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Ohio Basketball Topic
Topic: Mid-Major Madness Power 15
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cbarber357
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Posted: 11/17/2014 12:29 PM
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Toledo comes in at #14 and George Washington is tied at #6, we make an appearance in the others receiving votes section along with Buffalo, St. Bonny, and FGCU. No Belmont mentions though.
http://www.midmajormadness.com/2014/11/17/7233613/mid-maj...
Last Edited: 11/17/2014 12:34:08 PM by cbarber357
The Optimist
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Posted: 11/17/2014 12:52 PM
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I see that Hustle Belt has a representative voting in this poll. Based on that, I'm assuming this is garbage.
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 11/17/2014 1:06 PM
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I totally disagree with A 10 teams being included in any mid major poll. In fact, they are excluded from other such polls.
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 11/17/2014 1:19 PM
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I totally reject as irrelevant any "mid-major" poll.
OUVan
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Posted: 11/17/2014 1:55 PM
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OhioCatFan wrote:expand_more
I totally reject as irrelevant any "mid-major" poll.
And yet you clicked on the thread anyway.
GoCats105
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Posted: 11/17/2014 2:02 PM
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Gonzaga a mid-major? Cmon man.

The term mid-major shouldn't really be based on conference affiliation. There's way too many factors. Wichita State is approaching that level of not being labeled as such.
JSF
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Posted: 11/17/2014 6:23 PM
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OhioCatFan wrote:expand_more
I totally reject as irrelevant any "mid-major" poll.
Well, there's one sign of the apocalypse.
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 11/17/2014 6:28 PM
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GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
Gonzaga a mid-major? Cmon man.

The term mid-major shouldn't really be based on conference affiliation. There's way too many factors. Wichita State is approaching that level of not being labeled as such.
Apocalyptic or not, that's my point. This whole mid-major crapola is meaningless. OHIO is D1. If we get ranked in the top 25 in a major poll that means something. I could care less what other rankings we have, except for our standings in the MAC East.
The Optimist
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Posted: 11/17/2014 6:59 PM
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Is the exclusion of the A-10, Wichita State and Gonzaga based on spending (the old mid-majority "red line?") or just their overall success the last half decade.

If we are going off purely spending, we are basically right in the thick of things when it comes to the A-10.
http://www.bbstate.com/info/teams-hoopsbudget
Food for thought-we also are above average for the A-10 in attendance and tournament wins the last 5 years. So what separates us? Who we keep company with?

Interesting to consider how quickly Butler, Creighton and Gonzaga went from the leading mid-majors to no longer mid-majors. I like the growth trajectory for Saul Ball.........
OUbobcat9092
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Posted: 11/17/2014 7:38 PM
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http://www.collegeinsider.com/mens-mid-major-top-25.php

Ohio is not listed on this poll, at all.

Toledo, Akron, WMU, Belmont and FGCU all in the top 25
shabamon
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Posted: 11/17/2014 9:19 PM
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My opinion is the opposite of GoCats'. If the University of San Francisco is a mid-major, so is Gonzaga. If Southern Illinois is a mid-major, so is Wichita State.
catfan28
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Posted: 11/17/2014 10:13 PM
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That list of budgets is really interesting. We spend $1M more than any other MAC school on men's basketball! With that in mind, kind of disappointing we haven't seen more ROI...perhaps Saul can change that. Coaching turnover has certainly not been our friend.
Mike Bundt WHIZ
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Posted: 11/18/2014 12:54 AM
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shabamon wrote:expand_more
My opinion is the opposite of GoCats'. If the University of San Francisco is a mid-major, so is Gonzaga. If Southern Illinois is a mid-major, so is Wichita State.
I'm 100% with you on that. You can't separate teams as mid-majors or not based on how successful they've been. It's all about their conference affiliation.

Also, I'm a fan of this poll including the A10 and CUSA. I was a voter for this last year. It's a SB Nation poll. It's more used to rank the top Non-P5/MWC/Big East schools in the country than anything else.
Last Edited: 11/18/2014 12:56:28 AM by Mike Bundt WHIZ
GoCats105
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Posted: 11/18/2014 7:41 AM
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WHIZsportsMIKE wrote:expand_more
My opinion is the opposite of GoCats'. If the University of San Francisco is a mid-major, so is Gonzaga. If Southern Illinois is a mid-major, so is Wichita State.
I'm 100% with you on that. You can't separate teams as mid-majors or not based on how successful they've been. It's all about their conference affiliation.

Also, I'm a fan of this poll including the A10 and CUSA. I was a voter for this last year. It's a SB Nation poll. It's more used to rank the top Non-P5/MWC/Big East schools in the country than anything else.
It's not totally based on success which was my original point. There are too many factors (success, dollars spent investing in the program, recruiting, coaching, etc.) that make the term "mid-major" a gray area. Gonzaga is not on the same level as San Francisco. Xavier wasn't on the same level as Fordham. There's no way you can base it totally on conference affiliation.
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Posted: 11/18/2014 9:30 AM
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WHIZsportsMIKE wrote:expand_more
My opinion is the opposite of GoCats'. If the University of San Francisco is a mid-major, so is Gonzaga. If Southern Illinois is a mid-major, so is Wichita State.
I'm 100% with you on that. You can't separate teams as mid-majors or not based on how successful they've been. It's all about their conference affiliation.
So Northwestern, a school that has never been to the NCAA tournament, is a high-major?
bornacatfan
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Posted: 11/18/2014 7:04 PM
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JSF wrote:expand_more
So Northwestern, a school that has never been to the NCAA tournament, is a high-major?
Every night they put on big boy pants and take the shots any Big 10 team takes when they play OOC. There are many B10 fanbases who would like to see them go but I think they are a Big Boy program by the oompany they keep
Jeff McKinney
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Posted: 11/18/2014 11:55 PM
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Definition of midmajor should be completely based on conference affiliation.

To determine if a conference is high major or mid major, the factors to consider are budgets and level of TV coverage.

By these criteria, the Atlantic 10 is clearly high major...and that includes Fordham as well as Dayton.
Last Edited: 11/19/2014 12:02:53 AM by Jeff McKinney
OhioCatFan
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Posted: 11/19/2014 12:07 AM
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Reminds me of the Supreme Court justice who said he had trouble defining obscenity but he knew what it was when he saw it. Can't really define "mid major" but I know one when I see one. I love it when you guys argue about the definition of this term. Just makes my point. ;-)
Mike Bundt WHIZ
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Posted: 11/19/2014 12:17 AM
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bornacatfan wrote:expand_more
So Northwestern, a school that has never been to the NCAA tournament, is a high-major?
Every night they put on big boy pants and take the shots any Big 10 team takes when they play OOC. There are many B10 fanbases who would like to see them go but I think they are a Big Boy program by the oompany they keep
I'm with you 100%. They face the gauntlet every year. They are definitely a high major despite their lack of success.
OUVan
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Posted: 11/19/2014 9:40 AM
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Jeff McKinney wrote:expand_more
Definition of midmajor should be completely based on conference affiliation.

To determine if a conference is high major or mid major, the factors to consider are budgets and level of TV coverage.

By these criteria, the Atlantic 10 is clearly high major...and that includes Fordham as well as Dayton.
I mostly agree but what about a clear outlier like Gonzaga who are clearly in a midmajor conference but have a basketball budget larger than Ohio State (yet smaller than Northwestern)?
shabamon
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Posted: 11/19/2014 9:53 AM
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Can you be mid-major and major in different sports? I'm thinking of Memphis football as I type that question.
shabamon
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Posted: 11/19/2014 10:05 AM
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If we are going to make these arbitrary classifications, I think the term "low-major" should be used more widely.

High-major: Power 5, AAC, and Big East
Mid-major: A-10, MVC, and every other conference that plays FBS football
Low-major: Everyone else
OUVan
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Posted: 11/19/2014 10:06 AM
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shabamon wrote:expand_more
Can you be mid-major and major in different sports? I'm thinking of Memphis football as I type that question.
Absolutely
GoCats105
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Posted: 11/19/2014 11:04 AM
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shabamon wrote:expand_more
Can you be mid-major and major in different sports? I'm thinking of Memphis football as I type that question.
Of course, which is another reason why I don't think conference affiliation should apply. Memphis, Cincinnati and UConn are all out of the Power 5 in football, but on the borderline. They are definitely not mid-majors in basketball. The whole AAC is just a weird league to define.

I don't buy because the overall conference investment (high or low) in basketball means that the individual programs should be considered major or mid-major.
OUVan
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Posted: 11/19/2014 12:20 PM
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shabamon wrote:expand_more
If we are going to make these arbitrary classifications, I think the term "low-major" should be used more widely.

High-major: Power 5, AAC, and Big East
Mid-major: A-10, MVC, and every other conference that plays FBS football
Low-major: Everyone else
I would put the Horizon and the WCC in with the mids as well. The Colonial would have been but man were they decimated by defections.
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