trying to get Western Kentucky and Belmont.  Conferences might pass on Murray because they are 1-aa in football and in the middle of BFE. 
Athens
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Posted: 3/12/2013 6:39 PM
I've changed my mind. I could live with the MVC if they added Ohio, Akron and Miami. That give the MVC 3 schools in Ohio each within 1 hour of the 3 major cities Cincinnati, Columbus and Cleveland. Then in the division have us in there with Indiana St, Illinois St and Bradley. Akron over Kent State because they've shown more of a financial commitment. Miami has made the NCAA tournament 17 times and is only 4-5 hours from St. Louis. That would make Ohio an MVC state and the MAC a close cousin of the Summit League. It would be better of the NIU's and EMU's because thy split the automatic bid 9 ways instead of 12 and they would have a legit chance at a MAC tourney championship. I didn't realize baseball was better in the MVC that would be a nice perk. The MAC would have no choice but to let the 3 schools stay for football in that case.
Athens
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Posted: 3/12/2013 6:49 PM
Belmont doesn't have football. That is a non-starter in the MAC.
JSF
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Posted: 3/12/2013 9:28 PM
MissouriStateBears wrote:expand_more
Hey Guys, I can tell you right now that the MVC would love to add you to basketball along with Akron and Kent State. You 3 would be a solid addition.


Make some phone calls!
The Optimist
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Posted: 3/12/2013 10:46 PM

Uncle Wes wrote:expand_more
I've changed my mind. I could live with the MVC if they added Ohio, Akron and Miami. That give the MVC 3 schools in Ohio each within 1 hour of the 3 major cities Cincinnati, Columbus and Cleveland. Then in the division have us in there with Indiana St, Illinois St and Bradley. Akron over Kent State because they've shown more of a financial commitment. Miami has made the NCAA tournament 17 times and is only 4-5 hours from St. Louis. That would make Ohio an MVC state and the MAC a close cousin of the Summit League. It would be better of the NIU's and EMU's because thy split the automatic bid 9 ways instead of 12 and they would have a legit chance at a MAC tourney championship. I didn't realize baseball was better in the MVC that would be a nice perk. The MAC would have no choice but to let the 3 schools stay for football in that case.

 

This is an incredibly realistic scenario, IMO. I think you hit the nail on the head with regards to thr MAC being unable to turn away 3 key current football members. Would it ruffle some feathers? Absolutely.  Well worth it for the upgrade we get in basketball.
 

I wonder if the MVC would go for Akron, Ohio and Toledo (instead of Miami).  While I would hate to lose our rivalry with Miami, they are at a point right now where they just do not seem to care about athletics all that much.  Toledo is committed to spending and has shown attendance potential plus a decent market.  While I would like to stick with Miami, if the MVC came calling about us with Kron and Toledo no Fiami wouldn't be a dealbreaker for me..
 

As I understand it, the MVC needs teams now. I do not see any better options than 3 Ohio schools.
 

Crazier things have happened.

MissouriStateBears
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Posted: 3/13/2013 8:41 AM
LoganElm_grad09 wrote:expand_more
Hey Guys, I can tell you right now that the MVC would love to add you to basketball along with Akron and Kent State. You 3 would be a solid addition. The only question is where you would park your football program?

I think if we could do that and maybe pick up a Dayton as well, that we would be a very powerful force to reckon with.


It's great to have outside perspectives come to Bobcatattack.  Welcome aboard!

Question:  when you say the MVC would love to add our basketball, is this more of a word of mouth thing, something on message boards, or an article of some kind?


At this point its just being batted around on various message boards but I'm sure that the MVC front office would take you in a heartbeat if you had a place to park your football team. Would the MAC let you keep football there if this scenario were to come up?
MissouriStateBears
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Posted: 3/13/2013 8:46 AM
The Optimist wrote:expand_more

MAC would not let us be football only,.  

 

Why not?
 

Temple was football only. UMass is football only.
 

Why would the MAC not let Ohio be football only?
 

What are they going to do? Kick us out?



I feel like since we are an all-sports member, they would be less inclined for us to let us leave for everything expect for football.  I would imagine that we would have to pay a premium exit fee if we stayed for Football.  But this is just a feeling.

 

Speaking to only basketball, I bet we could find donors willing to pay a pretty sizable exit fee if it meant Ohio in the MVC in men's hoops.  I could certainly see all the sports besides football and hoops being an issue... I doubt the MVC is as strong or as close as the MAC in the Olympic sports, but I have no idea.



We have great olympic sports in the MVC, in fact, Missouri State already competes in the MAC for a few of our sports right now, including swimming and diving and field hockey. We have a very strong baseball league (#5 in this weeks RPI), and are pretty well known for our volleyball as well.  
Athens
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Posted: 3/13/2013 9:13 AM
They way I look at a conference is that its like a haircut. It has to do something for you. Back in the 1950's before the 4 lane highways Athens was a very difficult place to get to out-of-state. The MAC offered a bus friendly D1 league for Ohio when we needed it. Today with the charter flights and highways travel that opens Ohio up to participating in a major basketball conference. There is also the institutional aspect and that is why Ohio's always been aligned with Miami in a league. The basketball benefits to Ohio of joining either the MVC or A10 is roughly equal. The institutional benefits of aligning with good East Coast schools in the A10 are far greater. Indiana State is the closest MVC member at 5:30 hours. Evansville is 6 hours. In the the A10 Duquense is 3:30 hours, GWU 6 hours and St. Bonnie 6:30 hours, VCU is 6:30 hours. At the furthest, Wichita St. is 15 hours and UMass is 12 hours. Travel in the A10 is generally less and schools are located close to major airports cutting the cost of air travel. I could accept the MVC if Miami was involved. Miami is closer to the MVC schools than Toledo and has more tradition. Going back to the A10 there is some history between Ohio and Duquense/St. Bonaventure.
OUVan
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Posted: 3/13/2013 9:20 AM
Uncle Wes wrote:expand_more
They way I look at a conference is that its like a haircut. It has to do something for you. Back in the 1950's before the 4 lane highways Athens was a very difficult place to get to out-of-state. The MAC offered a bus friendly D1 league for Ohio when we needed it. Today with the charter flights and highways travel that opens Ohio up to participating in a major basketball conference. There is also the institutional aspect and that is why Ohio's always been aligned with Miami in a league. The basketball benefits to Ohio of joining either the MVC or A10 is roughly equal. The institutional benefits of aligning with good East Coast schools in the A10 are far greater. Indiana State is the closest MVC member at 5:30 hours. Evansville is 6 hours. In the the A10 Duquense is 3:30 hours, GWU 6 hours and St. Bonnie 6:30 hours, VCU is 6:30 hours. At the furthest, Wichita St. is 15 hours and UMass is 12 hours. Travel in the A10 is generally less and schools are located close to major airports cutting the cost of air travel. I could accept the MVC if Miami was involved. Miami is closer to the MVC schools than Toledo and has more tradition. Going back to the A10 there is some history between Ohio and Duquense/St. Bonaventure.


Miami would need to make a financial commitment that they have shown no interest in up to now.  That would be best case scenario but I'm not sure they will.
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