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Topic: Toledo considering beer sales....
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OUs LONG Driver
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Posted: 5/23/2013 10:36 PM
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Alan Swank wrote:expand_more
The whole kids in this generation are garbage argument just doesn't hold any weight.  Generations are different, one is not worse than the other.  Tell a generation you think is great and I will tell you why they aren't.  The whole fans being too drunk or rowdy is a battle that is won or lost before the game starts.  The main argument for not selling alcohol is that it would bring too much negative attention to athletics from the campus entities that hate athletics.  



I never said kids of this generation are garbage. I did state that they are less mature, in general, than earlier generations.  Just had a great example of this today.  I have a brand-new employee, fresh out of college, who approached me to complain that I announced this morning that everyone would get the afternoon off tomorrow to further extend the long weekend.  His complaint?  "My mom said it would have been nice for you to give me a little more notice so I could have made plans."  I gotta tell you, I wanted to throw him out on the street but simply bit my tongue.  My wife oversees several young employees, a few of whom were recently upset that they weren't permitted to leave the office to take advantage of a 2-hour afternoon VIP sale at Kohl's. I'm sure these college grads will some day realize how ridiculous their complaints were, but I doubt any of us ever would have contemplated such a thing.


So you hired one ungrateful kid and somehow that proves the entire generation is less mature than earlier generations? Right...


Not at all.  He simply used this as an example.  Those of us in positions of business authority could tell you stories like this until the sun comes up - next Wednesday.   First problem is this kid's mom.  The second is his audacity to relate his mom's feelings to the boss.  And the third is his feelings or maybe his mom's that the world revolves around his schedule.


And I could tell you just as many stories about people from your generation acting just as disgraceful in the work place.  There are good employees and bad employees at every age level.  Surround yourself with the good ones and life will be much better.

Back to the topic....IMO the positive outweighs the negative.  There are ways to limit consumption. Most sporting events limit to two per person at a time.  You could always make that one per person and limit it further.  Run the price up as high as you see fit.  I'll pay for a beer or two at  a game almost regardless of price.  If it helps increase revenue, keeps fans in the seats a little longer (maybe even a little louder), and gets the average Joe to the game a little more often it's worth it.  

Big picture is to increase attendance in just about any way possible. This won't hurt attendance, that's for sure.
bobcat695
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Posted: 5/23/2013 11:14 PM
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A couple thoughts on the issue:

- I am in favor of doing anything that increases the number of casual fans.

- I am in favor of increasing revenues for the department.

-I think it is poor logic to say because alcohol is available, everyone is automatically going to behave poorly. I've been to a few Cavs games at The Q this season. The poor behavior comes from morons, both drunk and sober. My experience is that pro sports fans are much rougher around the edges than college fan bases. I've been to a full WVU stadium with beer sales available and it was nothing like a Browns or Cavs game. Kent State is not an out-of-control environment full of obnoxious drunks.

- I don't think two beers over two hours is going to make me behave any differently, nor is it going to affect my ability to drive home safely after a Wednesday night game in the Convo. Its my duty to consume beer responsibly, whether I do it at Peden or the Convo, or Broney's or Applebee's after a game.

-I think the students would be the smallest demographic purchasing beer, so the impact of their behavior is negligible. If they want to be drunk, they will do it the two hours before the game starts, not during the game.

- I'll still come to every game, whether there is beer or not. But, there are folks that might look at it as a nice casual outing to occasionally attend if the atmosphere was enjoyable. It could enhance the experience, which I think is a good thing.
Last Edited: 5/23/2013 11:15:01 PM by bobcat695
RSBobcat
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Posted: 5/23/2013 11:38 PM
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Ohio69 wrote:expand_more
What's the expected income from beer sales?  Including any sponsorship/advertising income possibilities?


I would expect no less than $25K exclusive rights sponsorship fee, then all the profits from sales. Additional labor (pouring) cost likely near zilch - beer company would do most of the stocking into "bar" areas, they set-up the tap lines, just need volunteers to pour beer instead of cold hot chocolate. Cut off beer sales at end of 3rd Qtr - then you have huge sales of water bottles near end of game because everyone now dying of thirst and have cotton mouth. Profit per beer cup likely $5 (if $6 cup) @ 1,500 cups = $7.5K profit per game. So - at least $70K. Same as full stadium all seats sold at $2+ a seat - Minimum. Should easily be $100K+. Could be $200K - And this just Peden.

And figure out how to more quickly and efficiently sell some more salty peanuts and popcorn - then, viola - more suds sales too!

Should prolly improve the 'relief" facilities as well though..............and plant a few more trees and shrubs around the tailgating/parking area...........
DelBobcat
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Posted: 5/24/2013 9:29 AM
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Alan Swank wrote:expand_more
The whole kids in this generation are garbage argument just doesn't hold any weight.  Generations are different, one is not worse than the other.  Tell a generation you think is great and I will tell you why they aren't.  The whole fans being too drunk or rowdy is a battle that is won or lost before the game starts.  The main argument for not selling alcohol is that it would bring too much negative attention to athletics from the campus entities that hate athletics.  



I never said kids of this generation are garbage. I did state that they are less mature, in general, than earlier generations.  Just had a great example of this today.  I have a brand-new employee, fresh out of college, who approached me to complain that I announced this morning that everyone would get the afternoon off tomorrow to further extend the long weekend.  His complaint?  "My mom said it would have been nice for you to give me a little more notice so I could have made plans."  I gotta tell you, I wanted to throw him out on the street but simply bit my tongue.  My wife oversees several young employees, a few of whom were recently upset that they weren't permitted to leave the office to take advantage of a 2-hour afternoon VIP sale at Kohl's. I'm sure these college grads will some day realize how ridiculous their complaints were, but I doubt any of us ever would have contemplated such a thing.





So you hired one ungrateful kid and somehow that proves the entire generation is less mature than earlier generations? Right...


Not at all.  He simply used this as an example.  Those of us in positions of business authority could tell you stories like this until the sun comes up - next Wednesday.   First problem is this kid's mom.  The second is his audacity to relate his mom's feelings to the boss.  And the third is his feelings or maybe his mom's that the world revolves around his schedule.

Sorry, this isn't a generational thing. There are incompetent employees and stupidity among all age groups.

Now, if we all got smart and only hired Ohio grads, we wouldn't have to deal with this ineptitude. That kid probably went to Fiami. 

BillyTheCat
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Posted: 5/24/2013 9:57 AM
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SBH wrote:expand_more
Then go to the bars and not the football game.  Have fun.

Seriously, if students need to have beer available in order to justify attending a game, then I don't want them at the game.  


The people buying the beer will be the adults far and away.  I've been to hundreds of College games in many stadiums, and I am rarely ever waiting in line with a 21 year old student to grab my brew.
Ted Thompson
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Posted: 5/24/2013 11:02 AM
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Ohio69 wrote:expand_more
What's the expected income from beer sales?  Including any sponsorship/advertising income possibilities?


I was at a luncheon and I believe it was the University of Dayton AD (or someone in the dept.) said their rule of thumb is $2 net profit per person in attendance. Ohio's might be lower because students make up a much higher percent of attendance as compared to UD games. At UD games, beer is not allowed in the student section. Since they implemented it, there has never been an on-court incident and I've never seen anyone out of control. I think beer sales for basketball makes a lot of sense. I think you need a different approach for football. Maybe only allow in a designated area.
SBH
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Posted: 5/24/2013 11:34 AM
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DelBobcat wrote:expand_more
The whole kids in this generation are garbage argument just doesn't hold any weight.  Generations are different, one is not worse than the other.  Tell a generation you think is great and I will tell you why they aren't.  The whole fans being too drunk or rowdy is a battle that is won or lost before the game starts.  The main argument for not selling alcohol is that it would bring too much negative attention to athletics from the campus entities that hate athletics.  



I never said kids of this generation are garbage. I did state that they are less mature, in general, than earlier generations.  Just had a great example of this today.  I have a brand-new employee, fresh out of college, who approached me to complain that I announced this morning that everyone would get the afternoon off tomorrow to further extend the long weekend.  His complaint?  "My mom said it would have been nice for you to give me a little more notice so I could have made plans."  I gotta tell you, I wanted to throw him out on the street but simply bit my tongue.  My wife oversees several young employees, a few of whom were recently upset that they weren't permitted to leave the office to take advantage of a 2-hour afternoon VIP sale at Kohl's. I'm sure these college grads will some day realize how ridiculous their complaints were, but I doubt any of us ever would have contemplated such a thing.





So you hired one ungrateful kid and somehow that proves the entire generation is less mature than earlier generations? Right...


Not at all.  He simply used this as an example.  Those of us in positions of business authority could tell you stories like this until the sun comes up - next Wednesday.   First problem is this kid's mom.  The second is his audacity to relate his mom's feelings to the boss.  And the third is his feelings or maybe his mom's that the world revolves around his schedule.

Sorry, this isn't a generational thing. There are incompetent employees and stupidity among all age groups.

Now, if we all got smart and only hired Ohio grads, we wouldn't have to deal with this ineptitude. That kid probably went to Fiami. 





One last try on this.  This is not about competence.  It's only a perception of the level of maturity and common sense of today's college graduates.  These are bright young people who hopefully will have successful careers.  But their understanding of and adaptability to real-world work environments is tenuous at best.  On a maturity scale, I believe they are closer to 10th grade level when compared to grads of the 1980s.  HR professionals across the country are facing the same thing.  My wife works for a $17 billion organization and they are appalled by the sense of entitlement of many of today's graduates.


Last Edited: 5/24/2013 11:39:45 AM by SBH
The Optimist
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Posted: 5/24/2013 12:02 PM
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I am surprised so many Bobcatattack members work for companies incapable of properly screening new hires.
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 5/24/2013 12:59 PM
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The Optimist wrote:expand_more
I am surprised so many Bobcatattack members work for companies incapable of properly screening new hires.


Ahem...where's Mike Johnson when you need him?
Paul Graham
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Posted: 5/24/2013 2:51 PM
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SBH wrote:expand_more
The whole kids in this generation are garbage argument just doesn't hold any weight.  Generations are different, one is not worse than the other.  Tell a generation you think is great and I will tell you why they aren't.  The whole fans being too drunk or rowdy is a battle that is won or lost before the game starts.  The main argument for not selling alcohol is that it would bring too much negative attention to athletics from the campus entities that hate athletics.  



I never said kids of this generation are garbage. I did state that they are less mature, in general, than earlier generations.  Just had a great example of this today.  I have a brand-new employee, fresh out of college, who approached me to complain that I announced this morning that everyone would get the afternoon off tomorrow to further extend the long weekend.  His complaint?  "My mom said it would have been nice for you to give me a little more notice so I could have made plans."  I gotta tell you, I wanted to throw him out on the street but simply bit my tongue.  My wife oversees several young employees, a few of whom were recently upset that they weren't permitted to leave the office to take advantage of a 2-hour afternoon VIP sale at Kohl's. I'm sure these college grads will some day realize how ridiculous their complaints were, but I doubt any of us ever would have contemplated such a thing.





So you hired one ungrateful kid and somehow that proves the entire generation is less mature than earlier generations? Right...


Not at all.  He simply used this as an example.  Those of us in positions of business authority could tell you stories like this until the sun comes up - next Wednesday.   First problem is this kid's mom.  The second is his audacity to relate his mom's feelings to the boss.  And the third is his feelings or maybe his mom's that the world revolves around his schedule.

Sorry, this isn't a generational thing. There are incompetent employees and stupidity among all age groups.

Now, if we all got smart and only hired Ohio grads, we wouldn't have to deal with this ineptitude. That kid probably went to Fiami. 





One last try on this.  This is not about competence.  It's only a perception of the level of maturity and common sense of today's college graduates.  These are bright young people who hopefully will have successful careers.  But their understanding of and adaptability to real-world work environments is tenuous at best.  On a maturity scale, I believe they are closer to 10th grade level when compared to grads of the 1980s.  HR professionals across the country are facing the same thing.  My wife works for a $17 billion organization and they are appalled by the sense of entitlement of many of today's graduates.


Yeah, those legendary 80's grads. That was the "greatest" generation right?




Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 5/24/2013 4:18 PM
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Paul Graham wrote:expand_more
The whole kids in this generation are garbage argument just doesn't hold any weight.  Generations are different, one is not worse than the other.  Tell a generation you think is great and I will tell you why they aren't.  The whole fans being too drunk or rowdy is a battle that is won or lost before the game starts.  The main argument for not selling alcohol is that it would bring too much negative attention to athletics from the campus entities that hate athletics.  



I never said kids of this generation are garbage. I did state that they are less mature, in general, than earlier generations.  Just had a great example of this today.  I have a brand-new employee, fresh out of college, who approached me to complain that I announced this morning that everyone would get the afternoon off tomorrow to further extend the long weekend.  His complaint?  "My mom said it would have been nice for you to give me a little more notice so I could have made plans."  I gotta tell you, I wanted to throw him out on the street but simply bit my tongue.  My wife oversees several young employees, a few of whom were recently upset that they weren't permitted to leave the office to take advantage of a 2-hour afternoon VIP sale at Kohl's. I'm sure these college grads will some day realize how ridiculous their complaints were, but I doubt any of us ever would have contemplated such a thing.





So you hired one ungrateful kid and somehow that proves the entire generation is less mature than earlier generations? Right...


Not at all.  He simply used this as an example.  Those of us in positions of business authority could tell you stories like this until the sun comes up - next Wednesday.   First problem is this kid's mom.  The second is his audacity to relate his mom's feelings to the boss.  And the third is his feelings or maybe his mom's that the world revolves around his schedule.

Sorry, this isn't a generational thing. There are incompetent employees and stupidity among all age groups.

Now, if we all got smart and only hired Ohio grads, we wouldn't have to deal with this ineptitude. That kid probably went to Fiami. 





One last try on this.  This is not about competence.  It's only a perception of the level of maturity and common sense of today's college graduates.  These are bright young people who hopefully will have successful careers.  But their understanding of and adaptability to real-world work environments is tenuous at best.  On a maturity scale, I believe they are closer to 10th grade level when compared to grads of the 1980s.  HR professionals across the country are facing the same thing.  My wife works for a $17 billion organization and they are appalled by the sense of entitlement of many of today's graduates.


Yeah, those legendary 80's grads. That was the "greatest" generation right?




bobcatsquared
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Posted: 5/24/2013 4:44 PM
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SBH wrote:expand_more
As father of two college age sons, I disagree. My friends and I were stupid about alcohol back in 1979-83, but many of today's kids take stupid to a new level.  Much less mature, much less common sense.  Not just based on my own sons (who, thankfully, have grown up) but on my observations of MANY young people of similar ages, all from good homes. Selling beer to these kids in a university environment isn't appropriate, IMO.


I resemble that (bolded) remark.

If you guys really want some ammunition against SBH and his 1980 v. present-day theories, ask him how he celebrated his 21st birthday back in the early 1980s.
cc-cat
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Posted: 5/25/2013 10:55 AM
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bobcatsquared wrote:expand_more
As father of two college age sons, I disagree. My friends and I were stupid about alcohol back in 1979-83, but many of today's kids take stupid to a new level.  Much less mature, much less common sense.  Not just based on my own sons (who, thankfully, have grown up) but on my observations of MANY young people of similar ages, all from good homes. Selling beer to these kids in a university environment isn't appropriate, IMO.


I resemble that (bolded) remark.

If you guys really want some ammunition against SBH and his 1980 v. present-day theories, ask him how he celebrated his 21st birthday back in the early 1980s.


How, and then where.
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 5/25/2013 11:23 AM
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The difference between Toledo and us is that, lacking other academic prowess, they offer a degree in beer whereas we assume expertise in beer and, therefore, give it no special consideration.
Last Edited: 5/25/2013 11:23:52 AM by Monroe Slavin
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