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Topic: UMASS to make a decision in early march
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D.A.
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Posted: 3/23/2011 9:51 PM
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MH55 wrote:expand_more
When Temple entered into the MAC agreement, we passed on an offer to join CUSA for all sports. CUSA wanted $1,000,000. At the time, Temple didn't want to fork over 1 mill, didnt want to sever our ties w A10 nd very frankly, didnt even know if we had the ability to resurrect our FB Program. The MAC deal was good for us and as much as MAC'ers deny it, it wa for s a good deal for the MAC. (A commitment to play 8 BB games a year w NCAA Tourney Caliber teams , half in your building, in exchange for the opportunity to park our FB team in your conference and try to fix it. We have taken steps to fix our FB Program and our basketball teams have made the tourney and brought a tourney team to your Conference arenas 8 times since the agreement.)

Dont know why MAC fans get so bent out of shape when some of us talk about the MAC and defend what we brought to the MAC. Lets face it, the MAC is a Ohio Valley Conference, there's no interest in the East for the MAC. Its not an insult, its just the way it is, just like MAC'ers could care less about the A10, the Big Five and Villanova. Temple can't garner additional interest in the MAC short of winning the MAC FB Championship every year and obviously, we havent been able to do that. 

Im sorry but I have been an advocate of joining CUSA or even going independent. Our affiliation with the MAC for FB was a life preserver and I thank the MAC for that but afetr reading opinions of so many MAC fans they are either mad they didnt get the doormat they thought they were getting for FB or give absolutely no credit to our commitment from Temple's BB teams and/or our resurrection from the depths of the worst FB Program in USA. 

Maybe Ohio, et al doesnt want or like Temple in their conference. But I certainly dont see many impassioned threads about EMU, Buffalo or Ball St here. Isnt that what Chryst sought to do? Increase the MAC's profile, interest and breadth....

ps I see the same thing happening with UMass. Thats why I believe they are waiting for our decision. UMass/Buffalo isnt any more of a geographical rivalry than Temple/Buffalo.. I can drive to Montreal faster than I can drive to Buffalo.


The most cogent post from MH55 since he joined the board.  A little heavy on the importance of Temple hoops, and a little light on the pending decision being 'Nova's, not Temples, but solid none the less.  Thanks MH.
D.A.
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Posted: 3/23/2011 10:05 PM
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Mike Coleman
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Posted: 3/23/2011 10:50 PM
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Very interesting remark that CAA/A-10 member UMass loses $3 million in football despite averaging 13,000+ fans. Kind of flies in the face of the opinion from some that moving down a level would solve any sort of financial issues.
anorris
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Posted: 3/24/2011 10:55 AM
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MH55 wrote:expand_more
When Temple entered into the MAC agreement, we passed on an offer to join CUSA for all sports. CUSA wanted $1,000,000. At the time, Temple didn't want to fork over 1 mill, didnt want to sever our ties w A10 nd very frankly, didnt even know if we had the ability to resurrect our FB Program. The MAC deal was good for us and as much as MAC'ers deny it, it wa for s a good deal for the MAC. (A commitment to play 8 BB games a year w NCAA Tourney Caliber teams , half in your building, in exchange for the opportunity to park our FB team in your conference and try to fix it. We have taken steps to fix our FB Program and our basketball teams have made the tourney and brought a tourney team to your Conference arenas 8 times since the agreement.)

Dont know why MAC fans get so bent out of shape when some of us talk about the MAC and defend what we brought to the MAC. Lets face it, the MAC is a Ohio Valley Conference, there's no interest in the East for the MAC. Its not an insult, its just the way it is, just like MAC'ers could care less about the A10, the Big Five and Villanova. Temple can't garner additional interest in the MAC short of winning the MAC FB Championship every year and obviously, we havent been able to do that. 

Im sorry but I have been an advocate of joining CUSA or even going independent. Our affiliation with the MAC for FB was a life preserver and I thank the MAC for that but afetr reading opinions of so many MAC fans they are either mad they didnt get the doormat they thought they were getting for FB or give absolutely no credit to our commitment from Temple's BB teams and/or our resurrection from the depths of the worst FB Program in USA. 

Maybe Ohio, et al doesnt want or like Temple in their conference. But I certainly dont see many impassioned threads about EMU, Buffalo or Ball St here. Isnt that what Chryst sought to do? Increase the MAC's profile, interest and breadth....

ps I see the same thing happening with UMass. Thats why I believe they are waiting for our decision. UMass/Buffalo isnt any more of a geographical rivalry than Temple/Buffalo.. I can drive to Montreal faster than I can drive to Buffalo.
Agree with DA, your best post here to date...

I think what burns me the most about the deal, honestly, is that we agreed to be your life preserver for the FB program without the hoops program as part of the deal, and I don't mean a few OOC games here and there.  I think if the conference had really pressured the deal to be all-sports-or-none, either Temple would have brought basketball, which would improve our league a fair bit, IMO (they'd probably have a title or two already), or dropped football.

I do, however, get that the MAC is less-than-relevant to you on the east coast, but think perhaps a rising UMASS squad would increase the interest over there somewhat, and perhaps be a more easily-traveled road game.  I just don't think the Big East is going to come calling for the football team, and am tired of the split-affiliation deal screwing up scheduling so profoundly.
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 3/24/2011 1:02 PM
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Agree with Anorris.  The issue is not that we don't like Temple; the issue is that we're still mad that the MAC didn't use negotiating leverage to get Temple basketball. 
Physicist MH55
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Posted: 3/24/2011 1:14 PM
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I dont think you should take my nonsense posts too seriously. I get the impression most of you don't. Despite what I say about the MAC, my money and time has gone into supporting the MAC w/ Temple in it. Since the invitation, I have been to Mt Pleasant, Ypsilanti, Toledo, Oxford, Athens, Kent 2X and Buffalo 3X. I had been to Kalamazoo before. Obviously, I have been to every MAC game @ Philly including most of the BB games.Despite my rhetoric, if there were 5,000 fans like me in every MAC city, including Philly, this would be a rip-roaring good confernce.

About Temple Basketball. ...we cant join the MAC and never will. To engage in a MAC schedule and maintain our relationship w the Big 5 (which is a Phila institution and includes an annual series vs LaSalle, St Joe, UPenn, us and Nova and occassionally Drexel) would require us to play a 16 game MAC schedule and as many as 5 more games against opponents who all traditionally have fallen below a 75 RPI ranking, less Nova. Thats 21 games and Temple would probably have to win 18 of them every year just to get a look see from the committee...just like you guys do. Look friends, that would be program suicide. As I see many MAC'ers complain abbout at large bids, and lack thereof, why would Temple commit to that to help our FB Program when said program has only been to one post season game in 30 years? Whatever deal is ultimately cranked out, Temple BB is NEVER, EVER coming to the MAC. Though the A10 isnt a great conference, or even a great mid major conference, almost all the teams are closer geographically than our closest MAC opponent. Even UMass, should they join, is a 5 hour car ride from Philly but still closer than Kent/Akron.

Sorry, dems just the facts but I thought I would add a photo of HC Fran Dunphy w our dance team from Tuscon...
Last Edited: 3/24/2011 2:57:48 PM by Physicist MH55
Bert Presley
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Posted: 3/24/2011 3:16 PM
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was a great post till you ruined it with the picture.
LastMinuteman
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Posted: 3/25/2011 11:48 AM
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Hi, UMass fan here.  Quick point on basketball:  The MAC doesn't fund men's basketball to anywhere near the level that the A10 does.  I only have the 2009 numbers, but they stacked up like this:

Average A10 men's basketball budget:  $2,707,666 per season.
Average NCAA men's basketball budget:  $2,327,300 per season
Average MAC men's basketball budget:  $1,466,372  per season

The MAC makes almost half the financial commitment to men's basketball that the A10 does, and the smallest A10 MBB budget is larger than the largest MAC MBB budget.  And it's not like the A10 is rolling in TV money to offset these expenses.  You hardly ever see our conferences games on TV.  There's just a fundamental difference in the attitudes of the two conferences towards the sport.

Ohio for its part is in the top 2 or 3 in the MAC in spending in every men's sport it participates in.  You guys aren't the problem.  I suspect Ohio could step up its commitment if it had a reason to.
anorris
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Posted: 3/25/2011 12:06 PM
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That's the primary reason I think Temple basketball would be a good add to the conference, if they beat us all like red-headed step children, maybe we'll see some more support thrown behind basketball, which I'd like to see.

The money is where its at, as pointed out, and I think FBS football, frankly, is killing the MAC's hoops.  This seems like a time when things may begin to trend up... I certainly hope so.

I definitely don't dispute that the A10 is a better mid-major basketball league at this point.
Last Edited: 3/25/2011 12:06:42 PM by anorris
Bert Presley
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Posted: 3/25/2011 1:40 PM
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I think a key thing to look at when you evaluate those budgets is not quantity of money, but quality spent. When you look at how much you are willing to pay for quality coaches and things that you can control. All Universities are offering the same amount of scholarships, so what it boils down to is those controlled factors (i.e. Coaches, bring in quality opponents on your home court) throw in travel as well, but I think how much money is spent is just being thrown around. Our Travel budget in Basketball isn't that bad, but remember the A-10 has Dayton, Xavier, and St. Louis, picture the travel budget for UMASS with those for road games.
KyleWvr13
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Posted: 3/25/2011 3:08 PM
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The huge reason why no one cares about the MAC any farther east than Ohio, is because there are no teams out there other than Buffalo, which i think associates itself more in the Cleveland area than any other.

Pennsylvania as a state, is mostly owned by the Big Ten and the Big East thanks to Penn State and Pitt.  The Big 5 athletic intrest drops significantly once you get out of the half-hour radius from Philly.  I live 40 minutes NW of Philly, and i could count 5 Penn State and Pitt shirts before i see a single Big 5 shirt.  The Big 5 owns Philly, once you get to the surrounding suburbs however, it quickly changes.

The only way we can get more exposure as a conference is by having schools farther east join the MAC as a fulltime member, which honestly just isn't going to happen for a long time.  Maybe never.
UNH
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Posted: 3/25/2011 4:11 PM
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Uncle Wes,
You could not be more wrong in you're views on the CAA.. UNH has been the only FCS program to reach the playoffs the past 7 yrs in a row. Beat Umass last year  by several TD's  in front of 30,000 plus while Michigan beat them by a field goal. 2009 we beat Ball State by a TD you guys won by a field goal. Also, we beat Army, Marshall, Rutgers in the past six years...  Please get the fact correct before you post... Check out UNH v.Toledo in September...

PS Villanova beat Temple the year they won MAC..................
Bert Presley
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Posted: 3/25/2011 6:04 PM
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When has Temple ever won the MAC? I think OHIO has put a stop to that.
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 3/26/2011 11:56 PM
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In terms of the money that MAC schools spend on basketball, the ante has just been upped.  Don't forget about the $10 million endowment that BG announced a few months ago for its basketball program.  According to the initial release about the gift, the earnings from the endowment are going to be used to enhance coaches' salaries, pay for player scholarships, and to bring two "big name" teams into the new BG arena on a yearly basis.  Other conference schools are going to have to up their basketball spending, or be left in the dust.  I think as this unravels Temple and UMass for basketball becomes more a relevant discussion.
Last Edited: 3/26/2011 11:57:55 PM by OhioCatFan
UNH
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Posted: 3/27/2011 8:17 PM
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sorry I guess they went 7-1 in conference in 09 with loses to nova and penn state plus ohio.  Also, forgot to add UNH other FBS victory over Northwestern.. I have much respect for the MAC and OHIO just did not appreciate someone Uncle Wes saying UNH has had little success in the CAA when they have been one of the top programs in FCS for the past 8 yrs..
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