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General Ohio University Discussion/Alumni Events Topic
Topic: Elite Universities Are Out Of Touch With Reality
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giacomo
8/7/2022 9:49 AM
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/02/opinion/elite-universi... -

Life at a university with a dominant central campus can also narrow students’ views on the world, especially at colleges where most undergraduates live on campus. Letting the university take care of all of students’ needs — food, housing, health care, policing, punishing misbehavior — can be infantilizing for young adults. Worse, it warps students’ political thinking to eat food that simply materializes in front of them and live in residence halls that others keep clean.


Interesting article and made me think that our campus intersects with the town of Athens and not so isolated. Was better back in the day when we had a real downtown that the town would gravitate to.
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OhioCatFan
8/7/2022 10:33 AM
giacomo wrote:expand_more
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/08/02/opinion/elite-universi... -

Life at a university with a dominant central campus can also narrow students’ views on the world, especially at colleges where most undergraduates live on campus. Letting the university take care of all of students’ needs — food, housing, health care, policing, punishing misbehavior — can be infantilizing for young adults. Worse, it warps students’ political thinking to eat food that simply materializes in front of them and live in residence halls that others keep clean.


Interesting article and made me think that our campus intersects with the town of Athens and not so isolated. Was better back in the day when we had a real downtown that the town would gravitate to.
Yes, except for trips to city hall or the courthouse, the native population has pretty much abandoned downtown to the students. My wife and I make a weekly journey to Whits for their delicious custard, but otherwise there’s not much to attract us in the city center these days. I’ve heard lots of other folks say the same thing. It’s s a shame, but it’s the current reality. BTW, when we go to Whit’s we often stroll around the campus green — which is as beautiful as ever — and eat our custard by the Union Monument erected to honor the Boys in Blue from Athens County.
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bobcatsquared
8/7/2022 2:56 PM
Out of curiosity, OCF and other locals, what used to bring to Court St. that's not there today (other than Whit's)?
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OhioCatFan
8/7/2022 8:03 PM
bobcatsquared wrote:expand_more
Out of curiosity, OCF and other locals, what used to bring to Court St. that's not there today (other than Whit's)?
Going back over the last 50 years the following have disappeared from downtown: Robert’s Men’s Shop, Baron’s, Altman’s (then Marting’s) Department Store, Belk’s Department Store, Cornwell’s Jewelry, Varsity Theater, Woolworth’s, Katherine Figg’s Women’s store (just off Court on President’s Street), Brown’s Restaurant, Sammy’s Steakhouse, Harris Furniture, Athens Bowling Alley, and many others. Those are just ones that come quickly to mind. Maybe others can add to the list. It’s been a slow erosion of businesses in the Court Street area. Now, most of the businesses that appeal to locals are on East State Street.
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bobcatsquared
8/7/2022 10:04 PM
Thanks, OCF. I'm familiar with a few of those, some not so much. Where was the bowling alley located?
Last Edited: 8/7/2022 10:04:30 PM by bobcatsquared
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OhioCatFan
8/8/2022 12:52 AM
bobcatsquared wrote:expand_more
Thanks, OCF. I'm familiar with a few of those, some not so much. Where was the bowling alley located?
Last block, right side, as you head toward the armory — about halfway up the block. There was also once a nice bakery, with the best cream horns in Ohio, a door or two away from the bowling alley. Don’t remember the name.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
8/8/2022 8:41 AM
OhioCatFan wrote:expand_more
Out of curiosity, OCF and other locals, what used to bring to Court St. that's not there today (other than Whit's)?
Going back over the last 50 years the following have disappeared from downtown: Robert’s Men’s Shop, Baron’s, Altman’s (then Marting’s) Department Store, Belk’s Department Store, Cornwell’s Jewelry, Varsity Theater, Woolworth’s, Katherine Figg’s Women’s store (just off Court on President’s Street), Brown’s Restaurant, Sammy’s Steakhouse, Harris Furniture, Athens Bowling Alley, and many others. Those are just ones that come quickly to mind. Maybe others can add to the list. It’s been a slow erosion of businesses in the Court Street area. Now, most of the businesses that appeal to locals are on East State Street.
I would venture to guess that there are two factors at play here:

1) Uptown Athens isn't well suited to cars. It's great and walkable from campus and the student off-campus housing that fans out from there. But that area's so dominated by student housing that it's no longer an attractive area for locals to live. So East State Street becomes more convenient.

2) Similar, but Court Street on a Friday night's a very particular scene. I don't think it's a bring your family to dinner and a show type scene anymore. It's basically a street lined with bars full of very drunk people. I don't think that's good for business, for a lot of the sort of businesses you referenced.
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OhioCatFan
8/8/2022 10:06 AM
Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame wrote:expand_more
Out of curiosity, OCF and other locals, what used to bring to Court St. that's not there today (other than Whit's)?
Going back over the last 50 years the following have disappeared from downtown: Robert’s Men’s Shop, Baron’s, Altman’s (then Marting’s) Department Store, Belk’s Department Store, Cornwell’s Jewelry, Varsity Theater, Woolworth’s, Katherine Figg’s Women’s store (just off Court on President’s Street), Brown’s Restaurant, Sammy’s Steakhouse, Harris Furniture, Athens Bowling Alley, and many others. Those are just ones that come quickly to mind. Maybe others can add to the list. It’s been a slow erosion of businesses in the Court Street area. Now, most of the businesses that appeal to locals are on East State Street.
I would venture to guess that there are two factors at play here:

1) Uptown Athens isn't well suited to cars. It's great and walkable from campus and the student off-campus housing that fans out from there. But that area's so dominated by student housing that it's no longer an attractive area for locals to live. So East State Street becomes more convenient.

2) Similar, but Court Street on a Friday night's a very particular scene. I don't think it's a bring your family to dinner and a show type scene anymore. It's basically a street lined with bars full of very drunk people. I don't think that's good for business, for a lot of the sort of businesses you referenced.
I would agree with this analysis.

Interesting nomenclature adds insight here, too. When I was growing up the Court Street area was always referred to as “downtown.” In more recent times the term “uptown” has become more popular, particularly with students and alumni. I think this is because from both the East and West Greens (and South as well), it is literally up the hill, at a higher elevation. Where I grew up on the North end of town, it was literally a walk downhill to get to Court Street. However, at that time people from all over town used the term “downtown.” The evolution in terminology seems to mirror the change in the atmosphere in the Court Street area from a general business area to a student-dominated one.
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mid70sbobcat
8/8/2022 11:51 PM
OhioCatFan wrote:expand_more
Out of curiosity, OCF and other locals, what used to bring to Court St. that's not there today (other than Whit's)?
Going back over the last 50 years the following have disappeared from downtown: Robert’s Men’s Shop, Baron’s, Altman’s (then Marting’s) Department Store, Belk’s Department Store, Cornwell’s Jewelry, Varsity Theater, Woolworth’s, Katherine Figg’s Women’s store (just off Court on President’s Street), Brown’s Restaurant, Sammy’s Steakhouse, Harris Furniture, Athens Bowling Alley, and many others. Those are just ones that come quickly to mind. Maybe others can add to the list. It’s been a slow erosion of businesses in the Court Street area. Now, most of the businesses that appeal to locals are on East State Street.

Been a few decades but was Baron's owned by Dwight Pugh of the Business school?

What about Swearingen's Sporting Goods that Fred Swearingen of the "Immaculate Reception" owned?

Was there a restaurant near Woolworth's named The Downstairs??
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IceCat76
8/9/2022 10:29 AM
mid70sbobcat wrote:expand_more
Out of curiosity, OCF and other locals, what used to bring to Court St. that's not there today (other than Whit's)?
Going back over the last 50 years the following have disappeared from downtown: Robert’s Men’s Shop, Baron’s, Altman’s (then Marting’s) Department Store, Belk’s Department Store, Cornwell’s Jewelry, Varsity Theater, Woolworth’s, Katherine Figg’s Women’s store (just off Court on President’s Street), Brown’s Restaurant, Sammy’s Steakhouse, Harris Furniture, Athens Bowling Alley, and many others. Those are just ones that come quickly to mind. Maybe others can add to the list. It’s been a slow erosion of businesses in the Court Street area. Now, most of the businesses that appeal to locals are on East State Street.

Been a few decades but was Baron's owned by Dwight Pugh of the Business school?

What about Swearingen's Sporting Goods that Fred Swearingen of the "Immaculate Reception" owned?

Was there a restaurant near Woolworth's named The Downstairs??
I can answer 2 of these. Yes, Dwight Pugh owned Baron's and Fred Swearingen, the NFL ref, did own Swearingen's Sporting Goods.

I've been in and out of Athens since 1970. When a student, I didn't have two nickels to rub together so I wasn't very familiar with restaurants. Where was Brown's Restaurant and where was Sammy's Steakhouse?
Last Edited: 8/9/2022 10:32:11 AM by IceCat76
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CatsUp
8/9/2022 11:11 AM
IceCat76 wrote:expand_more
Out of curiosity, OCF and other locals, what used to bring to Court St. that's not there today (other than Whit's)?
Going back over the last 50 years the following have disappeared from downtown: Robert’s Men’s Shop, Baron’s, Altman’s (then Marting’s) Department Store, Belk’s Department Store, Cornwell’s Jewelry, Varsity Theater, Woolworth’s, Katherine Figg’s Women’s store (just off Court on President’s Street), Brown’s Restaurant, Sammy’s Steakhouse, Harris Furniture, Athens Bowling Alley, and many others. Those are just ones that come quickly to mind. Maybe others can add to the list. It’s been a slow erosion of businesses in the Court Street area. Now, most of the businesses that appeal to locals are on East State Street.

Been a few decades but was Baron's owned by Dwight Pugh of the Business school?

What about Swearingen's Sporting Goods that Fred Swearingen of the "Immaculate Reception" owned?

Was there a restaurant near Woolworth's named The Downstairs??
I can answer 2 of these. Yes, Dwight Pugh owned Baron's and Fred Swearingen, the NFL ref, did own Swearingen's Sporting Goods.

I've been in and out of Athens since 1970. When a student, I didn't have two nickels to rub together so I wasn't very familiar with restaurants. Where was Brown's Restaurant and where was Sammy's Steakhouse?
Anyone else remember Hungry Mouth on Union? I think their bean burritos kept me alive for 2-3 years. Close to them was a record store and also a used record/music store downstairs. Can’t remember their names off the top of my head. I know a lot of my collection came from them though; especially the second one.
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Pataskala
8/9/2022 11:34 AM
CatsUp wrote:expand_more
Out of curiosity, OCF and other locals, what used to bring to Court St. that's not there today (other than Whit's)?
Going back over the last 50 years the following have disappeared from downtown: Robert’s Men’s Shop, Baron’s, Altman’s (then Marting’s) Department Store, Belk’s Department Store, Cornwell’s Jewelry, Varsity Theater, Woolworth’s, Katherine Figg’s Women’s store (just off Court on President’s Street), Brown’s Restaurant, Sammy’s Steakhouse, Harris Furniture, Athens Bowling Alley, and many others. Those are just ones that come quickly to mind. Maybe others can add to the list. It’s been a slow erosion of businesses in the Court Street area. Now, most of the businesses that appeal to locals are on East State Street.

Been a few decades but was Baron's owned by Dwight Pugh of the Business school?

What about Swearingen's Sporting Goods that Fred Swearingen of the "Immaculate Reception" owned?

Was there a restaurant near Woolworth's named The Downstairs??
I can answer 2 of these. Yes, Dwight Pugh owned Baron's and Fred Swearingen, the NFL ref, did own Swearingen's Sporting Goods.

I've been in and out of Athens since 1970. When a student, I didn't have two nickels to rub together so I wasn't very familiar with restaurants. Where was Brown's Restaurant and where was Sammy's Steakhouse?
Anyone else remember Hungry Mouth on Union? I think their bean burritos kept me alive for 2-3 years. Close to them was a record store and also a used record/music store downstairs. Can’t remember their names off the top of my head. I know a lot of my collection came from them though; especially the second one.
I think record store was Audiophile (sp?), which was owned by a professor (I forget his name) who was probably in his 60s. Right next to Logan's Bookstore on Union. It was a fun to place to go because it had a good selection, some things you couldn't find elsewhere, and the prof was a free spirit who really fit in with the younger crowd.
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bobcatsquared
8/9/2022 11:36 AM
I was thinking Haffa's Record Store was on Union, downstairs next to an ice cream store.
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stub
8/9/2022 11:47 AM
bobcatsquared wrote:expand_more
I was thinking Haffa's Record Store was on Union, downstairs next to an ice cream store.
Yes, across the street from The Campus Sundry, with the Paul Newman poster in the window.
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giacomo
8/9/2022 12:52 PM
I remember all of these places! I lived above Baron's my junior year and Dwight Pugh and Fred Cluff were my landlords. I also recall that Pugh owned an ice cream and hot dog shop farther down on Union away from uptown called Larry's Dog House.

Haffa's was a favorite. After I listened to the sounds of Sinatra on WOUB my freshman year, I went to Haffa's and traded in all my rock 'n roll albums for Sinatra, Tony Bennett, Ella Fitzgerald and jazz. It was a transformation.

One thing I do know is that we're all getting older and the world is changing. We're not going to like it. Uptown was fabulous back in the day!
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bobcatsquared
8/9/2022 1:50 PM
Loved shopping at Haffa's. But not as much as School Kid's, on State St. where Casa is now. Great places to buy albums, a medium that was on its death bed but is making a comeback.
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IceCat76
8/9/2022 2:23 PM
CatsUp wrote:expand_more
Out of curiosity, OCF and other locals, what used to bring to Court St. that's not there today (other than Whit's)?
Going back over the last 50 years the following have disappeared from downtown: Robert’s Men’s Shop, Baron’s, Altman’s (then Marting’s) Department Store, Belk’s Department Store, Cornwell’s Jewelry, Varsity Theater, Woolworth’s, Katherine Figg’s Women’s store (just off Court on President’s Street), Brown’s Restaurant, Sammy’s Steakhouse, Harris Furniture, Athens Bowling Alley, and many others. Those are just ones that come quickly to mind. Maybe others can add to the list. It’s been a slow erosion of businesses in the Court Street area. Now, most of the businesses that appeal to locals are on East State Street.

Been a few decades but was Baron's owned by Dwight Pugh of the Business school?

What about Swearingen's Sporting Goods that Fred Swearingen of the "Immaculate Reception" owned?

Was there a restaurant near Woolworth's named The Downstairs??
I can answer 2 of these. Yes, Dwight Pugh owned Baron's and Fred Swearingen, the NFL ref, did own Swearingen's Sporting Goods.

I've been in and out of Athens since 1970. When a student, I didn't have two nickels to rub together so I wasn't very familiar with restaurants. Where was Brown's Restaurant and where was Sammy's Steakhouse?
Anyone else remember Hungry Mouth on Union? I think their bean burritos kept me alive for 2-3 years. Close to them was a record store and also a used record/music store downstairs. Can’t remember their names off the top of my head. I know a lot of my collection came from them though; especially the second one.
I do remember the Hungry Mouth. That was where I had my first gyro. I stopped in for lunch at least twice week after that. Next to it was a clothing shop, My Sister's Closet. I remember that Bob Brenly's future wife worked there.
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CatsUp
8/9/2022 2:39 PM
IceCat76 wrote:expand_more
Out of curiosity, OCF and other locals, what used to bring to Court St. that's not there today (other than Whit's)?
Going back over the last 50 years the following have disappeared from downtown: Robert’s Men’s Shop, Baron’s, Altman’s (then Marting’s) Department Store, Belk’s Department Store, Cornwell’s Jewelry, Varsity Theater, Woolworth’s, Katherine Figg’s Women’s store (just off Court on President’s Street), Brown’s Restaurant, Sammy’s Steakhouse, Harris Furniture, Athens Bowling Alley, and many others. Those are just ones that come quickly to mind. Maybe others can add to the list. It’s been a slow erosion of businesses in the Court Street area. Now, most of the businesses that appeal to locals are on East State Street.

Been a few decades but was Baron's owned by Dwight Pugh of the Business school?

What about Swearingen's Sporting Goods that Fred Swearingen of the "Immaculate Reception" owned?

Was there a restaurant near Woolworth's named The Downstairs??
I can answer 2 of these. Yes, Dwight Pugh owned Baron's and Fred Swearingen, the NFL ref, did own Swearingen's Sporting Goods.

I've been in and out of Athens since 1970. When a student, I didn't have two nickels to rub together so I wasn't very familiar with restaurants. Where was Brown's Restaurant and where was Sammy's Steakhouse?
Anyone else remember Hungry Mouth on Union? I think their bean burritos kept me alive for 2-3 years. Close to them was a record store and also a used record/music store downstairs. Can’t remember their names off the top of my head. I know a lot of my collection came from them though; especially the second one.
I do remember the Hungry Mouth. That was where I had my first gyro. I stopped in for lunch at least twice week after that. Next to it was a clothing shop, My Sister's Closet. I remember that Bob Brenly's future wife worked there.
Solid recollections here from everyone. Connects a lot of dots. I’ll add that Hungry Mouth was where I first experienced vinegar with French fries. Perhaps that was common elsewhere but not in my world to that point. :)
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Alan Swank
8/9/2022 3:18 PM
Court Street looking north from near the Presbyterian Church around 1967.

https://media.library.ohio.edu/digital/collection/archive... /

And of course the Varsity Theater.

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/star-trek-marquee-19792--82... /
Last Edited: 8/9/2022 3:20:33 PM by Alan Swank
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MonroeClassmate
8/9/2022 3:26 PM
Gee, I don’t remember ever making it past the Frontier Room except for that one time when under the cover of darkness I made my way to McGoos’s and lost my sight staring into the cages with the black lights giving all the perfect Crest smile.
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OhioCatFan
8/9/2022 7:42 PM
IceCat76 wrote:expand_more
Out of curiosity, OCF and other locals, what used to bring to Court St. that's not there today (other than Whit's)?
Going back over the last 50 years the following have disappeared from downtown: Robert’s Men’s Shop, Baron’s, Altman’s (then Marting’s) Department Store, Belk’s Department Store, Cornwell’s Jewelry, Varsity Theater, Woolworth’s, Katherine Figg’s Women’s store (just off Court on President’s Street), Brown’s Restaurant, Sammy’s Steakhouse, Harris Furniture, Athens Bowling Alley, and many others. Those are just ones that come quickly to mind. Maybe others can add to the list. It’s been a slow erosion of businesses in the Court Street area. Now, most of the businesses that appeal to locals are on East State Street.

Been a few decades but was Baron's owned by Dwight Pugh of the Business school?

What about Swearingen's Sporting Goods that Fred Swearingen of the "Immaculate Reception" owned?

Was there a restaurant near Woolworth's named The Downstairs??
I can answer 2 of these. Yes, Dwight Pugh owned Baron's and Fred Swearingen, the NFL ref, did own Swearingen's Sporting Goods.

I've been in and out of Athens since 1970. When a student, I didn't have two nickels to rub together so I wasn't very familiar with restaurants. Where was Brown's Restaurant and where was Sammy's Steakhouse?
To add my two cents worth: I think that Fred Cluff, former OHIO basketball player, was a co-owner of the Barrons. Yes, there was a restaurant near Woolworth's in a basement, with an entrance from Court called the Downstairs. I had great food and my wife loved their "flaming cherry's jubilee" dessert. I was going to include that in my original list, but I forgot the name of the place. Thanks for the memory jog!
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OhioCatFan
8/9/2022 7:50 PM
IceCat76 wrote:expand_more
. . . Where was Brown's Restaurant and where was Sammy's Steakhouse?
Brown's restaurant was on the Court Street side of the building that Casa is now in, which used to be the Nationwide Insurance Building. It was in the basement, and accessible from Court Street. I think there's some kind of a New Age gift shop in there now. That description of the current occupant might be wildly inaccurate, I've only looked at it in passing on the rare occasion these days that I venture to that part of Court Street.

Sammy's Steakhouse was on the right side of the street, in the last block of Court as you head toward the Armory. I think it was just about the low point of the street before it starts going back up toward the armory. My wife and I disagree as to whether the name was Sammy's Steakhouse or Jimmy's Steakhouse. Perhaps someone else whose long in the tooth and chime in.
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giacomo
8/9/2022 8:43 PM
I forgot to mention that Matt Lauer lived upstairs when I lived above the men’s store. Cluff and Pugh were partners in several businesses.
Last Edited: 8/9/2022 8:43:35 PM by giacomo
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mid70sbobcat
8/9/2022 10:08 PM
OhioCatFan wrote:expand_more
Out of curiosity, OCF and other locals, what used to bring to Court St. that's not there today (other than Whit's)?
Going back over the last 50 years the following have disappeared from downtown: Robert’s Men’s Shop, Baron’s, Altman’s (then Marting’s) Department Store, Belk’s Department Store, Cornwell’s Jewelry, Varsity Theater, Woolworth’s, Katherine Figg’s Women’s store (just off Court on President’s Street), Brown’s Restaurant, Sammy’s Steakhouse, Harris Furniture, Athens Bowling Alley, and many others. Those are just ones that come quickly to mind. Maybe others can add to the list. It’s been a slow erosion of businesses in the Court Street area. Now, most of the businesses that appeal to locals are on East State Street.

Been a few decades but was Baron's owned by Dwight Pugh of the Business school?

What about Swearingen's Sporting Goods that Fred Swearingen of the "Immaculate Reception" owned?

Was there a restaurant near Woolworth's named The Downstairs??
I can answer 2 of these. Yes, Dwight Pugh owned Baron's and Fred Swearingen, the NFL ref, did own Swearingen's Sporting Goods.

I've been in and out of Athens since 1970. When a student, I didn't have two nickels to rub together so I wasn't very familiar with restaurants. Where was Brown's Restaurant and where was Sammy's Steakhouse?
To add my two cents worth: I think that Fred Cluff, former OHIO basketball player, was a co-owner of the Barrons. Yes, there was a restaurant near Woolworth's in a basement, with an entrance from Court called the Downstairs. I had great food and my wife loved their "flaming cherry's jubilee" dessert. I was going to include that in my original list, but I forgot the name of the place. Thanks for the memory jog!
The reason I remembered The Downstairs was I had a class in Business Law with Art Marinelli and had an hour to burn after so I went with a roomie there and he had a cup of coffee while we sat and read The Post.
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mid70sbobcat
8/9/2022 10:20 PM
And quite fun to look at bars from the past ...

http://athensohiobars.com/defunct-bars /

Made me think of stumbling back to West Green down Union and if not mistaken stopping at Angelo's for a sub or occasionally at BBF almost across from Bromley and next to Frisch's.

One thing I'll never forget -- and wonder if, or when, they ever fixed the sign was near Engineering Building as you headed to West Green that said "No Stoping" ... the sign had the typo, not my post here. The Graduate was often our last stop as we walked from the CI back to James Hall.
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