Ohio Basketball Topic
Topic: Saul's Postgame Interview
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JSF
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Posted: 1/12/2015 6:03 PM
Andrew Ruck wrote:expand_more
That's an unfair comp and you had to know it when you put it together because Kellogg and Wilkins shot phenomenal from 3, and shot a lot more. The better stat is effective FG %:

Kellogg/Wilkins/Smith - .588 (21.9 Attempts per game)
R Taylor/Laster - .516 (11.9 Attempts per game)
(sniffs) I'm so proud.
stub
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Posted: 1/12/2015 7:16 PM
Speaking of shooting percentage, this stat is hard to fathom but it's true as some of you know:

In 1992, in high school, Gary Trent shot 80.9% from the field! It's remains the Ohio state record by far and I believe it's still the national record.
Jeff Hill
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Posted: 1/12/2015 7:30 PM
To quote the Discount Double Check guy (or Frankie Goes To Hollywood): R E L A X

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-gameday/0ap30000004...


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7WZ33w3B8Hw
Alan Swank
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Posted: 1/12/2015 8:13 PM
cc-cat wrote:expand_more
Also....the kid who has the capability, in my opinion, of being 'the guy' is Ryan Taylor. Maybe not yet, but at some juncture soon. He has some similar characteristics to Nick in the all around game, and the composure that I perceive.
I agree. You could tell from the first time he stepped on the Convo floor he was a heady player. Not sure about his personality though. There's a difference between having a high basketball IQ and being a team leader. Not saying he does or doesn't have the leadership skills. Just that I have no idea.
High basketball IQ, team leader, overall skills (though nor necessary to be best player), anything else? = "that guy"

So what players comprise our all-time "that guy" team?

Names above include/suggest: Nick Kellogg, Dave Jamerson, Geno Ford, DJ Cooper, Gary Trent. I'll nominate Eddie Hicks from the early '80s teams - refuse to let you lose guy (Kirk also considered).

Others for consideration before narrowing the team?
Paul Baron.
Andrew Ruck
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Posted: 1/12/2015 9:25 PM
perimeterpost wrote:expand_more
That's an unfair comp and you had to know it when you put it together because Kellogg and Wilkins shot phenomenal from 3, and shot a lot more. The better stat is effective FG %:

Kellogg/Wilkins/Smith - .588 (21.9 Attempts per game)
R Taylor/Laster - .516 (11.9 Attempts per game)
sorry, didn't know that when you said "shooting % alone" you didn't actually mean that in any way.
Or in that way a lot, I just gave the readers enough credit to understand 3 pointers are more valuable than 2 pointers. (just giving you crap...if I could insert a emoticon of a smiley face with the tongue sticking out I would just to communicate that I don't want to fight...but instead I have to type out this long awkward explanation to explain my feelings)
Bobcat1998
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Posted: 1/12/2015 9:52 PM
I am just glad to hear Saul saying some somber things and speaking about the tough times. I feel as though he is going to be a wonderful coach for us and I certainly love his personality but he seemed to be kind of a car salesman from the get go through the early struggles. I can only listen to so many jokes from a coach before it gets old. It's time to make some statements. Keep the personal and individual stuff in the lockerroom like he is but at least he's being honest now.
JSF
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Posted: 1/12/2015 10:10 PM
You can't win when speaking publicly. Either you're holding back and using coachspeak or letting things out that should be kept private.
Ohio69
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Posted: 1/12/2015 10:20 PM
JSF wrote:expand_more
You can't win when speaking publicly. Either you're holding back and using coachspeak or letting things out that should be kept private.
Exactly. I think Coach Phillips has said plenty in interviews and etc. Not sure anything more should be said.
Chicken George
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Posted: 1/13/2015 12:01 AM
Meanwhile I coached my very first game as an elementary school coach tonight and we lost 27-4. Think I better keep my mouth shut as I got my own problems :)
cc-cat
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Posted: 1/13/2015 12:05 AM
I'd start by looking at your effective fg%
OUVan
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Posted: 1/13/2015 8:04 AM
Andrew Ruck wrote:expand_more
We basically traded out Kellog, Smith and Wilkins for Laster & R. Taylor...did we lose enough to go from 25-12 to suddenly really bad?
Yes, on shooting percentage alone. ...
.492 -shooting % of Kellogg/Wilkins/Smith
.471 -shooting % of Laster/Taylor
.452 -shooting % of Kellogg/Wilkins

Sure if you add in Smith who had a different role than the other 4 guards/wings, but comparing like for like roles the freshmen have a better shooting percentage than the seniors.

Either way, our freshmen aren't the problem.
That's an unfair comp and you had to know it when you put it together because Kellogg and Wilkins shot phenomenal from 3, and shot a lot more. The better stat is effective FG %:

Kellogg/Wilkins/Smith - .588 (21.9 Attempts per game)
R Taylor/Laster - .516 (11.9 Attempts per game)

Laster & Taylor are not replacing all of the many many shots of the 3 lost good shooters. Many of those shots are going to Stevie, Bean, etc...Adding to the decline.

I doesn't matter how you slice it, we did not effectively replace 3 good shooters. I never said our freshmen are the problem, I said this roster is lacking above average shooters.
I think a bigger issue is that players aren't getting shots in their comfort zone very often. The ball movement this year is glacial compared to last year. I think we have plenty of shooters but when every player on the court has to essentially create their own shot, unless you've got a special roster, you are going to suffer. I've focused mostly on Mo and Tony not getting the ball where and when they need to but the same goes for the perimeter players as well.
bobcat695
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Posted: 1/13/2015 8:52 AM
The thing that always puzzles me about the guards not feeding the ball into the big men is that it ultimately creates more good looks for the guards, too. The bigs can score if given the ball in good position in the post. If they get doubled, then a kick-out to a shooter creates a wide open shot. Patience is so important in the half court offense. A team that only plays one-on-one while everyone else stands around and watches is very rarely successful.
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 1/13/2015 11:22 AM
It seemed that at BGSU the guards did try to get the ball inside. Problem is, our bigs were missing those shots. Then late we started taking bad shots again from the perimeter. But I did see some progress.
BillyTheCat
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Posted: 1/13/2015 11:37 AM
stub wrote:expand_more
Speaking of shooting percentage, this stat is hard to fathom but it's true as some of you know:

In 1992, in high school, Gary Trent shot 80.9% from the field! It's remains the Ohio state record by far and I believe it's still the national record.
Check out his OHIO FG% as a Freshmen, then realize he played in a small town, suburban league against a bunch of 5'11" kids who were challenged athleticlly!
mcconnelsville
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Posted: 1/13/2015 11:46 AM
Good summation.
greencat
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Posted: 1/13/2015 2:16 PM
I didn't see or hear the BG postgame presser, but the one after the home loss to NIU was depressing. Saul's body language and tone seemed to lack all his usual fire and personality.

What's worse? A train wreck or a dumpster fire? This season is going to be one. Maybe the MAC is better than he thought it would be (?) but until he gets a full roster of guys that are "his style" this isn't going to be good.

OT - O'Shea is 60-131 at his current school. What in the world made people think that guy was a big-time coach?
Ohio69
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Posted: 1/13/2015 2:49 PM
greencat wrote:expand_more
OT - O'Shea is 60-131 at his current school. What in the world made people think that guy was a big-time coach?
Not that it matters, but Bryant was moving up to Div I when he took over. After taking 3-4 few years to build the program, they went 19-12 (12-6) and 18-14 (10-6) the last two years. At tiny Bryant (3,300 students) that's damn good.
JSF
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Posted: 1/13/2015 3:16 PM
It's hard to call O'Shea's tenure at Bryant anything but a success.
Urban Bobcat
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Posted: 1/13/2015 4:09 PM
The sun will come out another day. I have full faith the program is fine. If Saul can win at NDSU he can win at Ohio. The team is sitting in a pile of Bobcat sh!# right now. All they have to do is step out of the big heaping pile.

Part of the current problem is Rufus!!! His body language sucks lately and I hear that there is some tension between him and Saul.
Last Edited: 1/13/2015 4:10:39 PM by Urban Bobcat
bn9
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Posted: 1/13/2015 4:14 PM
BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
Speaking of shooting percentage, this stat is hard to fathom but it's true as some of you know:

In 1992, in high school, Gary Trent shot 80.9% from the field! It's remains the Ohio state record by far and I believe it's still the national record.
Check out his OHIO FG% as a Freshmen, then realize he played in a small town, suburban league against a bunch of 5'11" kids who were challenged athleticlly!
That is not true. I was on the team that was second in that league and we didn't start more than one kid under 6'0" and we were fairly athletic. We even had more than one kid who could dunk. :)

Plus, he was not the only one in that league that played DI basketball. But he was an absolute beast in High School. My apologies to Greg Simpson, but Gary was the best player in the state those two years.
OUVan
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Posted: 1/13/2015 4:38 PM
greencat wrote:expand_more
What's worse? A train wreck or a dumpster fire? This season is going to be one.
As it stands now it's neither. It's obviously not the year any of us wanted to but transition years are usually frustrating. Two years ago we won 25 games and won our first regular season title in 20 years and most people considered it a disappointment. But there's plenty that can be accomplished. We've got 8 guys under scholarship that will be back next year. I'm hoping that with Simmons practicing that they can get an idea how the offense (and defense) is supposed to work and that it will flow much easier next year.
OU_Country
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Posted: 1/14/2015 10:10 AM
OUVan wrote:expand_more
What's worse? A train wreck or a dumpster fire? This season is going to be one.
As it stands now it's neither. It's obviously not the year any of us wanted to but transition years are usually frustrating. Two years ago we won 25 games and won our first regular season title in 20 years and most people considered it a disappointment. But there's plenty that can be accomplished. We've got 8 guys under scholarship that will be back next year. I'm hoping that with Simmons practicing that they can get an idea how the offense (and defense) is supposed to work and that it will flow much easier next year.

Definitely not the season anyone wanted, but in some of our looking back, we can see year one (and two really) under Groce was rocky at first. I'd like to hope that this evening vs. UT will result in a much better, more focused effort, regardless of the result. Right now, I think that's much more important than wins & losses. Coach said something along the lines of "being in games at the end giving you a chance to win games". That starts with effort and better decisions with the ball. (and hopefully getting to the line 5-6 more times a game)

I think Van makes a good point here with Simmons and how the offense is supposed to work. I believe we'll automatically have better guard play next year based on the fact that we'll have three guards who have had a year plus under the current coaching staff.

The only thought I don't really agree with is the Eight scholarship players returning. Unless things change drastically for Thomas, Harley, and Wadley, I really believe a minimum of one out of those three departs at the end of the semester. I'm not hoping that will happen, bec Khari & Wadley have shown flashes, and Thomas has proven in the past to be capable at the D1 level.
JSF
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Posted: 1/14/2015 11:15 AM
We're in for a lot more losses. The lesson is not going to sink in quickly. Be prepared.
bn9
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Posted: 1/14/2015 11:48 AM
JSF wrote:expand_more
We're in for a lot more losses. The lesson is not going to sink in quickly. Be prepared.
Unfortunately, I agree with JSF. This team has shown no signs of any semblance of basketball IQ. Short of Tony or Maurice grabbing a guard by the back of the neck and telling him to throw him the ball in the post or the establishment of a five or six point shot, we will continue to jack up ill-advised threes early in the shot clock the moment we get down my more than one possession.
C Money
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Posted: 1/14/2015 11:53 AM
bn9 wrote:expand_more
We're in for a lot more losses. The lesson is not going to sink in quickly. Be prepared.
Unfortunately, I agree with JSF. This team has shown no signs of any semblance of basketball IQ. Short of Tony or Maurice grabbing a guard by the back of the neck and telling him to throw him the ball in the post or the establishment of a five or six point shot, we will continue to jack up ill-advised threes early in the shot clock the moment we get down my more than one possession.

Yep. I thought after the DePaul win and the decent showing vs. Nebraska things might start to click. Nope. I'm fully prepared for it to be this time next year before we look like an Ohio basketball team.
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