BLSS:

1. I don’t know that you explicitly used the terms “modern financing and fiscal management” but that seemed to be an implication in what you were saying in some of your posts on the subject. I drew the clear inference that you thought that I was not coming to grips with superiors ways of the modern business world as it applies to higher education. [/QUOTE]I didn't use those phrases, and didn't allude at all to "modern business" as it applies to higher education. You did, actually. In the process of referencing the same inference then that you're suggesting now. I replied then as I am now asking you to explain how you've concluded that. At the time, you also mentioned that I was implying that I knew more about University Administration that you -- despite my not referencing it in posts, and that I knew more about engineering than rpbobcat despite saying clearly: "I won't pretend to know if 10 years of upkeep costs plus refurbishment costs would be less expensive than building from scratch, but I also am unsure how the buildings themselves actually compare."

I was clear about what I did and didn't know. I never mentioned university administration or the politics therein. All I did was suggest that it might not be fiscally wise to mothball Scott Quad.

And again, that point was subsidiary to the actual fundamental disagreement around whether Scott Quad's historic significance means it shouldn't ever be replaced.

Everything else you raised -- the truthfulness of the administrations statements, modern business vs. university administration, my knowledge of engineering relative to rpbobcat -- were things you projected onto me, because you've decided to assume that if I disagree with you about Scott Quad's historical significance, I must disagree with you on university administration, the comms strategy of OU's current administration, engineering best practices, the value of historic preservation, and whether modern business can more effectively run a university.

I am completely unclear as to how you've reached any of those conclusions.

[QUOTE=OhioCatFan]
2. What you seem to forget about my statements about Scott Quard was that I not only thought this specific building was worth saving because it was the only building of its type on the OHIO campus, but also because it was part of the long history dating back 50 years of the University tearing down historic buildings that were very questionable decisions. Here’s a partial list: Old Tupper Hall, which was the original university chapel, dating back to the first half of the 19th Century; Ewing Hall, a classic old building, that along with Old Tupper and Culter created in words of one member of the fine arts faculty, “the most aesthetic space on campus;” Old Morton Hall, designed by renowned architect, Frank L. Packard; Brown House, a very old historic building that may have been part of the UGRR; the TB Ward at the Asylum, which was actually the youngest building in that complex; and Super Hall, which has been replaced by a much more poorly built Bentley Annex. These are but a few examples of buildings that could have been saved and repurposed, if necessary, and that would have preserved our heritage in a much better manner than we have done.

Here’s a quote from a friend of mine, Tom O’Grady, who is a past executive director of the Southeast Ohio History Center, and still works there in another capacity:

“Our buildings help define us as a community and as individuals. Short term administrators and out of town trustees shouldn’t be able to make such callous decisions and not include the community. People of Athens built those old buildings.

The old buildings are made of the primal materials of the region and they were built to last for multiple centuries. New buildings are made from materials hauled in on semi-trucks from far and wide and the new buildings are not ever expected to last more than 35-50 years.”

I doubt you agree with this philosophy, but I’m very sympathetic to the sentiments expressed by Mr. O’Grady.

Finally, here’s.a link to a slide show prepared by Tom O’Grady to present to the University to provide evidence as to why Scott Quard should be preserved:

https://u.pcloud.link/publink/show?code=XZWqhhVZhK6QRSLrl...

Fantastic idea. Did you share it with the Powers That Be?

Sorry man, but that powerpoint isn't moving the needle for me. In fact, I think it makes some patently ridiculous claims.

I don't understand the view that the mere fact that Scott Quad was a quadrangle merits preservation. And the fact that the presentation makes a claim that it's design "puts it in company with Tom Quad, Radcliffe Quad, and the Law Quadrangle at University of Michigan" feels like a pretty ridiculous point to me. I honestly can't believe it's being made in a serious way.

Anybody who has been to Oxford wouldn't make that comparison. Tom Quad was build in 1525. It's center court yard is substantially larger than Scott Quad's, and is Christ Church's campus center. The equivalent at OU is College Green, and pretending otherwise merely because of an architectural term is intellectually dishonest.

Those quads are a central focus of their colleges. They're intrinsic to the character of the university. Scott Quad was a dorm, with a small courtyard, that wasn't utilized widely by anybody but residents of Scott Quad. It simply wasn't a key part of campus or heavily used.

Here's an interesting litmus test for Scott Quad's historical significance and contribution to campus character: does Scott Quad appear in marketing materials geared towards attracting students to Ohio University?

Here are a few commercials Ohio has run:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PwV4dOw2Jvo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NLlVm4QK2FM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NnWgo6UHqMw

A lot of shots of campus. None of Scott Quad. You think a commercial for Christ Church wouldn't include a picture of Tom Quad? Or that Michigan wouldn't show the Law Quad?

Here's a link to the cover art of every OU undergrad catalog for 40 years: https://archive.org/search.php?query=mediatype%3Atexts+AN... .

A lot of photos of a lot of different parts of campus. No Scott Quad.

Here's a link to a brochure used to attract international students to OU: https://www.ohio.edu/admissions/sites/ohio.edu.admissions... .

No Scott Quad.

Given that we have Tom Quad on campus, seems like a big missed opportunity from a marketing stand point, no? Can you find any examples otherwise?

Just not really seeing it, man.

Sure: Page 24 in the student handbook.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-re1NeyJHcIXwc1SCin1o...

That is just for IB classes, normal honors scale is lower. College Prep is generally on a 4.0. I do like what they are trying to do by incentivizing the advanced courses and its an opportunity because its a high school in a college town but this is far from how its done across the state.

At least in the contexts of the publics of Ohio grade inflation is not a factor.

Can't believe you went with the blimp instead of the US economy here. Golden opportunity missed.

My son got really stressed out from all the virtual classes, the shifting from code yellow to code red (or whatever it was) and back again, and the confusion about the masking requirements. So he took a "break" after fall semester last year and probably will never go back. He's working on writing his stories at home (he was a creative writing major), working a part-time job and doing a few other things.

He wasn't all that pleased with his dorm (Wray House), either. The main problem was mold. Along about October of last year one wall and part of the ceiling were covered with black mold. They took care of it within a week or so, but it looked like it was coming back when he moved out. I imagine other dorms had/have similar issues. I think Wray was renovated not too long ago, but it could be that more is needed.

Freshmen living off campus is a throw-back to the 1960s. I was in the last freshman class allowed to live in approved off-campus housing the first year. I never lived in a dorm. I was in a three-bedroom apartment (w/living room, kitchen and bathroom) in what used to be Hayes Hall with five other guys who I didn't know until I moved in. I think it's part of the River Park complex now. I enjoyed it, and I think some freshmen these days might actually prefer that kind of an arrangement. I'm not sure about their meal arrangement (the building that housed the Hayes cafeteria is long gone); Jeff Marketplace, Shively (if it still has a dining hall) and Nelson are the closest places.

This is interesting. I wonder if the data suggests that the increases this year are temporary and not reflective of future freshman class enrollment rates. If, for instance, there are a high number of "older" students who sat out virtual college and are now enrolled as Freshman, that would signal a temporary increase.

Backtracking in the thread here for a moment... the shortage of dorm rooms and takeover of two apartment buildings near the campus. How does that play into the availability of apartments to "grown-ups" and the cost??

One of the highest cost of housing in the state of Ohio.