Ok, it's Bush's fault!

Maybe someone needs to do a poll.....maybe a simple yes/no response on whether we are a better football program with or without Frank.  We get quite a few recruit looks and locks because of him.  Would you rather roll the dice and get a Knorr type coach?

He has spoiled us with last year. This year isn't over but all the injuries have made us a team that of course is not as good as last years.  With our fingers and toes crossed and no injuries we should be a better team next year.

Making TT a second string QB is not the answer. We are stuck with these coaches so lkets hope they make the right calls. We will have a toughter schedule next year but teams will underestimate us....kinda like we did with a few teams this year. Injured players will be back. Rookies who made dumb mistakes will be smarter.

As I've said before....step back from the ledge.

Try not to get too worked up over 3-4-5 yahoos complaining like that about Solich and etc.

I guess the real question is, is this an Ohio Department of Athletics message board/site or is it an independent Bobcat fan/alumni message board?

If it's the latter, fans/alumni have every right to critique play calling, talent level of coaches and playcalling, whether players are being developed and improving each year, who should - in their opinion - be playing or not, and if players appear not to be bringing their A game.  That's what fans do, and that's what draws us to this quality forum.  

There shouldn't be personal, non-football-related attacks directed at players or coaches, but what happens on the field or the preparation, recruiting leading up to it is fair game.   We applaud, travel to see the team play, buy tickets, stand up and cheer, boast about our team in the office coffee room and also critique when they look like a Jekyll and Hyde team or play with little focus or passion.  

They are us, and we them.  We all represent Ohio University.  But it's not just rah-rah all the time.  I respect and like Solich and am glad he's here...hopefully will be for many years.  But I can also critique the end result, predictable play calling, poor clock management and when a team looks unprepared for the opposition.  Yes, expectations have been raised and need to be.  It should be every team's goal to win the championship every year.  That's why you play the games...it's a W business...on the field at least.

Go Cats.

I think everyone agrees that personal, non-football related attacks are not appropriate. The place where there is disagreement is where to draw certain other lines. The thing I hope everyone remembers is that these are kids, mostly 18-21. They are students, too. They are not professional athletes. They play for scholarships, yes, but they also play for the love of the game. I know that not everyone agrees with me, but I think that calling out a specific player for a specific play is generally not called for, given that they are not professionals. I know that the coaches tell the players to have thick skins, and I know the coaches tell them not to read sites like this, but I am pretty sure that the players are aware of what is said here, and I suspect that, because they are still kids, it does affect play at times, and I have no doubt that when it does affect play, the effect will be adverse. Everyone has the right to say what they want, and the moderators don't delete a lot of stuff. Thus, you can pretty much say anything you want, but that doesn't always mean its a good idea.

By contrast, the coaches are both professionals and public figures. Therefore, if people want to criticize Albin for play calls, that is fine. If they wan to want to criticize Burrow for his defenses, again, fine. If you want to criticize Sano for conditioning, fine. They are all paid for it, and fair game.

I agree with you, Doc. One assumption that a new fan might make is that if Ohio is ranked #25, they have talent comparable to other top 25 teams. If you start with that assumption, then you reach some interesting conclusions. You could conclude that Ohio should dominate all bad teams, that Ohio should be able to execute every play at a high level, and that Ohio should have enough depth to replace those that get hurt. Is that a valid assumption? Are those valid conclusions?

As some have pointed out, Ohio's recruiting classes of the past have moved up in recent years, but are still average for the MAC, while the older classes (say, 2005-2008) were mostly below average.  If Ohio has average incoming talent incoming talent, would any of the conclusions above be true? To me, Ohio is competitive because the players have worked harder than the players at other schools, and because the coaches know and understand what they have to work with, and have systems in place to work with that level of talent. The result is that they win a lot more than the lose, now, and are generally in the top of the MAC.

If one starts with the assumption that Ohio has Top 25 level talent, then if they end up third in the MAC East, that's a poor coaching performance, and poor effort by the players, even with 15 players out. If one starts with the assumption that the raw talent is average for the MAC, and with 15 players out, lower than average for the MAC, then ending in the top half, and getting a bowl bid is a pretty reasonable accomplishment. Further, if they beat Kent, and win a bowl, 10 wins is very good, considering the hurdles they had to overcome.

I'm sure everyone has their own measures of how good a job a coach is doing. Mine is pretty simple. I compare how the teams actually end up with quality of their recruiting classes. On average the two should be equal, and mathematically it has to be true that for every coach whose teams do better than the incoming recruit quality there is some other coach whose team does worse than the recruit quality. Thus, to me, a coach like Mack Brown, at Texas, who always has Top 5 recruiting classes, but who almost never has a team finish in the Top 5, is not doing that great of a job.

By contrast, Solich does OK, because his teams are consistently higher rated than the incoming recruits were. I happen to think that the recruiting services under-rate Ohio's classes but, working with what we have, the core of this year's team is the recruiting classes from 2008-2010 (Redshirt-Sophomores to Seniors). According to Scout.com those Ohio classes ranked 118, 96, 105, an average of 106. According to Rivals, those classes ranked 119, 83, 90, an average of 96. Even if I'm right, and those are low, the fact that before the injury bug bit, the team was playing at a close to Top 25 level is pretty remarkable.

Now that they have worked this hard, and now that the coaches have these systems in place, do I expect them to play better than they did the last 5-6 games? Absolutely. I expect them to play to their potential, a potential that is higher now than when they came in as recruits. I trust that they can re-group, and play better against Kent, and in a bowl. Those will both be difficult games, and Ohio will be an underdog, but I'm not ready to concede.

Wow.  A bit sensitive, bro?   "Disgust ya"?    Did you actually read the post?  

Why don't you take a breath and slowly read my post.  I think you might then understand that I basically said I love the Cats, I support them in many ways, I applaud them more than I critique, yet as a fan and alum, I can very well give my opinion of how the team is playing.  Not that I need to mention this, but I do know some of the personnel, so don't judge my support of the team.

And maybe, after re-reading, your thin-skin can toughen up and realize you shouldn't use phrases like "...how much they disgust ya."  I never came close to saying anything like that, and wouldn't.   Your words, not mine.

Stereotype much, Doc?  By your narrow, shoot from the hip definition, any fan that says anything that isn't flowery and beautiful about a loss, or predictable play calling or lackluster body language -- and who hasn't been on your Board since 2004 is a "bandwagon fan"?  

I'm not sure if you're painting everyone with that brush, but I've been a fan for 35 years...I just re-connected with this board recently.  (just because people weren't on this Board, doesn't mean they weren't active elsewhere...or they could be a younger fan like, uh, I dunno, an OU student!).    

And even if I was a student and on this board for the first time, you should welcome new people, voices, opinions.  It keeps the world - and your forum - less stale, and helps build Bobcat Nation stronger.   And who knows, those fans may actually be bigger fans than you.  No need to be exclusive...unless you're capping membership in your "club."

Go Bobcats!!!

If they can take individual praise then they can also take individual criticism. They are adults, not 10-year olds playing Pop Warner.

Please.

Solich did come to Ohio to retire. Sure, he's done an fine job, but he's peaked.  This is as good as it gets under Frank.  Contend for conference championships, but never win them. Make it to a toilet bowl. Rinse. Repeat. That is fine for some, but not for others.  Some people were calling Ohio the "Boise of the east" earlier in the year. That could happen, but not with Frank at the helm.  Gonna need new blood to get over that hump. People can cry "but remember what we were before Frank" until they are blue in the face, but it doesn't change the fact that many better coaches have come to the MAC, won championships and moved on while Frank sits here and draws a paycheck, content that he has a job until the day he doesn't want one.

Are you a legitimate OU fan, or are you a Husker fan weighing in on Solich?