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Topic: Michigan State transfer coming to Ohio
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OhioBobcat
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Posted: 8/25/2014 12:34 PM
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Posted: 8/25/2014 12:43 PM
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WOWOWOWOWOWOWOOWOWOWWOWOWOW
Andrew Ruck
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Posted: 8/25/2014 1:07 PM
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OhioCatFan
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Posted: 8/25/2014 11:02 PM
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From an athletic standpoint this looks like a real game changer.  I just hope that he has grown up and will be a positive influence on team morale and won't be a bad role model for the other team members.  I have faith that SP would not have recruited him if he had any doubt about whether or not he would conform to his team rules.  Therefore, I'm pretty excited about this development.

Is it realistic that he can become immediately eligible?  
Pete Chouteau
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Posted: 8/26/2014 8:00 AM
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What's the basis for a waiver?

He played, he was a bonehead in Tom Izzo's eyes, he transferred.

I don't see how it's granted.
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Posted: 8/26/2014 8:06 AM
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Pete Chouteau wrote:expand_more
What's the basis for a waiver?

He played, he was a bonehead in Tom Izzo's eyes, he transferred.

I don't see how it's granted.


As it's being discussed on the other thread, he was actually dismissed by Izzo which caused him to transfer. The NCAA could grant the waiver in this case although I've never seen a precedent-setting situation for something like this.
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Posted: 8/26/2014 8:51 AM
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OhioCatFan wrote:expand_more
From an athletic standpoint this looks like a real game changer. I just hope that he has grown up and will be a positive influence on team morale and won't be a bad role model for the other team members. I have faith that SP would not have recruited him if he had any doubt about whether or not he would conform to his team rules. Therefore, I'm pretty excited about this development.

Is it realistic that he can become immediately eligible?
I'm sorry, but if SP doesn't have doubts about Kaminski's ability to abide by the rules, then I would question his judgement. This is a high risk- high reward gamble that seems to have a small chance of working out. Saul thought it was worth the risk, but I can almost guarantee you that he understands the risks involved. He is no dummy.
Last Edited: 8/26/2014 8:52:31 AM by colobobcat66
OU_Country
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Posted: 8/26/2014 9:28 AM
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colobobcat66 wrote:expand_more
From an athletic standpoint this looks like a real game changer. I just hope that he has grown up and will be a positive influence on team morale and won't be a bad role model for the other team members. I have faith that SP would not have recruited him if he had any doubt about whether or not he would conform to his team rules. Therefore, I'm pretty excited about this development.

Is it realistic that he can become immediately eligible?


I'm sorry, but if SP doesn't have doubts about Kaminski's ability to abide by the rules, then I would question his judgement. This is a high risk- high reward gamble that seems to have a small chance of working out. Saul thought it was worth the risk, but I can almost guarantee you that he understands the risks involved. He is no dummy.


Hit the nail on the head here.  Fingers crossed for a exception to be granted for this year.
The Optimist
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Posted: 8/26/2014 9:49 AM
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colobobcat66 wrote:expand_more
From an athletic standpoint this looks like a real game changer. I just hope that he has grown up and will be a positive influence on team morale and won't be a bad role model for the other team members. I have faith that SP would not have recruited him if he had any doubt about whether or not he would conform to his team rules. Therefore, I'm pretty excited about this development.

Is it realistic that he can become immediately eligible?


I'm sorry, but if SP doesn't have doubts about Kaminski's ability to abide by the rules, then I would question his judgement. This is a high risk- high reward gamble that seems to have a small chance of working out. Saul thought it was worth the risk, but I can almost guarantee you that he understands the risks involved. He is no dummy.

I don't see the "high risk" here for Ohio. What does Ohio risk here, exactly?






While Kaminski didn't get along with his last coach (granted a very well respected coach) he is also a kid who has never had any run-ins with the law and who Izzo stated earlier last season was not anywhere close to being academically ineligible. 

If Kaminski does come in and doesn't take things seriously, he leaves Ohio before ever setting foot on the court in an Ohio uniform. Ohio blows a scholarship that likely would not have been filled for this season anyway and Saul Phillips is free to go recruit a guy for next year to fill that spot, which is exactly what he would have done if he had not brought in Kaminski in the first place.

Maybe you argue he messes with team chemistry? But we haven't heard any problems with him getting along with his MSU teammates. Everything I have seen from his MSU teammates has been positive wishing him well.

...

I've always thought Izzo was pretty much the top coach nationally, including Coach K, so I certainly understand the skepticism about Kaminski given the strong nature of Izzo's words. That said, this seems like a "risk" you take in a heartbeat. If he comes in and pulls an Anrio Adams, life goes on. Did Anrio blow up team chemistry during his two months "on the team?" Not at all.

Then you have the optimistic side... He comes in and plays like a guy who was expected to start for Michigan State, shooting 50% from 3 while developing into a sound rebounder and defender.

 
Last Edited: 8/26/2014 9:51:53 AM by The Optimist
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Posted: 8/26/2014 10:02 AM
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The Optimist wrote:expand_more
Did Anrio blow up team chemistry during his two months "on the team?" Not at all.

 


I agree with almost everything you said.  Not a lot of downside when you have open scholarships.  However, I think I read specifically from Arkley at some point in the last few months that the Anrio Adams era specifically rubbed a lot of the guys on the team the wrong way last year.  I have no idea if that lasted longer than a few days but it was certainly disruptive for at least a short period of time.  I don't think we can compare Kaminski to the world traveler Adams so I'm not concerned if Saul isn't.
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Posted: 8/26/2014 10:19 AM
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The fact that a coach can dismiss a player from the team and then he has to sit out a year is why the NCAA is a joke.  
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Posted: 8/26/2014 10:49 AM
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The Optimist wrote:expand_more
From an athletic standpoint this looks like a real game changer. I just hope that he has grown up and will be a positive influence on team morale and won't be a bad role model for the other team members. I have faith that SP would not have recruited him if he had any doubt about whether or not he would conform to his team rules. Therefore, I'm pretty excited about this development.

Is it realistic that he can become immediately eligible?


I'm sorry, but if SP doesn't have doubts about Kaminski's ability to abide by the rules, then I would question his judgement. This is a high risk- high reward gamble that seems to have a small chance of working out. Saul thought it was worth the risk, but I can almost guarantee you that he understands the risks involved. He is no dummy.


I don't see the "high risk" here for Ohio. What does Ohio risk here, exactly?






While Kaminski didn't get along with his last coach (granted a very well respected coach) he is also a kid who has never had any run-ins with the law and who Izzo stated earlier last season was not anywhere close to being academically ineligible.

If Kaminski does come in and doesn't take things seriously, he leaves Ohio before ever setting foot on the court in an Ohio uniform. Ohio blows a scholarship that likely would not have been filled for this season anyway and Saul Phillips is free to go recruit a guy for next year to fill that spot, which is exactly what he would have done if he had not brought in Kaminski in the first place.

Maybe you argue he messes with team chemistry? But we haven't heard any problems with him getting along with his MSU teammates. Everything I have seen from his MSU teammates has been positive wishing him well.

...

I've always thought Izzo was pretty much the top coach nationally, including Coach K, so I certainly understand the skepticism about Kaminski given the strong nature of Izzo's words. That said, this seems like a "risk" you take in a heartbeat. If he comes in and pulls an Anrio Adams, life goes on. Did Anrio blow up team chemistry during his two months "on the team?" Not at all.

Then you have the optimistic side... He comes in and plays like a guy who was expected to start for Michigan State, shooting 50% from 3 while developing into a sound rebounder and defender.
I hope you're right about this. Time will tell. We don't know what we don't know about this guy. At least we'll have somebody to practice against if he can't play this year.
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Posted: 8/26/2014 11:10 AM
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The Optimist wrote:expand_more

I don't see the "high risk" here for Ohio. What does Ohio risk here, exactly?

 


There's plenty of risk. One is that he pulls an Abreu and gets booted at the worst possible time.   The other risk is that he makes some friends on the team and takes them down with him in a hail of Doritos.  From reading his timeline he appears to have been given plenty of warning in Lansing.  As someone else said earlier, you just hope that Saul and staff have done their due diligence and have mitigated the risk.  I don't know the kid so I'm not going to judge him too harshly but let's just say I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

But on the other hand the pay off could be huge.
Last Edited: 8/26/2014 11:11:47 AM by OUVan
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Posted: 8/26/2014 11:41 AM
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colobobcat66 wrote:expand_more
From an athletic standpoint this looks like a real game changer. I just hope that he has grown up and will be a positive influence on team morale and won't be a bad role model for the other team members. I have faith that SP would not have recruited him if he had any doubt about whether or not he would conform to his team rules. Therefore, I'm pretty excited about this development.

Is it realistic that he can become immediately eligible?


I'm sorry, but if SP doesn't have doubts about Kaminski's ability to abide by the rules, then I would question his judgement. This is a high risk- high reward gamble that seems to have a small chance of working out. Saul thought it was worth the risk, but I can almost guarantee you that he understands the risks involved. He is no dummy.

Groce did not have doubts about A. Bassett, and Frank didn't have doubts about Mike Hinton, those two worked out well.

 
87OU Alum
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Posted: 8/26/2014 11:57 AM
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Oklahoma tried the same thing with a wide reciever that was dismissed from Missouri last year.

NCAA denied that as well.

Think about it........if this Pandora's Box is opened you would see kids violating team rules everyday to get kicked off teams. Be it because they're buried on a depth chart.......or they under committed as a freshman and now have the opportunity to go and start at a power 5......it's one step away from free agency.

Personally I think any athelete dismissed should have to sit a year.

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Posted: 8/26/2014 12:08 PM
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I'm very much in the camp that is worried about this move. I understand the risk that some mid-majors must take on a transfer that flamed out elsewhere and people deserve second chances, but man, he must have pissed off Izzo something fierce to warrant that public lynching he got.

That said, Kaminzki is a Bobcat now. If he stays out of trouble, goes to class and is a great teammate, then great move on the part of our staff. Hell, even if he never sees the court, but stays out of trouble and graduates, then he can an asset to our program. Will he be a Shaun Stonerook, Jon Sanderson or Walt Offutt, about all of whom I was skeptical but were great Bobcats? Or will he be in the Johnnie Jackson, Anrio Adams mold?
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Posted: 8/26/2014 12:13 PM
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87OU Alum wrote:expand_more
Oklahoma tried the same thing with a wide reciever that was dismissed from Missouri last year.
NCAA denied that as well.

Think about it........if this Pandora's Box is opened you would see kids violating team rules everyday to get kicked off teams. Be it because they're buried on a depth chart.......or they under committed as a freshman and now have the opportunity to go and start at a power 5......it's one step away from free agency.

Personally I think any athelete dismissed should have to sit a year.

I'm okay with that as long as the expulsion can be proved by some agency to not be without merit.
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Posted: 8/26/2014 12:16 PM
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BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
From an athletic standpoint this looks like a real game changer. I just hope that he has grown up and will be a positive influence on team morale and won't be a bad role model for the other team members. I have faith that SP would not have recruited him if he had any doubt about whether or not he would conform to his team rules. Therefore, I'm pretty excited about this development.

Is it realistic that he can become immediately eligible?


I'm sorry, but if SP doesn't have doubts about Kaminski's ability to abide by the rules, then I would question his judgement. This is a high risk- high reward gamble that seems to have a small chance of working out. Saul thought it was worth the risk, but I can almost guarantee you that he understands the risks involved. He is no dummy.


Groce did not have doubts about A. Bassett, and Frank didn't have doubts about Mike Hinton, those two worked out well.

Unless you know those coaches personally, you are only speculating that they did not have doubts. If they did, they thought it was worth the risk. The point is that these things are a crap shoot, some work, some don't. Let's all hope it works out for all concerned.
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Posted: 8/26/2014 12:24 PM
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OUVan wrote:expand_more

I don't see the "high risk" here for Ohio. What does Ohio risk here, exactly?

 


There's plenty of risk. One is that he pulls an Abreu and gets booted at the worst possible time. 


I don;t see him getting the waiver, so no risk of this happening this season, and gives Saul a year to make sure he gets his act together.

OUVan wrote:expand_more
The other risk is that he makes some friends on the team and takes them down with him in a hail of Doritos.


As I stated in the other thread, the core of this team appears to be pretty solid guys that would not be influenced by someone coming in.  Remember, he also has a friend on the team, so that always helps keeping a new guy in line.

OUVan wrote:expand_more
As someone else said earlier, you just hope that Saul and staff have done their due diligence and have mitigated the risk.


Kind of insulting to think they may not have.

Given above - sounds low risk - high reward.
Last Edited: 8/26/2014 12:26:11 PM by cc-cat
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Posted: 8/26/2014 12:32 PM
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BillyTheCat wrote:expand_more
[Groce did not have doubts about A. Bassett, and Frank didn't have doubts about Mike Hinton, those two worked out well.

 

Yeah I was waiting for that one. Surprised it came from you Wanny. 
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Posted: 8/26/2014 1:06 PM
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I coached the kid his last summer of AAU and found him to be a decent kid. I saw no problems with his relationships with his teammates.  A bit quite if I recall, but not a problem. I know this; KK can shoot the heck out of the bball, and if he can play this year, the Bobcats have a chance to win the MAC tourney!  Let's keep our finger crossed!!
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Posted: 8/26/2014 2:14 PM
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Bball Jones wrote:expand_more
I coached the kid his last summer of AAU and found him to be a decent kid. I saw no problems with his relationships with his teammates.  A bit quite if I recall, but not a problem. I know this; KK can shoot the heck out of the bball, and if he can play this year, the Bobcats have a chance to win the MAC tourney!  Let's keep our finger crossed!!


I interviewed Kenny once and got a fine first impression.  It was right before his freshman year.  He was very excited about coming to MSU.  I just saw him play this summer in the Lansing summer league.  He took a nasty fall and had to get his torso wrapped.  He is in better shape than he was a few years ago.  That shoulder trouble caused him to get out of shape as a senior at Medina and in college.

You're right, absolutely lights-out shooter and fearless.  He'll just keep bombing away.  Instant offense if everything is clicking.  At his best, he's going to pull a Luke Hancock and close a double-digit deficit for us in a few minutes. 
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Posted: 8/26/2014 2:46 PM
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Because of his potential as a basketball player and the gaps in the team I think we all would like to see him play this year, however, based on the unspecified reasons that caused him to get booted off of his previous team I think sitting out a year to focus on school work, personal growth and maturity would be what is best for the young man.
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Posted: 8/26/2014 3:56 PM
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Ohio needs him this year I hope it happens. The difference between being a top 25 team this year or a top 3 MAC team this year and next.
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Posted: 8/26/2014 6:12 PM
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87OU Alum wrote:expand_more

Oklahoma tried the same thing with a wide reciever that was dismissed from Missouri last year.

NCAA denied that as well.

Think about it........if this Pandora's Box is opened you would see kids violating team rules everyday to get kicked off teams. Be it because they're buried on a depth chart.......or they under committed as a freshman and now have the opportunity to go and start at a power 5......it's one step away from free agency.

Personally I think any athelete dismissed should have to sit a year.


So coaches can dismiss players and release them from scholarship, but players don't have the same freedom?  Tell me how that is fair....

The Pandora's box you speak of would only be a huge issue because then coach's would go around trying to get kids to transfer.  Don't punish the players for coaches potentially breaking the rules...

 
Last Edited: 8/27/2014 10:48:19 AM by Speaker of Truth
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