I’ve seen those pictures too! I don’t think i realized that they were desks but that makes sense!

I would be interested in where you would have re-routed the river?

God loves Nixon and the GOP, who brought us the EPA! Party of small government ;-)


In all seriousness, if you've never read this: https://www.athensnews.com/news/local/if-we-could-do-it-a...

First off, that's a really interesting article.

Loved the photo's.

When they moved the Hocking, the hydraulics/hydrology of the river changed completely.

From a runoff/flooding perspective, the old river channel/bed became irrelevant.

If you look at the current FEMA FIRM Map you can see where the Floodway and 100 Year Flood Zone are, based on the relocated Hocking.

You can even pick out remnants of the old river bed.

The map shows just how far removed they are from a flood zone, based on the relocated river.

With the Hocking moved, water just can't get to the old river bed anymore.
So there's no issue building in it.

As I posted, you can build in a 100 year flood zone, under certain conditions.

In New Jersey, you are restricted by what is called "Zero Net Fill".

You also have to elevate a structure so the lowest "living" ("usable" for non-residential structures) space is a minimum of 1 foot above the 100 year flood elevation.

Any portion of building below that elevation, like a parking garage has to comply with other other restrictions.

There are also certain structures that must be "flood proofed".

The Article is correct, channel relocation is no longer the preferred method to alleviate flooding.
Not because of effectiveness, but other considerations, like land acquisition costs and environmental impact.

In NJ, changing the alignment (straightening) a channel is still widely used.

When it comes to flood alleviation, you have to walk a very fine line between
complying with any/all environmental requirements and effectively reducing flooding and flood damage.

One way New Jersey is dealing with this is by buying flood prone structures, demolishing them and restoring the flood plain.
They call it "Blue Acres".
Green Acres was already taken by a different program.

Thanks for your input, I still say (especially with your information) that the University largely does what it wants when and where it wants. Take Ping, Ping is squarely in the 100 year flood zone, it sits right on the old river bank and closer to the "new" river than any dorm on South Green. Yet, was built there, with usable ground floor space. It's closer to the river than any practice facility off the Convo that you could build, but what's the reason that has been given for not building/planning a practice facility off the Convo? 100 year flood plain.

You'd put the practice facility on stilts like the Convo if you are connecting the two buildings. Otherwise you are filling in part of the moat around the Convocation Center. Again, they pick and choose their compliance. Ping was never elevated above the 100 year flood stage when it was built.

If I'm just counting the buildings since 1990 built in the 100 year flood plain this is what I have. The total list is 25 buildings.

Academic Research Center
Adams Hall
Baker Center
Carin Strength Training Center
Carr Hall
Chemistry Building
Chessa Field
Gold Course (expansion)
Golf and Tennis Facility
Grover Center (expansion)
Heritage Hall
Life Sciences Building
Luchs Hall
Medical Education Center
Peden Tower
Ping Center
Pruitt Field
Softball Complex
Sook Academic Center
Sowle Hall
Stocker Center (lower floor expansion)
Tanaka Hall
Walter Fieldhouse
Walter Hall
Wren Stadium

We get into these facility discussions and the old guard is visualizing campus as if 2-3 new buildings have gone down in the flood plain since The Convo and it would be great to have 1 museum in Athens when counting all the arts and history museums around town there are probably 10 of them.

OCF wants to close the Kennedy Museum and move it to Haning Hall. What they need to do is operate Haning as an annex of the Kennedy Center and tear down shoddy old RTEC to make it into a courtyard for the museum. Its not about only having 1 museum or 1 park in town like you have 1 ice rink for the community. The idea is to put as many museums and parks in as possible. The Convo as part of the basketball practice facility should have a history museum for itself.

There is no logic behind the old guard preservation movement either than preserve every building that you were physically present in on campus. Be a naysayer in anything new and do everything on the bare minimum dime. Go back to the gold standard and outlaw debt financing.

As it is Athens has 8 museums already. I agree Haning Hall would be good to support extra rotating collections from the Kennedy museum and the university should maximize whatever they are building to support athletics at The Convo.

Ohio Valley Museum of Discovery
Kennedy Museum of Art
Southeast Ohio History Center
ARTS West
Dairy Barn Arts Center
Ohio University Art Gallery
Ohio University Multicultural Center Gallery
Trisolini Gallery

https://athensohio.com/search/?geodir_search=1&stype=gd_t... =

The fundamental argument then is cheapness. Cheapness on principal is a philosophy I can get for a young person with a 50 year horizon to try and gain a modicum of financial independence. But I hate it when older people won't vote for school levies if it costs a nickel in their pocket books and preventing the next generation from having anything.

This is not a community college where everything is done on a small shoe string state appropriation. This is a major state university that is building for the value add each time out.

The construction quality argument makes sense but do we have a registry of building codes to actually back up what is shoddy and what is not? The ROI on tear down vs. renovate for Scott Quad may have not been there. First responder access and traffic easements and other regulations and considerations add up. If the location of Scott Quad was across from Ellis Hall along the main campus square I think that would have also added to the appeal of renovating it.

Interesting look at the buildings on campus that are in the flood plain, especially when looking at the number (very few) that are "raised" out of the flood plain. Essentially, 90% of campus is in the flood plain and not elevated out of the flood plain.

https://www.ohio.edu/policy/44-117

And again, look around campus, almost every building on West/South is elevated upon stilts, the Convo, Sook, all the dorms on New South, the back of West.

RPBobcat,

This line says it all: OHIO UNIVERSITY insist that it is EXEMPT from Flood Plain regulations.

This presents a dilemma for the city of Athens because OU insists that it's exempt from local flood-plain rules. Both the city and the state disagree, and the state has been pressuring Athens to crack down on OU.

In a letter to Athens Mayor Ric Abel on July 6, Michael Gease, senior environmental specialist with the state's Floodplain Management Program, stated that in the absence of any definite information demonstrating that OU is exempt from local flood rules, "it must be assumed that Ohio University is subject to local regulation, and any development activities that cannot be demonstrated in compliance must be assumed to be in violation."


Also, in this article OU Legal Counsel John Burns admits the university refused flood plain regulations on Grover Center.....Not much more that I need to know that confirms my comments that the University largely does what it wants to with their property.

I asked a friend of mine, who is a Certified Flood Plain Manager about this.

She said she never heard of any entity being exempt from Flood Plain Rules.

Athens Code (Title 25) is pretty straightforward on this.
(Just google Athens Code and its right there)

Its very well written and thorough.

It sites Article XVIII ,Section 3 of the Ohio Constitution as the underlying authority.

Could have saved myself a lot of typing and just referenced the ordinance.

Kind of summarizes my last few posts.

Have no idea what O.U.'s rationale is for ignoring it or why Athens or the State are coming down hard on O.U.