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Topic: Official Game 5 Thread: Kansas
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GraffZ06
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Posted: 11/26/2010 10:09 PM
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Wow.

Never expected to win this game. Didn't even really expect it to be close (see my earlier prediction), but this is beyond embarrassing.

We were a solid mid-major program in the not too distant past. Call me when we're a D1 caliber basketball team again.

Hot damn maybe we'll get lucky for a week in March again though. We can always hope for that!
RSBobcat
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Posted: 11/26/2010 10:15 PM
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Thinking about a lot of the negative posts last year about KVK (can't jump, fouls, doesn't score, etc.) and Basset (ball hog, etc.) - anybody think we could have used them tonight?
JSF
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Posted: 11/26/2010 10:26 PM
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GraffZ06 wrote:expand_more
Call me when we're a D1 caliber basketball team again.


We'll get right on the phone.  I know you expect us to be good, but you have to know how this sounds.
GraffZ06
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Posted: 11/26/2010 10:39 PM
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I expect D1 caliber basketball teams to at least be competitive, even in games against superior competition.

A high school team could put 5 guys in a uniform, roll out a ball and lose by 50.

We couldn't beat Shawnee State, Shippensburg or powerhouses the likes of Walsh by 50, yet that's what Kansas just did to us. Point being, the gap between us and a D3 school is smaller than the gap between us and Kansas.

If your only shot at national recognition and the NCAA tournament are the results of 3/4 games in March, then you aren't a competent D1 basketball team. IMO we haven't been that for approaching a decade.

Call me when we can talk about at-large bids to the NCAA without being forced to hope we win the MAC tournament. That requires both playing and beating "superior" teams. Not only are we not there, we're continents from it.
Last Edited: 11/26/2010 10:46:00 PM by GraffZ06
anorris
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Posted: 11/26/2010 10:50 PM
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That is among the most moronic definitions of a "DI team" I've ever heard in my life.
JSF
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Posted: 11/26/2010 11:01 PM
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So you're only interested when we're one of the 40 best teams in the nation.  Got it.  By the way, how's Wright State doing these days?

Yeah, tonight was really painful, but do you think they get beaten this badly more often than not?  I don't.  Crap happens.
GraffZ06
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Posted: 11/26/2010 11:04 PM
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To each their own I guess. I stand by my statement.

If you can't at least have the hope to compete on the national level (in this case NCAA tournament) then there isn't much point in playing the game. Might as well be a D2 school and save some $$ on recruiting and road trips and celebrate our wins against Ashland and Tiffin.
JSF
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Posted: 11/26/2010 11:05 PM
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Sure.  Let's just blow up The Convo.  Why even try?
Ohio Here
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Posted: 11/26/2010 11:10 PM
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Tennessee got beat by a D2 team a couple of weeks ago. They beat 'Nova tonight to win the pre-season NIT.

College basketball is the most fluid, unpredictable of all sports out there. Nights like this happen to every team. Heck, Kansas lost to a Tennessee team with 3 walk-ons and 6 scholarship players playing last January when they were ranked #1.

Just burn the tape and move on. Get focused on Santa Clara, don't let this affect you.
GraffZ06
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Posted: 11/26/2010 11:12 PM
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Bobcat Dragon wrote:expand_more
So you're only interested when we're one of the 40 best teams in the nation.  Got it.  By the way, how's Wright State doing these days?


Wright State? Wouldn't know. Haven't seen/listened to/watched one of their games since they fired Ed Schilling. That was what 2000/2001? I supported that team because of the people and friends I had on the team and coaching staff. Never had anything to do with caring about the school or thinking they were any good.

Bobcat Dragon wrote:expand_more
Yeah, tonight was really painful, but do you think they get beaten this badly more often than not?  I don't.  Crap happens.


Well I sure HOPE they wouldn't, but all we can truly judge on is the actual results. I'd sure like to HOPE we're not a bad basketball team but so far the record and numbers say otherwise. Like I said, I never expected to win, so in that sense a loss is a loss is a loss. From a coach/player stand point you have to just put this behind you and move on. But from a fan/program stand point this game is a black mark. Flat out embarrassing.

So I say again, call me when we're a competent D1 basketball team again.
Ohio Here
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Posted: 11/26/2010 11:13 PM
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GraffZ06 wrote:expand_more
So I say again, call me when we're a competent D1 basketball team again.

We won't.
Andrew Ruck
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Posted: 11/26/2010 11:21 PM
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Tobias Harris wrote:expand_more
Nights like this happen to every team. .


I see where you are going with this...But no, not every team loses by 57 points.  Has there been any margin of voctory greater than 57 in a game involving 2 D1 teams this year?  Let alone 2 teams that both had NCAA Tourney victories last season.
anorris
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Posted: 11/26/2010 11:22 PM
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Clearly the team that beat Georgetown had no ability to make noise on the national scene.

Not to mention that DI ball comprises 340+ programs.  I'm sure more than half of them would love to be as allegedly incompetent as we are.

Syrcause, who lost to national runner-up Butler in the NCAA tournament as a 1 seed last year, and who was ranked #1 in the nation in the AP Poll in early March, lost to DII Le Moyne last season, who finished their DII schedule with 10 losses, and didn't make the DII NCAA Tournament.  As stated above, its a fluid thing -- and maybe the guy who said we aren't ready yet was right.  The great thing about the season is that you can watch the team grow up in front of your eyes, much like we got to last season, and see when things start to click (or don't).

Watching the team grow and learn made the MAC and NCAA tournament victories that much more special to me, because I was there when we struggled to finish close games at home against Peay, Ball, and Kent, listened to the radio broadcast of the 2OT thriller in Akron, and called in a couple wild favors to get to watch us lay an egg at Pittsburgh.
JSF
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Posted: 11/26/2010 11:41 PM
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Andrew Ruck wrote:expand_more
Nights like this happen to every team. .


I see where you are going with this...But no, not every team loses by 57 points.  Has there been any margin of voctory greater than 57 in a game involving 2 D1 teams this year? 


Yes.  Memphis beat Centenary by 64.  St. Mary's beat Chicago State by 69.

Honestly, the nature of the blowout just suggests it's kind of flukey.  Not easy to swallow, but kind of easy to forget.
Last Edited: 11/26/2010 11:43:39 PM by JSF
Ohio Here
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Posted: 11/26/2010 11:42 PM
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Andrew Ruck wrote:expand_more
Nights like this happen to every team. .


I see where you are going with this...But no, not every team loses by 57 points.  Has there been any margin of voctory greater than 57 in a game involving 2 D1 teams this year?  Let alone 2 teams that both had NCAA Tourney victories last season.

UNC Asheville lost by 75 to Tennessee last year, early in the season like this. They went on to play in their conference championship with a chance to make the NCAA Tourny.

Groce just needs to move on, never talk about this again. You aren't going to learn anything by looking at the tape. Just focus on getting better for conference play.
anorris
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Posted: 11/26/2010 11:45 PM
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Andrew Ruck wrote:expand_more
Nights like this happen to every team. .


I see where you are going with this...But no, not every team loses by 57 points.  Has there been any margin of voctory greater than 57 in a game involving 2 D1 teams this year?  Let alone 2 teams that both had NCAA Tourney victories last season.


Well, yes... there was a 61 point victory today.  There have been several other big blowouts this year, as well.  And, Kansas has been doing it all season.

There was also a 52-point win by a team we already played this season, today.
Greenman
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Posted: 11/27/2010 12:03 AM
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GraffZ06 wrote:expand_more
I expect D1 caliber basketball teams to at least be competitive, even in games against superior competition.

A high school team could put 5 guys in a uniform, roll out a ball and lose by 50.

We couldn't beat Shawnee State, Shippensburg or powerhouses the likes of Walsh by 50, yet that's what Kansas just did to us. Point being, the gap between us and a D3 school is smaller than the gap between us and Kansas.

If your only shot at national recognition and the NCAA tournament are the results of 3/4 games in March, then you aren't a competent D1 basketball team. IMO we haven't been that for approaching a decade.

Call me when we can talk about at-large bids to the NCAA without being forced to hope we win the MAC tournament. That requires both playing and beating "superior" teams. Not only are we not there, we're continents from it.


um, if kansas was serious and balls to the wall, a high school team would not score a point.  maybe like 5 points because of fouls i guess
Andrew Ruck
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Posted: 11/27/2010 12:08 AM
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OK so the list of teams who were beat by 60ish this year...Alcorn State, SIU Edwardsville, Chicago State, Miss Valley State, Centenary, Southern....and Ohio?  Which one of these is not like the other?

I'm not one to get worried over one game, but the 57 point spread is just tough to swallow no matter how you slice it.
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 11/29/2010 11:16 PM
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graff be stupid.  clue:  Freeman got knocked out, played only 7 minutes.  True frosh played combined 60 minutes, before one of them got throwed out of the game.  Kansas is deep and experienced.

Dragon--How come Ethan only played a little over a minute vs. Kansas?
Ohio Hoops
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Posted: 11/30/2010 1:02 PM
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Monroe Slavin wrote:expand_more
graff be stupid.  clue:  Freeman got knocked out, played only 7 minutes.  True frosh played combined 60 minutes, before one of them got throwed out of the game.  Kansas is deep and experienced.

Dragon--How come Ethan only played a little over a minute vs. Kansas?


There's no excuse for losing by almost 60 to anyone. We're better than that even with losing Freeman. We had a great recruiting class and we have the MAC POY on the team. If this were a sub 30 point loss like a few years ago then your argument has some validity to it but that score is embarrassing. People all over the nation saw that score on their bottom lines during SportsCenter. Expect more out of this squad. 
JSF
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Posted: 11/30/2010 4:34 PM
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Monroe Slavin wrote:expand_more
Dragon--How come Ethan only played a little over a minute vs. Kansas?


I can't speak to the Kansas game specifically, but another poster mentioned his ankle giving him problems.  And when he is in, he looks a little lost and his body language is pretty negative.  Doesn't seem ready yet.
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 12/1/2010 12:04 AM
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Dragon--Maybe re the ankle/injury.  But he played about a minute (got a hoop!) and did not look inhibited by injury.  He got up and down the floor just fine.  Unless there's a limit on his minutes in case we want to redshirt Ethan, I cannot for the life of me figure why he didn't play 20 or more minutes against Kansas.  What--if he had played that much so that he could gain much needed experience, then we might have gotten killed instead of just getting destroyed?!

Losing by 57 to Kansas after we lose the nation's top 3-point shot who is also a staunch defender and while we played 3 true freshmen for 59 minutes (4 for 60 counting Ethan)--well, if you had been at the game you would see that Kansas is deep, good and experienced.  Couldn't ya see that on the vidcast?   Really, what's the point of being outraged about 57?  Would you be happier if it had only been 27?  The only thing to do is to be hope that our guys learn what top level ball is and really raise their games.
JSF
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Posted: 12/1/2010 12:08 AM
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His redshirt is burned unless they want to apply for a medical, which I doubt.

No idea why he didn't get in more.  Maybe Groce wanted to prove a point?
Ohio Hoops
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Posted: 12/1/2010 9:13 AM
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You don't throw a guy into the fire just for the hell of getting more experience. That's not really how it works at all. First and foremost you have to earn it in practice and keep earning it in games. Ethan may not be ready to play yet but due to AK leaving right before the season Groce might not have an option but to keep EJ ready in case another big goes down. 
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Posted: 12/1/2010 1:07 PM
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Monroe Slavin wrote:expand_more
well, if you had been at the game you would see that Kansas is deep, good and experienced.  Couldn't ya see that on the vidcast?  


No, Kansas actually looked very average on the vidcast.  Wasn't sure if the Jayhawks weren't actually an NAIA team.

Anyone else see the irony in the quoted comment? Considering the source? I'd bet Wanny noticed.
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