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Topic: NIU appears gone . . .
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M.D.W.S.T
1/11/2025 3:48 PM
TWT wrote:expand_more
Youngstown State fits within the existing MAC well. If you want to view that as an indictment on the MAC, fine. And if you want to believe Ohio is above the MAC, fine. But if we aren't getting the big conference invite you think we should, and the MAC is looking for a new member, YSU seems quite feasible.
The MAC was considering YSU as a 14th when they brought in Marshall. They should have looked at WKU then but didn't for whatever reason.

Youngstown only has 8,500 undergraduates and it would be smallest in the MAC. They don't open the MAC to any new states. If located in Pennsylvannia they would bring something to the MAC but not as a 7th Ohio school.
They open the MAC to a winning program.

What’s this nonsense about if they opened up the MAC to new states? What does that even mean? Is the MAC some NYC pipeline because of Buffalo? We get a lot of Chicago viewers because of NIU?
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Pataskala
1/11/2025 7:36 PM
M.D.W.S.T wrote:expand_more
Youngstown State fits within the existing MAC well. If you want to view that as an indictment on the MAC, fine. And if you want to believe Ohio is above the MAC, fine. But if we aren't getting the big conference invite you think we should, and the MAC is looking for a new member, YSU seems quite feasible.
The MAC was considering YSU as a 14th when they brought in Marshall. They should have looked at WKU then but didn't for whatever reason.

Youngstown only has 8,500 undergraduates and it would be smallest in the MAC. They don't open the MAC to any new states. If located in Pennsylvannia they would bring something to the MAC but not as a 7th Ohio school.
They open the MAC to a winning program.

What’s this nonsense about if they opened up the MAC to new states? What does that even mean? Is the MAC some NYC pipeline because of Buffalo? We get a lot of Chicago viewers because of NIU?
A Chicago cable system used to carry NIU home games but that's gone hte way of the dodo since ESPN+ came into existence. My guess is that some people in Chicagoland are interested in NIU football, but it's a pretty small percentage of viewers. They probably lag behind Notre Dame, Northwestern, Wisconsin, Illinois, and maybe Iowa and Purdue. Sitting in the middle of a B10 cluster doesn't help them.
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Bobcat Love
1/11/2025 11:26 PM
TWT wrote:expand_more
Youngstown State fits within the existing MAC well. If you want to view that as an indictment on the MAC, fine. And if you want to believe Ohio is above the MAC, fine. But if we aren't getting the big conference invite you think we should, and the MAC is looking for a new member, YSU seems quite feasible.
The MAC was considering YSU as a 14th when they brought in Marshall. They should have looked at WKU then but didn't for whatever reason.

Youngstown only has 8,500 undergraduates and it would be smallest in the MAC. They don't open the MAC to any new states. If located in Pennsylvannia they would bring something to the MAC but not as a 7th Ohio school.
I’d rather have Grand Canyon Online on my resume than Youngstown State. My god.
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Andrew Ruck
1/13/2025 9:26 AM
TWT wrote:expand_more
They don't open the MAC to any new states. If located in Pennsylvannia they would bring something to the MAC but not as a 7th Ohio school.
I just don't subscribe to this line of thinking at all, especially in today's media driven by streaming. It was that thinking that led the Big Ten to go with Maryland & Rutgers, the dumbest thing ever. Conferences are best when there is common ground, familiarity and regional rivalries. If the Big Ten had been able to add Notre Dame & Pitt instead they would have been much better off.

Build your brand and lean into it. The MAC is 2nd tier programs in the Midwest who compete with each other for enrollment, recruits and local notoriety. YSU brings more to that than Uconn or some other random team from some random area I care nothing about.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
1/13/2025 10:50 AM
Andrew Ruck wrote:expand_more
They don't open the MAC to any new states. If located in Pennsylvannia they would bring something to the MAC but not as a 7th Ohio school.
I just don't subscribe to this line of thinking at all, especially in today's media driven by streaming. It was that thinking that led the Big Ten to go with Maryland & Rutgers, the dumbest thing ever. Conferences are best when there is common ground, familiarity and regional rivalries. If the Big Ten had been able to add Notre Dame & Pitt instead they would have been much better off.

Build your brand and lean into it. The MAC is 2nd tier programs in the Midwest who compete with each other for enrollment, recruits and local notoriety. YSU brings more to that than Uconn or some other random team from some random area I care nothing about.
Ah, yes. But have you considered that the most important thing is catering to the insecurities/vanity of your alumni base?

In all seriousness though, I think geography is only really a consideration for the MAC as it relates to keeping travel costs in line with travel budgets.

The goal is basically to find programs with the highest athletic budget possible and the best fan engagement possible. Nothing else really matters for the MAC.
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GoCats105
1/13/2025 11:51 AM
M.D.W.S.T wrote:expand_more
I'm all for Youngstown St, lean into the Ohio core.

They would be a big addition in basketball...
Can't get over this line of thinking. They've been to exactly ZERO NCAA Tournaments since joining Division I in 1981. Their winningest coach in school history was just poached by Utah State before they even did anything significant (outside of 1 regular season title). But a couple of wins over the MAC in the past couple of seasons and we're ready to say they'd be a great addition in basketball to the league? Cmon.

I like Penguins as a mascot too, but not that much.
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M.D.W.S.T
1/13/2025 1:21 PM
GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
I'm all for Youngstown St, lean into the Ohio core.

They would be a big addition in basketball...
Can't get over this line of thinking. They've been to exactly ZERO NCAA Tournaments since joining Division I in 1981. Their winningest coach in school history was just poached by Utah State before they even did anything significant (outside of 1 regular season title). But a couple of wins over the MAC in the past couple of seasons and we're ready to say they'd be a great addition in basketball to the league? Cmon.

I like Penguins as a mascot too, but not that much.
You're entitled to your opinion, no matter how stupid.

Is that your criteria? NCAA Tournament bids? Recent? Or you feel that success from 1981 is relevant to the current trajectory of a program? Take all the time you need with that. Which current basketball powerhouse is on your wishlist to join the Mid-American Conference? Duke is busy, but I'm sure you've got a well-thought-out list of suitors going. Please share.



And one more for the road...

Since 2021, Youngstown is 5-1 vs the MAC.
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GoCats105
1/13/2025 4:19 PM
M.D.W.S.T wrote:expand_more
I'm all for Youngstown St, lean into the Ohio core.

They would be a big addition in basketball...
Can't get over this line of thinking. They've been to exactly ZERO NCAA Tournaments since joining Division I in 1981. Their winningest coach in school history was just poached by Utah State before they even did anything significant (outside of 1 regular season title). But a couple of wins over the MAC in the past couple of seasons and we're ready to say they'd be a great addition in basketball to the league? Cmon.

I like Penguins as a mascot too, but not that much.
You're entitled to your opinion, no matter how stupid.

Is that your criteria? NCAA Tournament bids? Recent? Or you feel that success from 1981 is relevant to the current trajectory of a program? Take all the time you need with that. Which current basketball powerhouse is on your wishlist to join the Mid-American Conference? Duke is busy, but I'm sure you've got a well-thought-out list of suitors going. Please share.



And one more for the road...

Since 2021, Youngstown is 5-1 vs the MAC.
Jesus are you sensitive about this. You said in a previous post you should work for YSU, but I'm beginning to think you actually do or else you wouldn't be pushing them this hard. The point is they don't provide anything of value for this league that it doesn't already have. I've yet to see a good reason other than the travel aspect as to why they should be added. You want to make the MAC an All-Ohio league? Just sign up Wright State and Cleveland State while we're at it. Is John Carroll or Baldwin Wallace available? We haven't quite tapped into that NE Ohio market just enough yet. I'm sure the television networks would come running to the MAC offices for that lineup. Is the Sportstime Ohio channel still a thing? They could be the carrier for all things MAC.

Whoever said anything about Duke? Is that your go-to retort anytime someone mentions anything about wanting to improve this league? It's not that difficult to see upgrades for this league in basketball (and more importantly football, since that what drives the proverbial media bus anyway) that don't involve YSU and they've been mentioned 1000s of times on this board. WKU for one. MTSU if you had a person who could actually sell the idea on them, for two. Poach Delaware from CUSA? Hell, at this point what do you have to lose? Give Temple a call and see if they'll step away from the crumbling AAC now that UMass is on board.
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OhioCatFan
1/13/2025 7:08 PM
GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
... It's not that difficult to see upgrades for this league in basketball (and more importantly football, since that what drives the proverbial media bus anyway) that don't involve YSU and they've been mentioned 1000s of times on this board. WKU for one. MTSU if you had a person who could actually sell the idea on them, for two. Poach Delaware from CUSA? Hell, at this point what do you have to lose? Give Temple a call and see if they'll step away from the crumbling AAC now that UMass is on board.
All much better choices than YSU. Instead of adding more Ohio schools, I'm for dropping at least one -- Akron, what a joke of a university that is.
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Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame
1/13/2025 7:37 PM
GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
I'm all for Youngstown St, lean into the Ohio core.

They would be a big addition in basketball...
Can't get over this line of thinking. They've been to exactly ZERO NCAA Tournaments since joining Division I in 1981. Their winningest coach in school history was just poached by Utah State before they even did anything significant (outside of 1 regular season title). But a couple of wins over the MAC in the past couple of seasons and we're ready to say they'd be a great addition in basketball to the league? Cmon.

I like Penguins as a mascot too, but not that much.
You're entitled to your opinion, no matter how stupid.

Is that your criteria? NCAA Tournament bids? Recent? Or you feel that success from 1981 is relevant to the current trajectory of a program? Take all the time you need with that. Which current basketball powerhouse is on your wishlist to join the Mid-American Conference? Duke is busy, but I'm sure you've got a well-thought-out list of suitors going. Please share.



And one more for the road...

Since 2021, Youngstown is 5-1 vs the MAC.
Jesus are you sensitive about this. You said in a previous post you should work for YSU, but I'm beginning to think you actually do or else you wouldn't be pushing them this hard. The point is they don't provide anything of value for this league that it doesn't already have. I've yet to see a good reason other than the travel aspect as to why they should be added. You want to make the MAC an All-Ohio league? Just sign up Wright State and Cleveland State while we're at it. Is John Carroll or Baldwin Wallace available? We haven't quite tapped into that NE Ohio market just enough yet. I'm sure the television networks would come running to the MAC offices for that lineup. Is the Sportstime Ohio channel still a thing? They could be the carrier for all things MAC.

Whoever said anything about Duke? Is that your go-to retort anytime someone mentions anything about wanting to improve this league? It's not that difficult to see upgrades for this league in basketball (and more importantly football, since that what drives the proverbial media bus anyway) that don't involve YSU and they've been mentioned 1000s of times on this board. WKU for one. MTSU if you had a person who could actually sell the idea on them, for two. Poach Delaware from CUSA? Hell, at this point what do you have to lose? Give Temple a call and see if they'll step away from the crumbling AAC now that UMass is on board.
Admittedly, it's hard to keep track of all of the realignment and who is committed to go where when. But how's the AAC crumbling? They've lost teams over the last couple of years, but it's not clear why you'd leave a multi bid league with a recent final four team for a league that hasn't gotten a second team into the tournament in this century. I mean, our best non-conference opponent is in that league and killed us. And we might win the MAC. And they weren't picked to win the AAC.
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Andrew Ruck
1/14/2025 8:33 AM
GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
The point is they don't provide anything of value for this league that it doesn't already have. I've yet to see a good reason other than the travel aspect as to why they should be added. You want to make the MAC an All-Ohio league? Just sign up Wright State and Cleveland State while we're at it. Is John Carroll or Baldwin Wallace available? We haven't quite tapped into that NE Ohio market just enough yet. I'm sure the television networks would come running to the MAC offices for that lineup. Is the Sportstime Ohio channel still a thing? They could be the carrier for all things MAC.
I know you're joking and yet many of the things you say sound OK to me...IF you took football out of the equation. Wright State would be awesome to have and Cleveland St could work.

And a broadcasting deal with a regional sports channel sounds great. No national television networks are coming running if we add Delaware or WKU or whatever either. We are a regional conference...we aren't getting any TV deals outside of the current set up of 1 weekly game and ESPN+.
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stout76
2/24/2025 4:29 PM
They may stay in the MAC for wrestling.

https://x.com/Brett_McMurphy/status/1894092429453853049?r...
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ChiCat2018
2/24/2025 4:43 PM
Pataskala wrote:expand_more
Youngstown State fits within the existing MAC well. If you want to view that as an indictment on the MAC, fine. And if you want to believe Ohio is above the MAC, fine. But if we aren't getting the big conference invite you think we should, and the MAC is looking for a new member, YSU seems quite feasible.
The MAC was considering YSU as a 14th when they brought in Marshall. They should have looked at WKU then but didn't for whatever reason.

Youngstown only has 8,500 undergraduates and it would be smallest in the MAC. They don't open the MAC to any new states. If located in Pennsylvannia they would bring something to the MAC but not as a 7th Ohio school.
They open the MAC to a winning program.

What’s this nonsense about if they opened up the MAC to new states? What does that even mean? Is the MAC some NYC pipeline because of Buffalo? We get a lot of Chicago viewers because of NIU?
A Chicago cable system used to carry NIU home games but that's gone hte way of the dodo since ESPN+ came into existence. My guess is that some people in Chicagoland are interested in NIU football, but it's a pretty small percentage of viewers. They probably lag behind Notre Dame, Northwestern, Wisconsin, Illinois, and maybe Iowa and Purdue. Sitting in the middle of a B10 cluster doesn't help them.
I can assure you NIU is well below any BIG10 team. There are FCS teams that I would say are on par with NIU in general fan interest. I can't imagine having your games start at 9/10 pm local time is really going to make NIU more popular
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Bobcat1996
3/1/2025 10:23 PM
OCF- the joke of university you just spoke of clinched the conference regular season hoops title. Just guessing but not sure but Akron has been way better than the Bobcats in mens basketball for a while now. They are not a joke! Football maybe, but not in basketball. Throw Kent in that mix as being better than Ohio also recently in hoops.
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OhioCatFan
3/1/2025 11:52 PM
Bobcat1996 wrote:expand_more
OCF- the joke of university you just spoke of clinched the conference regular season hoops title. Just guessing but not sure but Akron has been way better than the Bobcats in mens basketball for a while now. They are not a joke! Football maybe, but not in basketball. Throw Kent in that mix as being better than Ohio also recently in hoops.
I was referring to neither basketball or football when I called them a "joke of a university." I was referring to their academics and their nearly bankrupt finances. I'm not saying that they don't have a few good programs here and there, but overall they are one of the worst academic institutions in the MAC. Yes, UA's basketball program has been quite good for a long time. Their football program is on the ropes at the moment, but might recover at some point.
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GoCats105
3/3/2025 11:19 AM
Per Matt Brown's Extra Points newsletter on all things college athletics, and as many suspected on this board, the move to the MWC and Horizon for NIU was all about money. They're hoping that cutting travel costs for non-football sports in the Horizon plus an increased TV revenue and ticket sales for football will help balance their budget.

https://www.extrapointsmb.com/p/here-s-why-niu-is-joining...
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JimLurker34
3/3/2025 11:29 AM
GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
Per Matt Brown's Extra Points newsletter on all things college athletics, and as many suspected on this board, the move to the MWC and Horizon for NIU was all about money. They're hoping that cutting travel costs for non-football sports in the Horizon plus an increased TV revenue and ticket sales for football will help balance their budget.

https://www.extrapointsmb.com/p/here-s-why-niu-is-joining...
They are dreaming in la-la-land if they think the next MWC football contract is going to be a pot of gold.
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ExCat21
3/10/2025 9:34 AM
Here are the deets:

https://www.hustlebelt.com/2025/2/24/24368456/northern-il...
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M.D.W.S.T
3/10/2025 9:49 AM
JimLurker34 wrote:expand_more
Per Matt Brown's Extra Points newsletter on all things college athletics, and as many suspected on this board, the move to the MWC and Horizon for NIU was all about money. They're hoping that cutting travel costs for non-football sports in the Horizon plus an increased TV revenue and ticket sales for football will help balance their budget.

https://www.extrapointsmb.com/p/here-s-why-niu-is-joining...
They are dreaming in la-la-land if they think the next MWC football contract is going to be a pot of gold.
They were -$3M in the hole, so I'm not sure they're even looking for a pot of gold. Just need to get to flat and whatever else happens is cherry.

I've seen anywhere from $4M-$5M payout for MWC teams. Which is double what the MAC has been receiving. Extra $2M-$3M gets them to even.

Now will that actually get them to even in the MWC? Like I've said, I have real doubts - but it's clear balancing the athletic department budget is a real driving factor so I'm sure they're making cuts across the board to hit it.

Will be quite interesting to re-visit in 2-3 years.
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