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Topic: Fair or Foul?
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GoCats105
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Posted: 1/15/2014 1:34 PM
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Since there's always lenghty arguments and discussions on this board about where loyalties lie when rooting for the Bobcats and Buckeyes, I thought it would be interesting to post this scenario on here.

A friend and former co-worker of mine is a Xavier graduate. However, he is a diehard UC fan. Even to the point that he wears UC gear. During the annual Crosstown Shootout (sorry Showdown does not fit, I don't care what Shootout entails), he pulls for the Bearcats and not the Musketeers, who gave him almost free tuition and a Bachelor's degree. Just to get on his case I will ask him how in the heck he roots for UC when he graduated from X. Upbringing is usually the answer, yada yada yada. The best part is, he lives in Kentucky. Go figure.

We can argue all we want about how rooting for the Buckeyes is a sin, but if I were a Xavier alum or fan I'd be irate about this. I like rooting for X, not to the extent of Ohio, and it even gets me a little annoyed. It's one thing to root for a school we don't hardly ever play (OSU). But can you ever in your imagination imagine an Ohio grad rooting for Miami when they play each other?
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Posted: 1/15/2014 1:47 PM
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I can't imagine anyone rooting for UC in any circumstances but that's just me, I guess.  And in your friend's defense, at least we getting him rooting against M^%$# once or twice a year this way.

When he starts referring to his adopted school as "The" University of Cincinnati that will push me over the edge.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 1:50 PM
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I guess I'm not "superfan" because when I read stuff like this, the first thing that pops into my head is who cares and why?  Not only would it not bother me to find out someone who received a degree (or multiple) from Ohio would root for Miami, I wouldn't care.  What difference does it make?  If I saw someone walking across college green wearing an Ohio jacket and a Miami hat, would I allow this to bother me to my core?  No, of course not.  I'm sure some fanatics would, but that ain't me.  I must not have read my OU application closely enough to understand that being admitted to go to school here makes Ohio the only collegiate team I am permitted to cheer for throughout the remainder of my existence on the planet.

I'll never understand why some people allow such trivial things to bother them so much.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 2:04 PM
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100%Cat wrote:expand_more
I guess I'm not "superfan" because when I read stuff like this, the first thing that pops into my head is who cares and why?  Not only would it not bother me to find out someone who received a degree (or multiple) from Ohio would root for Miami, I wouldn't care.  What difference does it make?  If I saw someone walking across college green wearing an Ohio jacket and a Miami hat, would I allow this to bother me to my core?  No, of course not.  I'm sure some fanatics would, but that ain't me.  I must not have read my OU application closely enough to understand that being admitted to go to school here makes Ohio the only collegiate team I am permitted to cheer for throughout the remainder of my existence on the planet.

I'll never understand why some people allow such trivial things to bother them so much.


I will root for all kinds of schools even though I graduated from two different ones. But, rooting for a rival school, the biggest rival, when you went to the other? Especially when they play each other? As a sports fan in general it just seems silly. Unless your kids went to both schools or the rival I can see why you would root for them. 

I see your point because in the grand scheme of things rivalries in sports are like arguing between two different kinds of cheese. I just thought this was an interesting take on things compared to the seemingly infinite argument of OSU/Ohio.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 2:06 PM
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Bobcatbob wrote:expand_more
I can't imagine anyone rooting for UC in any circumstances but that's just me, I guess.  And in your friend's defense, at least we getting him rooting against M^%$# once or twice a year this way.

When he starts referring to his adopted school as "The" University of Cincinnati that will push me over the edge.


Living here for the better part of 7 years I have learned two things about UC fans:

1. They think they're a lot bigger and better than they really are. In everything. Not just basketball.

2. Nippert Stadium is the greatest football stadium in the country. These are the facts of the case and they are indisputable. Yet they rarely sell out.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 2:11 PM
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college sports started when students from Harvard and Yale would argue about who's rowing team was better, so one day they decided to find out and eventually it grew to what we know today. The reason people cheer for their school is either to support their classmates or for bragging rights saying that the school I go to is better than yours. That's why I don't get why people cheer for OSU who don't go there. You have no ties to the school you have no reason to cheer for them. I wouldn't necessary get mad at a person for wearing that gear here but I would in no way understand it. Can anybody give me a good reason for why people that don't go to OSU cheer for them. I've talked to so many people on campus who said they would root for OSU over Ohio if they played. It absolutely baffles me. I also met someone who said if Ohio played duke in bball they would root for duke. I just don't get it
Last Edited: 1/15/2014 2:12:44 PM by TheBobcatBandit
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Posted: 1/15/2014 2:24 PM
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TheBobcatBandit wrote:expand_more
college sports started when students from Harvard and Yale would argue about who's rowing team was better, so one day they decided to find out and eventually it grew to what we know today. The reason people cheer for their school is either to support their classmates or for bragging rights saying that the school I go to is better than yours. That's why I don't get why people cheer for OSU who don't go there. You have no ties to the school you have no reason to cheer for them. I wouldn't necessary get mad at a person for wearing that gear here but I would in no way understand it. Can anybody give me a good reason for why people that don't go to OSU cheer for them. I've talked to so many people on campus who said they would root for OSU over Ohio if they played. It absolutely baffles me. I also met someone who said if Ohio played duke in bball they would root for duke. I just don't get it


I can give you a good reason why people would wear Miami and OSU gear here: the graduate program I work in gets students from both.  Lots of them, actually.  I would bet that most years 1/4 of our students went to Miami/OSU. 
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Posted: 1/15/2014 2:40 PM
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TheBobcatBandit wrote:expand_more
college sports started when students from Harvard and Yale would argue about who's rowing team was better, so one day they decided to find out and eventually it grew to what we know today. The reason people cheer for their school is either to support their classmates or for bragging rights saying that the school I go to is better than yours. That's why I don't get why people cheer for OSU who don't go there. You have no ties to the school you have no reason to cheer for them. I wouldn't necessary get mad at a person for wearing that gear here but I would in no way understand it. Can anybody give me a good reason for why people that don't go to OSU cheer for them. I've talked to so many people on campus who said they would root for OSU over Ohio if they played. It absolutely baffles me. I also met someone who said if Ohio played duke in bball they would root for duke. I just don't get it


Those people would want to be associated with winners. They would rather "be a part" of a winning process (even though they play no role in the game's outcome) versus take pride in their "home" school. Psychologically, aligning with a winning program you have no ties to signals a fear of individuality and adventure.

I saw that on Dr. Phil. 
 
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Posted: 1/15/2014 2:48 PM
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For me, it's meaningless.  It's like letting it bother you that there are NFL fans in Ohio who have the audacity to root for a team not named the Bengals or Browns.  What "attachment" are you supposed to have to a professional team?  Are you limited geographically?  No.  Then why do you have to have been a student at a college to root for their sports teams?
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Posted: 1/15/2014 3:38 PM
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For what it's worth, right now on campus, in the shadow of the Convo (practically), I can see our students in class wearing either shirts or jackets representing the following schools:

-Ohio
-Ohio State
-Wittenberg
-Ohio Northern
-Mount Union
-Duquesne
-Miami
-Navy
-Air Force
-Purdue
-Findlay

Can I expect the room to spontaneously explode at any moment due to these abominations to the code of fan conduct?
Last Edited: 1/15/2014 3:45:01 PM by 100%Cat
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Posted: 1/15/2014 3:55 PM
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100%Cat wrote:expand_more
For me, it's meaningless.  It's like letting it bother you that there are NFL fans in Ohio who have the audacity to root for a team not named the Bengals or Browns.  What "attachment" are you supposed to have to a professional team?  Are you limited geographically?  No.  Then why do you have to have been a student at a college to root for their sports teams?


I don't think professional sports and college sports are one in the same in this aspect. Now, I will contend the line between the two has become more and more grey over time with the commecialization of the college athletic landscape, but that's an entirely different can of worms to open. Being connected and having pride in a school which gave you something (experiences, educations, relationships) is different from a professional team which doesn't really provide anything but enjoyment.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 4:02 PM
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OhioStunter wrote:expand_more
Those people would want to be associated with winners. They would rather "be a part" of a winning process (even though they play no role in the game's outcome) versus take pride in their "home" school. Psychologically, aligning with a winning program you have no ties to signals a fear of individuality and adventure. 

 
I've always considered this the number one reason I'm surrounded (in my neighborhood, at work, etc. . .) by o$u fans. Have some adventure. Have some guts. Have some moxie and root for the "underdog". The Ohios of the college athletic world don't experience success at the same rate as the Ohio States, but it sure is sweeter when we do.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 4:14 PM
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Yeah, you can't bring pro sports into this. I don't think I would become a Broncos fan if I ever have to move out to Denver. Furthermore, step into a Buffalo Wild Wings on a Sunday afternoon anywhere in America, and you may very well see at least one fan of every NFL team because that business recognizes that fans of all teams have had their lives place them in their new city.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 4:19 PM
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GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
For me, it's meaningless.  It's like letting it bother you that there are NFL fans in Ohio who have the audacity to root for a team not named the Bengals or Browns.  What "attachment" are you supposed to have to a professional team?  Are you limited geographically?  No.  Then why do you have to have been a student at a college to root for their sports teams?


I don't think professional sports and college sports are one in the same in this aspect. Now, I will contend the line between the two has become more and more grey over time with the commecialization of the college athletic landscape, but that's an entirely different can of worms to open. Being connected and having pride in a school which gave you something (experiences, educations, relationships) is different from a professional team which doesn't really provide anything but enjoyment.


I think what bothers me is that I interpret that bold section as saying "If you have no 'connection' to the school, you have no business rooting for their sports teams." I know people who have no connection to Ohio but root for Ohio University.  Should we tell these people we don't want their support?
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Posted: 1/15/2014 4:32 PM
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100%Cat wrote:expand_more
college sports started when students from Harvard and Yale would argue about who's rowing team was better, so one day they decided to find out and eventually it grew to what we know today. The reason people cheer for their school is either to support their classmates or for bragging rights saying that the school I go to is better than yours. That's why I don't get why people cheer for OSU who don't go there. You have no ties to the school you have no reason to cheer for them. I wouldn't necessary get mad at a person for wearing that gear here but I would in no way understand it. Can anybody give me a good reason for why people that don't go to OSU cheer for them. I've talked to so many people on campus who said they would root for OSU over Ohio if they played. It absolutely baffles me. I also met someone who said if Ohio played duke in bball they would root for duke. I just don't get it


I can give you a good reason why people would wear Miami and OSU gear here: the graduate program I work in gets students from both. Lots of them, actually. I would bet that most years 1/4 of our students went to Miami/OSU.
I'm fine with graduate students. They went to both schools so they have a reason. But most of the people I talk to are undergraduates who root for a school they have no ties with. I'm talking about people you work with who went to Kent, Ohio, Akron, ect... and still cheer for OSU. IF you like a team just because their good that's not a good reason. I have no respect for people who do that. They just jump on the bandwagon because they want to be associated with winning. that's stupid. Loyalty, (in my opinion) is the best attribute someone can have. If your not loyal to something as basic as a sports team. How can I trust you with anything.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 4:34 PM
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100%Cat wrote:expand_more
For me, it's meaningless.  It's like letting it bother you that there are NFL fans in Ohio who have the audacity to root for a team not named the Bengals or Browns.  What "attachment" are you supposed to have to a professional team?  Are you limited geographically?  No.  Then why do you have to have been a student at a college to root for their sports teams?


I don't think professional sports and college sports are one in the same in this aspect. Now, I will contend the line between the two has become more and more grey over time with the commecialization of the college athletic landscape, but that's an entirely different can of worms to open. Being connected and having pride in a school which gave you something (experiences, educations, relationships) is different from a professional team which doesn't really provide anything but enjoyment.


I think what bothers me is that I interpret that bold section as saying "If you have no 'connection' to the school, you have no business rooting for their sports teams." I know people who have no connection to Ohio but root for Ohio University.  Should we tell these people we don't want their support?


That's a fair argument. One that I don't particularly have an answer for. My question would be, "how many of these are there?" out there for smaller schools like Ohio? Not like we can just deny anyone's support by any means. We need all the help we can get. But my initial guess is that these are few and far between.
Last Edited: 1/15/2014 4:35:27 PM by GoCats105
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Posted: 1/15/2014 4:38 PM
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GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
For me, it's meaningless.  It's like letting it bother you that there are NFL fans in Ohio who have the audacity to root for a team not named the Bengals or Browns.  What "attachment" are you supposed to have to a professional team?  Are you limited geographically?  No.  Then why do you have to have been a student at a college to root for their sports teams?


I don't think professional sports and college sports are one in the same in this aspect. Now, I will contend the line between the two has become more and more grey over time with the commecialization of the college athletic landscape, but that's an entirely different can of worms to open. Being connected and having pride in a school which gave you something (experiences, educations, relationships) is different from a professional team which doesn't really provide anything but enjoyment.


I think what bothers me is that I interpret that bold section as saying "If you have no 'connection' to the school, you have no business rooting for their sports teams." I know people who have no connection to Ohio but root for Ohio University.  Should we tell these people we don't want their support?


That's a fair argument. One that I don't particularly have an answer for. My question would be, "how many of these are there?" out there for smaller schools like Ohio? Not like we can just deny anyone's support by any means. We need all the help we can get. But my initial guess is that these are few and far between.


To me, the catch 22 is that we want to be relevant nationally, we want to be a "brand." If we ever get to that level, we're going to have fans with no attachment to us...but some people say that is a bad thing.  Can't have one without the other, can we?
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Posted: 1/15/2014 4:40 PM
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TheBobcatBandit wrote:expand_more
college sports started when students from Harvard and Yale would argue about who's rowing team was better, so one day they decided to find out and eventually it grew to what we know today. The reason people cheer for their school is either to support their classmates or for bragging rights saying that the school I go to is better than yours. That's why I don't get why people cheer for OSU who don't go there. You have no ties to the school you have no reason to cheer for them. I wouldn't necessary get mad at a person for wearing that gear here but I would in no way understand it. Can anybody give me a good reason for why people that don't go to OSU cheer for them. I've talked to so many people on campus who said they would root for OSU over Ohio if they played. It absolutely baffles me. I also met someone who said if Ohio played duke in bball they would root for duke. I just don't get it


I can give you a good reason why people would wear Miami and OSU gear here: the graduate program I work in gets students from both. Lots of them, actually. I would bet that most years 1/4 of our students went to Miami/OSU.


I'm fine with graduate students. They went to both schools so they have a reason. But most of the people I talk to are undergraduates who root for a school they have no ties with. I'm talking about people you work with who went to Kent, Ohio, Akron, ect... and still cheer for OSU. IF you like a team just because their good that's not a good reason. I have no respect for people who do that. They just jump on the bandwagon because they want to be associated with winning. that's stupid. Loyalty, (in my opinion) is the best attribute someone can have. If your not loyal to something as basic as a sports team. How can I trust you with anything.


I see your point, but I view bandwagon fans as separate from loyal fans with no attachment to the school.  Someone wearing an Alabama shirt because they think it's cool and can't name 2 players on the roster is different from someone who is a loyal and knowledgeable fan for a sports team, even though they have no direct connection to the school.  At least I see a difference.
Last Edited: 1/15/2014 4:41:07 PM by 100%Cat
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Posted: 1/15/2014 4:41 PM
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100%Cat wrote:expand_more
For me, it's meaningless. It's like letting it bother you that there are NFL fans in Ohio who have the audacity to root for a team not named the Bengals or Browns. What "attachment" are you supposed to have to a professional team? Are you limited geographically? No. Then why do you have to have been a student at a college to root for their sports teams?


I don't think professional sports and college sports are one in the same in this aspect. Now, I will contend the line between the two has become more and more grey over time with the commecialization of the college athletic landscape, but that's an entirely different can of worms to open. Being connected and having pride in a school which gave you something (experiences, educations, relationships) is different from a professional team which doesn't really provide anything but enjoyment.


I think what bothers me is that I interpret that bold section as saying "If you have no 'connection' to the school, you have no business rooting for their sports teams." I know people who have no connection to Ohio but root for Ohio University. Should we tell these people we don't want their support?
I'm fine with them rooting for us but if Ohio played their home school I would expect them to cheer for their home school. I have no problem with OSU fans who root for them but pick their home school first either. You can be a fan of OSU but you should always cheer and pay more attention to your home school. A lot of times if find that people cheer for OSU and pay no attention to their own school at all. I'm also fine with people rooting for OSU for civic pride as well but if they root for OSU I expect them to do the same for Akron Kent Ohio ect... otherwise it just seems like they're jumping on the bandwagon.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 4:44 PM
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100%Cat wrote:expand_more
college sports started when students from Harvard and Yale would argue about who's rowing team was better, so one day they decided to find out and eventually it grew to what we know today. The reason people cheer for their school is either to support their classmates or for bragging rights saying that the school I go to is better than yours. That's why I don't get why people cheer for OSU who don't go there. You have no ties to the school you have no reason to cheer for them. I wouldn't necessary get mad at a person for wearing that gear here but I would in no way understand it. Can anybody give me a good reason for why people that don't go to OSU cheer for them. I've talked to so many people on campus who said they would root for OSU over Ohio if they played. It absolutely baffles me. I also met someone who said if Ohio played duke in bball they would root for duke. I just don't get it


I can give you a good reason why people would wear Miami and OSU gear here: the graduate program I work in gets students from both. Lots of them, actually. I would bet that most years 1/4 of our students went to Miami/OSU.


I'm fine with graduate students. They went to both schools so they have a reason. But most of the people I talk to are undergraduates who root for a school they have no ties with. I'm talking about people you work with who went to Kent, Ohio, Akron, ect... and still cheer for OSU. IF you like a team just because their good that's not a good reason. I have no respect for people who do that. They just jump on the bandwagon because they want to be associated with winning. that's stupid. Loyalty, (in my opinion) is the best attribute someone can have. If your not loyal to something as basic as a sports team. How can I trust you with anything.


I see your point, but I view bandwagon fans as separate from loyal fans with no attachment to the school. Someone wearing an Alabama shirt because they think it's cool and can't name 2 players on the roster is different from someone who is a loyal and knowledgeable fan for a sports team, even though they have no direct connection to the school. At least I see a difference.
Yeah I see what your saying. They don't bother me. It just seems like a lot of times those fans who aren't loyal and knowledgeable talk a lot of trash when they win and talk them up like they are the best team in the country when they have no clue what they are talking about
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Posted: 1/15/2014 6:17 PM
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I don't understand why people root for college sports at all if they don't have a connection with the school. I get watching it (some people like a sport so much they don't care if the level play isn't that high), but having a rooting interest? Makes no sense to me.

100%Cat wrote:expand_more
I think what bothers me is that I interpret that bold section as saying "If you have no 'connection' to the school, you have no business rooting for their sports teams." I know people who have no connection to Ohio but root for Ohio University.  Should we tell these people we don't want their support?


I have.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 7:43 PM
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JSF wrote:expand_more
I don't understand why people root for college sports at all if they don't have a connection with the school. I get watching it (some people like a sport so much they don't care if the level play isn't that high), but having a rooting interest? Makes no sense to me.

I think what bothers me is that I interpret that bold section as saying "If you have no 'connection' to the school, you have no business rooting for their sports teams." I know people who have no connection to Ohio but root for Ohio University. Should we tell these people we don't want their support?


I have.
I guess this would depend on everyone's definition of "rooting" for a particular school. I for one, love watching SEC football and generally root for them to win against other schools outside the conference (unless it's Ohio of course). I don't have a particular favorite and I'm not supporting them by any financial means or have allegiance to the school, I just love watching great football teams perform their best against other teams performing their best.

I'd be curious to hear the scenario of you actually telling someone and their response.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 7:44 PM
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100%Cat wrote:expand_more
For me, it's meaningless. It's like letting it bother you that there are NFL fans in Ohio who have the audacity to root for a team not named the Bengals or Browns. What "attachment" are you supposed to have to a professional team? Are you limited geographically? No. Then why do you have to have been a student at a college to root for their sports teams?


I don't think professional sports and college sports are one in the same in this aspect. Now, I will contend the line between the two has become more and more grey over time with the commecialization of the college athletic landscape, but that's an entirely different can of worms to open. Being connected and having pride in a school which gave you something (experiences, educations, relationships) is different from a professional team which doesn't really provide anything but enjoyment.


I think what bothers me is that I interpret that bold section as saying "If you have no 'connection' to the school, you have no business rooting for their sports teams." I know people who have no connection to Ohio but root for Ohio University. Should we tell these people we don't want their support?


That's a fair argument. One that I don't particularly have an answer for. My question would be, "how many of these are there?" out there for smaller schools like Ohio? Not like we can just deny anyone's support by any means. We need all the help we can get. But my initial guess is that these are few and far between.


To me, the catch 22 is that we want to be relevant nationally, we want to be a "brand." If we ever get to that level, we're going to have fans with no attachment to us...but some people say that is a bad thing. Can't have one without the other, can we?
True. But going back to the original point, these new fans we hope to recruit most likely aren't going to be fans of Miami, Akron, Kent, BG, Marshall, etc.
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Posted: 1/15/2014 7:50 PM
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GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
I'd be curious to hear the scenario of you actually telling someone and their response.


They think I'm a jerk, mostly. Like most people, they ignore me.
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like all things in college sports, its all about the $$$$.

"being a fan of a school" almost always means you are financially contributing to that school directly through donations, purchasing tickets, parking, merchandise, etc and/or indirectly through TV ratings and word of mouth advertising/proseletyzing.

why would you financially support a university you don't have a degree from and whose graduates you compete for jobs with?
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