Ohio Basketball Topic
Topic: Snap judgement
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bshot44
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Posted: 12/5/2012 8:58 PM
What a debacle that was...

1.  Sloppy, sloppy, sloppy.  Was very disappointing see us continue to settle for bad 3's and just hand Memphis the ball so many times

2.  Soft, soft, soft.  Even more disappointing to see how soft we were in the paint.  Just let Memphis do whatever they wanted.  No heart whatsoever...

3.  Wake-Up Call?  Maybe?  Thought Bob Morris loss was that.....now it just seems like this team has a VERY long way to go to be not just an NCAA team, but a team that can win a game in the dance.  First time I really noticed they lacked that Groce-toughness.  Just let Memphis run right over them and did little to stop it.

I am the first to admit, I greatly overrated this team.  I hope they get it right in the end..but right now, let's just hope they can save face and MAYBE split OU/UMass on road and hopefully win out at home in NC.  They should still be class of the MAC...but all that at-large talk is circling the drain.  Looks like it's another win the MAC Tourney-or-bust kind of year...unfortunately.

Really expected more from a veteran team.

Disappointing
TheBikeman
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Posted: 12/5/2012 9:05 PM
Did anyone really expect to beat Memphis?  Christian doesn't know what he has yet, it's early ij the season..

Beat the MAC teams an everything will be fine.  Remember the MAC doesn't qualify for at large bids EVER
shabamon
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Posted: 12/5/2012 9:11 PM
Did I expect to win. No, honestly. Did I expect our players to expect to win? Absolutely. Groce instilled a no-fear demeanor, and I loved that. We were down 29-20 and I saw that tough team I love get it back to four. Didn't see that for the rest of the game.
bshot44
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Posted: 12/5/2012 9:11 PM
Yes...I thought they could go to Memphis and win.  Saw Murray State do it last year.  Memphis is oozing with talent, but if you don't let them run up and down the court they are VERY beatable.

Thought with a veteran team that plays strong defense and is used to playing in big games...I very much thought we could go there and.

Am I stunned we lost...not at all.

Am I a little surprised it was by 26 and with that kind of effort...yup.  I'd say more disappointed than surprised.  Really thought this team was better than that.

And as far as MAC teams never getting at-large bids....in the last 10 years, no they haven't.  It's because they don't win games like this and after coming of a Sweet 16, the door was open for at-large discussion if they could, say , win at Memphis and/or Oklahoma and go 14-2 in the MAC (which, again, I thought they were capable of.....now I'm not so certain)
ohio9704
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Posted: 12/5/2012 9:15 PM
SonnyDrysdale wrote:expand_more
Did anyone really expect to beat Memphis?  Christian doesn't know what he has yet, it's early ij the season..

Beat the MAC teams an everything will be fine.  Remember the MAC doesn't qualify for at large bids EVER


That was as average of a Memphis team as you will ever see.  Outside of playing Top 15 teams, this senior/junior group shouldn't expect to lose to anybody.  This team, and its fanbase, shouldn't have low expectations.  The play from this team tonight was dreadful.  The play from the 'Bigs" was god awful.  
Jughead
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Posted: 12/5/2012 9:17 PM
SonnyDrysdale wrote:expand_more
Did anyone really expect to beat Memphis?  Christian doesn't know what he has yet, it's early ij the season..

Beat the MAC teams an everything will be fine.  Remember the MAC doesn't qualify for at large bids EVER


Absolutely expected  this game to be close.  Memphis is NOT as good as we made them look tonight.

We were destroyed in the only game that we could make some national noise in this year.  Call it overreacting if you wish, but the only way we are making the tournament is to win the MAC tournament.
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 12/5/2012 9:20 PM
shabamon wrote:expand_more
Groce instilled a no-fear demeanor


Bshot says:  "First time I really noticed they lacked that Groce-toughness."

At the end of last year, yes.  But have you forgotten the 57 point loss to Kansas and the Pitt debacle?  And the ill-fated Toledo/EMU week of last year?  Groce produced excellent toughness at the end of seasons, but we had our weak moments under him too.  
bshot44
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Posted: 12/5/2012 9:29 PM
agree 100%

we had some real stinkers under Groce....

But coming off a Sweet 16 where we damn near beat UNC....

Start the season 6-0

lose (inexplicably) at Robert Morris...

I would think this team, if any team, would be really dialed in tonight.  I didn't get that sense.  They just stood on the tracks and let Memphis run them over.

Maybe "Groce-toughness" is a bad choice of words......I guess what I meant was toughness.  period.  Very disappointing to see how soft we were.
cbus cat fan
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Posted: 12/5/2012 9:31 PM
I liked Coach Christian's comments, blunt and to the point. Perhaps some of the team got a bit cocky after the 6-0 start. Coach Christian mentioned that only Jon Smith followed the game plan. Coach Christian also responding to a question (maybe it was Russ) that Ohio is going to face a lot more athletic teams along the way and we better get used to it. Wake up calls like this may be necessary before we have thoughts of beating the likes of Oakland, UMass and Oklahoma, not to mention the MAC schedule.
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 12/5/2012 10:01 PM
[QUOTE=SonnyDrysdale]Did anyone really expect to beat Memphis?  Christian doesn't know what he has yet, it's early ij the season..

Beat the MAC teams an everything will be fine.  Remember the MAC doesn't qualify for at large bids EVER[/QUOTE]

Wrong.
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 12/5/2012 10:07 PM
cbus cat fan wrote:expand_more
I liked Coach Christian's comments, blunt and to the point. Perhaps some of the team got a bit cocky after the 6-0 start. Coach Christian mentioned that only Jon Smith followed the game plan. Coach Christian also responding to a question (maybe it was Russ) that Ohio is going to face a lot more athletic teams along the way and we better get used to it. Wake up calls like this may be necessary before we have thoughts of beating the likes of Oakland, UMass and Oklahoma, not to mention the MAC schedule.


Agreed.  The quote I liked in the interview was when JC was asked about Memphis' athleticism.  He kind of shrugged it off and said, in essence, we could make a lot of teams look athletic if we continued to play like this.  He talked about sloppiness in the passing game.  He didn't really buy into the line that we lost to a more athletic, more talented team.  He ended by saying something to the effect that we would get better and that this type of play wasn't going to be tolerated.  These are all paraphrases from memory (wasn't taking notes), but I think I got the essence of what he was saying.  He wasn't happy and wasn't making excuses.  I think Ohio's going to have some very tough practices coming up!
GroverBall
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Posted: 12/6/2012 11:10 AM
OhioCatFan wrote:expand_more
I liked Coach Christian's comments, blunt and to the point. Perhaps some of the team got a bit cocky after the 6-0 start. Coach Christian mentioned that only Jon Smith followed the game plan. Coach Christian also responding to a question (maybe it was Russ) that Ohio is going to face a lot more athletic teams along the way and we better get used to it. Wake up calls like this may be necessary before we have thoughts of beating the likes of Oakland, UMass and Oklahoma, not to mention the MAC schedule.


Agreed.  The quote I liked in the interview was when JC was asked about Memphis' athleticism.  He kind of shrugged it off and said, in essence, we could make a lot of teams look athletic if we continued to play like this.  He talked about sloppiness in the passing game.  He didn't really buy into the line that we lost to a more athletic, more talented team.  He ended by saying something to the effect that we would get better and that this type of play wasn't going to be tolerated.  These are all paraphrases from memory (wasn't taking notes), but I think I got the essence of what he was saying.  He wasn't happy and wasn't making excuses.  I think Ohio's going to have some very tough practices coming up!



JC was in no mood to chat after the game but I wish he had said something about OUr halfcourt defense.  I couldn't pinpoint what was going wrong but it looked like they had found glaring weaknesses in OUr rotation/switching, leading to their guys being left alone BOTH on the baseline to receive easy passes for dunks AND on the perimeter for open 3s.  Sloppiness can be fixed but defensive holes are a problem -- OUr future opponents are going to watch last night's tape for sure.  Can anyone disect? 
Ted Thompson
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Posted: 12/6/2012 11:13 AM
GroverBall wrote:expand_more
I liked Coach Christian's comments, blunt and to the point. Perhaps some of the team got a bit cocky after the 6-0 start. Coach Christian mentioned that only Jon Smith followed the game plan. Coach Christian also responding to a question (maybe it was Russ) that Ohio is going to face a lot more athletic teams along the way and we better get used to it. Wake up calls like this may be necessary before we have thoughts of beating the likes of Oakland, UMass and Oklahoma, not to mention the MAC schedule.


Agreed.  The quote I liked in the interview was when JC was asked about Memphis' athleticism.  He kind of shrugged it off and said, in essence, we could make a lot of teams look athletic if we continued to play like this.  He talked about sloppiness in the passing game.  He didn't really buy into the line that we lost to a more athletic, more talented team.  He ended by saying something to the effect that we would get better and that this type of play wasn't going to be tolerated.  These are all paraphrases from memory (wasn't taking notes), but I think I got the essence of what he was saying.  He wasn't happy and wasn't making excuses.  I think Ohio's going to have some very tough practices coming up!



JC was in no mood to chat after the game but I wish he had said something about OUr halfcourt defense.  I couldn't pinpoint what was going wrong but it looked like they had found glaring weaknesses in OUr rotation/switching, leading to their guys being left alone BOTH on the baseline to receive easy passes for dunks AND on the perimeter for open 3s.  Sloppiness can be fixed but defensive holes are a problem -- OUr future opponents are going to watch last night's tape for sure.  Can anyone disect? 


I don't think any of our guys could stop penetration. Which led to drop-offs for easy buckets and kick-outs for good looks from three.
OU_Country
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Posted: 12/6/2012 12:22 PM
GroverBall wrote:expand_more
I liked Coach Christian's comments, blunt and to the point. Perhaps some of the team got a bit cocky after the 6-0 start. Coach Christian mentioned that only Jon Smith followed the game plan. Coach Christian also responding to a question (maybe it was Russ) that Ohio is going to face a lot more athletic teams along the way and we better get used to it. Wake up calls like this may be necessary before we have thoughts of beating the likes of Oakland, UMass and Oklahoma, not to mention the MAC schedule.


Agreed.  The quote I liked in the interview was when JC was asked about Memphis' athleticism.  He kind of shrugged it off and said, in essence, we could make a lot of teams look athletic if we continued to play like this.  He talked about sloppiness in the passing game.  He didn't really buy into the line that we lost to a more athletic, more talented team.  He ended by saying something to the effect that we would get better and that this type of play wasn't going to be tolerated.  These are all paraphrases from memory (wasn't taking notes), but I think I got the essence of what he was saying.  He wasn't happy and wasn't making excuses.  I think Ohio's going to have some very tough practices coming up!



JC was in no mood to chat after the game but I wish he had said something about OUr halfcourt defense.  I couldn't pinpoint what was going wrong but it looked like they had found glaring weaknesses in OUr rotation/switching, leading to their guys being left alone BOTH on the baseline to receive easy passes for dunks AND on the perimeter for open 3s.  Sloppiness can be fixed but defensive holes are a problem -- OUr future opponents are going to watch last night's tape for sure.  Can anyone disect? 


I can't dissect, but I can tell you from speaking to a few that were at the RMU Saturday that the problems were similar in both the Memphis and Robert Morris games.
Pataskala
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Posted: 12/6/2012 12:52 PM
This time of year, I like to see what the other MAC teams are doing.  They're the ones we need to beat to get to the NCAA, because the odds of a MAC school getting an at-large bid are pretty long; unlike football, there aren't any schools likely to miss out on the dance because they're waiting for a better offer.

At this point, I would put us 3rd in the MAC.  Thus far, Kent seems to be the team to beat.  They're 5-3 and their schedule is mostly teams that have been to the NCAA tourney in recent years (Drexel, Temple, Valpo, Bethune-Cookman, Princeton).  They have really the only signature win so far for the MAC; they gave Nebraska its only loss thus far, by 14 points on the road.  Akron would be next.  They're 3-2 against D1 schools, with their losses at Coastal Carolina (19-12 last year, but only 2-4 this year) and at OKSt, and wins over UNC-Asheville & MTSU (both NCAA tourney teams last year) and at 4-4 Penn St (a perennial Big Whatever bottom feeder, so I'm not sure how "signature" that might be).  Ohio's wins have all been against at least MAC-level teams, with the St. Bonnie and Richmond wins vs. at least upper-tier MAC teams.  The rest of the MAC has been really foundering, getting hammered by BS and not-so-BS schools.  And for some reason, a lot of below-D1 schools are showing up on schedules: everybody except Ohio, Kent, Toledo and Fiami has played at least one.  Ten of the MAC's 47 wins have come vs. below-D1 schools. 

This time of year is for finding the rhythm and the rhyme of a team, especially if you're a new coach.  I think last night we found there's lots this team has to do to be at the level they were last March.
Monroe Slavin
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Posted: 12/6/2012 4:40 PM
I didn't see or hear the game.  But I have your snap judgment for you:  We lost by 26 in a pride/marquee game.
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