Sorry dude, but I wasn't clear. I didn't suggest that there were 41.6 million murders. I was pointing out that not all black people commit murders, and in fact the vast, vast majority do not. So a stat like " 13% of the population commits 52% of the murders" lumps 41 million+ innocent American citizens with ~5,000 criminals. Statistics don't get less meaningful than that.

You might also want to note that PhiTau cited this stat as a critique of others who had the audacity to suggest that racial profiling is bad. In other words, it was cited as justification for said profiling.

Given the huge disparity between the number of black Americans and the number of black Americans committing murders, do you think racial profiling is justified? Because without realizing it, you're choosing to support PhiTau's argument that it is.

So, yes, I know Phi didn't say every black person committed a murder. What he did suggest is that because murders are perpetrated by black people at a high rate, it's justified that police profile them. And I think the rights and freedoms of 41 million perfectly innocent, hardworking Americans are important to protect.

But curious to hear if you all disagree.

You're really going to double down? Your initial response clearly showed you did not understand the numbers being cited and point being made. Now you're saying you knew all along but were just not wanting 41 million lumped into the small subset? I don't buy it. This is basic data analysis, comparing the % makeup of a population to the % makeup of a particular dataset (in this case murders). Literally no one would take that as lumping the entire race as murderers. Come on.
[/QUOTE]Respectfully, you're wrong. I didn't explain my point well, but I didn't misunderstand the numbers. What I said was interpreted wrong, I explained that I wasn't clear, and re-stated the point. But I haven't changed the point and I didn't misinterpret the numbers. I pointed out how completely pointless the statistic cited is.

Here's my original post:

Here's what you asked:

I literally used the phrase "Rather, a small subset of 41.6 million people committed murders." And your critique is that you don't think I was saying that a small subset of people committed the murders.

So, respectfully, I don't think you're paying very close attention to what I'm actually saying.

And again, the statistic about 13% of the population committing 52% of the murders is completely pointless. Maybe it's "basic data analysis" but the data analysis is so basic that it tells us literally nothing about the data being analyzed. Your own non-sensical conclusions about said data illustrate my point quite clearly.

To restate my point for the third time, the statement "52% of murders are committed by 13% of people" means nothing. It's a useless stat. It conflates a very small group of people (black people who commit murders -- maybe 10,000 people?) with a very large group of people (41 million) who do not. That's not a useful thing to do. And in the context of a conversation about racial profiling, it's a pretty problematic thing to do, too.

I said that the first time. I said it the second time. I'm saying it again now.

Cool. Explain the point to me then? An out of the blue statement about the murder rate broken out by race. In a conversation about whether or not police make traffic stops in black neighborhoods too frequently.


[QUOTE=Andrew Ruck]
The jump from traffic stops to murder stats I will acknowledge was abrupt...but it does bring into the discussion that yes maybe black drivers do more things behind the wheel to warrant being pulled over? Why is it off limits to consider it? Do we really have to just assume and accept it is because of widespread systemic racism? Sorry I don't blindly accept things like that and neither should you.

PhiTau made the point that black people commit murders and robberies at significantly higher rates as well. The point seemed obvious to me...if they commit those crimes at much higher rates, maybe they also commit traffic violations at higher rates...thereby answering the original question...why do black drivers get pulled over at a higher rate.

I hate to oversimplify it or skip over BA's most prolific non-sports poster's deep dive there...but it all seems pretty straight forward to me.