I'm not 100% sure that looking at who else offered is always the best way to determine the caliber of player a recruit really is. It's obviously one tool to look at. I say this because I've wondered all along why Dartis, who we can all see is pretty darn good as a frosh, as a 3*, should have warranted more than two offers. I asked about this with someone a few weeks back, because he's easily one of the best true freshman guards I've seen come to Athens since 1995, behind a few Groce recruits. It's just odd to me.

I think Doug Taylor is well equipped to become a very, very good big, and I agree with other's who say the same about Block. Gollon, Dozier, Laster all are still TBD.

Everything I've heard/read about Jason Carter on here is extremely positive, so I feel good about that as well.

I agree the Ryan Taylor departure was a big loss. The big issue I've seen thus far for this team is the need for an athletic 2/3 that can get it done as a defender and a slasher to get to the rim. Dartis has shown that he can be that guy sometimes, but he's not big enough to matchup against most 3's.

I agree with the assertion that offers are not always indicative. I am in agreement also with the change in recruiting over the last 20 years. Mids are certainly able to build teams while other P5 schools toy with the one and dones. I think Saul has a plan and a direction with undervalued players that he can coach up a la Bo Ryan. I think most Wisky fans would agree that they do not need to be loaded with 5 stars the way many other larger institutions fanbases insist. Comparing offers is a funny game that many fanbases play. Personally, I always liked sitting at an obscure game with Groce who had been watching a kid and established a relationship way back in 6th or 7th grade. Those kinds of coaches see something most guys can't. Amazing to me how many guys he is in on way early all through his career that later turn out to be McDonalds AA or at least pretty good. I also like players that commit to a school before they blow up....then you ask as the kid is killing in college...why didn't he have many offers? No stars not many offers....Mo Pearson comes to mind. Just got it done early and avoided all the drama of stars and rankings

I miss the "swing for the fences" attitude but understand it is a different approach. I would like to see us competing against some more elite schools rather than a bunch of other MAC schools and low majors but I understand what i perceive to be the approach.

BANG !!

I want to bring up Fran McCaffery at Iowa relating to years 4-6. His first two years there weren't great (although they snuck into the NIT in year two). Then big strides were made in year three as they were on the bubble of the NCAA Tournament and finished runner up in the NIT. In years 4-5 they made the big dance and re-established as a contender in the Big 10.

This is Fran's 6th year at Iowa and they seem to have the team to make a deep run in the tournament. In other words, Fran seems to have "hit his stride."

What this means for us, I don't really know. This was just an example that came to mind of a coach taking more then 1-2 years to rebuild a program. Iowa was in bad shape when Fran took over, similar to Saul here. But they've built their roster similarly to how we are building our team now in overlooked recruits (Aaron White), key transfers (Jared Uthoff), and guys who were raw and needed to be coached up (Olaseni & Jok).

or what's the name of that kid up in Minnesota in the c/o '17 whose old man was a Bobcat back in the day? Larry Kent? Barry Gent? Jerry Print? Something like that. I realize he has better options but would it kill us to make some sort of effort to recruit him?

It's a lot easier to "make a commitment" when you are in one of the most populous counties in the state and surrounded by major companies. Xavier plays in the Cintas Center. Schaus put a for sale sign on naming rights to the Convo more than a year ago, and it's still the Convo.

Personally, I think it's way too early to judge what Saul has done in recruiting. Some of our best players were under-recruited. There's a certain comfort in seeing bigger programs going after the players you are looking at but in the end the only thing that matters is what the players do on the court for your program. And from what I've seen I'm extremely happy with this year's class. Don't know about Ellis Dozier but I think all four of his other recruits this year are difference makers. James Gollon and Robert Taylor might not be huge this year but I think before all is said and done they will be. Do we really think that because Jordan Dartis was only recruited by Kennesaw State that he's not worth our time? I'd much rather have my coach recruit guys he likes and thinks fits his program more than worry about who else is recruiting him. I thought TOS under-recruited at the start of his tenure (Zack Kiekow, Stephen King) and I was worried we might have the same thing all the way until we saw this class on the floor. Worries dismissed.

I can hear Verne Lundquist talking about this during March Madness when Jordy goes off against some high major. Can't wait for it.

And he's working hard to play at all of them.

I dont get this notion that Saul has had three years of recruiting either. Did I read that right in this thread?

The first class, if you can even call it that, was almost a complete wash.

The second class is getting a lot of PT as freshmen with the exception of one, Dozier.

The third class hasn't even stepped onto the Convo floor yet.

And we're judging his recruiting classes? Already? OK...

At this point, I'd agree with the camp on here that a lot of effort recruiting him would be a waste of time and resources. He's a top 25-40 recruit who is going somewhere like Duke, IU, etc. The only way he ends up somewhere lower is something like an injury or personal troubles. Hopefully neither happen to him. I think a couple phone calls by Saul to say "hey, we'd love to have you at Dad's Alma mater" are fine, but that's about it unless there's mutual interest.

I agree. Can't judge yet especially if our judgement criteria is who else recruits our players.

Gbur and OU Country gave us an excellent example in Fran McCaffery at Iowa. He certainly is "hitting his stride." It also might behoove us to remember that when Coach Nee came to Athens the school 65 miles up northwest were having issues with the lack of recruiting panache that was Coach Eldon Miller. It seems many in Columbus never accepted the fact that he came from a MAC school (Western Michigan.) He was literally out-recruiting Eldon with the likes of native Ohio players like the late Robert Tatum and Dave Jamerson and Philadelphia standout like Snoopy Graham and NYC tandout John Deveraux.

Coach Thad Matta may have peaked in Columbus. Hopefully, Coach Phillips can continue to plug into central Ohio talent with more players like Jordan Dartis and perhaps tap into some out of state basketball rich area that he may have some familiarity with in the Midwest. This coupled with an occasional lucky transfer a la Kenny Kaminski and Jarron Simmons and the pipeline may once again be flowing. The improbable runs of Butler and Wichita State should also give us some hope. Mid-majors with players sticking around 4 years can certainly run the table once in a while.

In some ways this reminds me of the 1983 season where the pieces to the puzzle were at times very scrambled. However, on occasion they came together a la the amazing 2 OT home win against the venerable DePaul squad coached by the legendary Ray Meyer. He had been coaching at the school since Second World War. The coup de grace came in the first round of the 1983 NCAA tournament with a miracle shot by Robert Tatum. Who knows what lies ahead for this year's team, However, the pieces are there, all we need is Coach Phillips to stay in Athens for a while and find some recruiting hot spots, a few diamonds in the rough and who knows what could happen in say 2020!