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Topic: TOS to Illinois
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perimeterpost
3/11/2017 11:05 PM
bornacatfan wrote:expand_more
Looks like some in IL have the same sentiments as some of our own going back to posts in 2010 and 2011 as they look at UNC Wilmington for the next coach.

The idea that Keatts is a John Groce hire is just wrong. John Groce took a mediocre Ohio program and kept it mediocre capping it off with a "fluke" hot run to the sweet 16. Keatts took a nothing program and turned it into a great one. Not okay...great. Keatts record is sterling....
how can a Sweet 16 run be a fluke when you make it to the rd of 32 just 2 years earlier?


0-1 in the CIT and 0-1 in the NCAA is all you need to make UNC Wilmington into a GREAT program? that's straight comedy.
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Jerry86
3/11/2017 11:46 PM
perimeterpost wrote:expand_more
Looks like some in IL have the same sentiments as some of our own going back to posts in 2010 and 2011 as they look at UNC Wilmington for the next coach.

The idea that Keatts is a John Groce hire is just wrong. John Groce took a mediocre Ohio program and kept it mediocre capping it off with a "fluke" hot run to the sweet 16. Keatts took a nothing program and turned it into a great one. Not okay...great. Keatts record is sterling....
how can a Sweet 16 run be a fluke when you make it to the rd of 32 just 2 years earlier?


0-1 in the CIT and 0-1 in the NCAA is all you need to make UNC Wilmington into a GREAT program? that's straight comedy.
Yeah that run 2 years earlier wasn't a fluke?

2009–10 Ohio 22–15 7–9 5th (East) NCAA Second Round

Sorry but a 7-9 MAC record doesn't suggest a 2nd round game in NCAA. Rather, it suggests a mediocre team that got hot for a few games.
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allen
3/12/2017 12:13 AM
Jerry86 wrote:expand_more
Looks like some in IL have the same sentiments as some of our own going back to posts in 2010 and 2011 as they look at UNC Wilmington for the next coach.

The idea that Keatts is a John Groce hire is just wrong. John Groce took a mediocre Ohio program and kept it mediocre capping it off with a "fluke" hot run to the sweet 16. Keatts took a nothing program and turned it into a great one. Not okay...great. Keatts record is sterling....
how can a Sweet 16 run be a fluke when you make it to the rd of 32 just 2 years earlier?


0-1 in the CIT and 0-1 in the NCAA is all you need to make UNC Wilmington into a GREAT program? that's straight comedy.
Yeah that run 2 years earlier wasn't a fluke?

2009–10 Ohio 22–15 7–9 5th (East) NCAA Second Round

Sorry but a 7-9 MAC record doesn't suggest a 2nd round game in NCAA. Rather, it suggests a mediocre team that got hot for a few games.

In the name of SP, let's throw stones at JG. It's fight or flight, let's attack JG, he recruited knuckle heads, he was a mediocre coach. Two of his players turned into assistant coaches, 5 or 6 play overseas. They all graduated and one became a criminal. SP SP, he's our man if he can't do it nobody can.
Let's not be this crazy. SP will have his time to shine, let's get some recruits and get after it. Tearing down JG is sick.
Last Edited: 3/12/2017 1:13:38 AM by allen
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bornacatfan
3/12/2017 12:41 AM
allen wrote:expand_more
In the name of SP, let's throw stones at JG. It's fight or flight, let's attack JG, he recruited knuckle heads, he was a mediocre coach. Two of his players turned into assistant coaches, 5 or 6 play overseas. They all graduated and one became a criminal. SP SP, he's our man if he can't do it nobody can.
Huh?
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Donuts
3/12/2017 12:42 AM
perimeterpost wrote:expand_more
how can a Sweet 16 run be a fluke when you make it to the rd of 32 just 2 years earlier?


0-1 in the CIT and 0-1 in the NCAA is all you need to make UNC Wilmington into a GREAT program? that's straight comedy.
We were the freakin' 9 seed and needed OT to take down mighty Ball State in the first round of the MAC tournament in 2010. We pull off that run maybe once out of 20 tries, and that's probably being generous.

Groce never finished higher than 3rd in a 5-team division in the MAC. Illinois fans had plenty of reasons to doubt the hire from the beginning.
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allen
3/12/2017 12:51 AM
Donuts wrote:expand_more
how can a Sweet 16 run be a fluke when you make it to the rd of 32 just 2 years earlier?


0-1 in the CIT and 0-1 in the NCAA is all you need to make UNC Wilmington into a GREAT program? that's straight comedy.
We were the freakin' 9 seed and needed OT to take down mighty Ball State in the first round of the MAC tournament in 2010. We pull off that run maybe once out of 20 tries, and that's probably being generous.

Groce never finished higher than 3rd in a 5-team division in the MAC. Illinois fans had plenty of reasons to doubt the hire from the beginning.
Can't we just create morals versus tearing down JG? Was JG the worst Ohio coach ever? Should we remove from the records that we went to two NCAA's and won three games?
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Morris Mound
3/12/2017 1:00 AM
Wait. The "John Groce was overrated and we're glad he's gone!"meme is a real thing?

Y'all need Jesus.
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allen
3/12/2017 1:01 AM
Morris Mound wrote:expand_more
Wait. The "John Groce was overrated and we're glad he's gone!"meme is a real thing?

Y'all need Jesus.
+1
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perimeterpost
3/12/2017 1:08 AM
Donuts wrote:expand_more
how can a Sweet 16 run be a fluke when you make it to the rd of 32 just 2 years earlier?


0-1 in the CIT and 0-1 in the NCAA is all you need to make UNC Wilmington into a GREAT program? that's straight comedy.
We were the freakin' 9 seed and needed OT to take down mighty Ball State in the first round of the MAC tournament in 2010. We pull off that run maybe once out of 20 tries, and that's probably being generous.

Groce never finished higher than 3rd in a 5-team division in the MAC. Illinois fans had plenty of reasons to doubt the hire from the beginning.
my point is you can't call something a fluke if it happens twice in 3 opportunities. 2010 was unexpected. but 2012 was no "fluke". that's all I'm saying.
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Donuts
3/12/2017 1:12 AM
Morris Mound wrote:expand_more
Wait. The "John Groce was overrated and we're glad he's gone!"meme is a real thing?

Y'all need Jesus.
Don't see anyone saying that at all except for you just now.

Illinois overrated him, but I don't think anyone supporting Ohio wanted Groce to leave in 2012. He rode his hot hand and got a pay day.
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OUcats82
3/12/2017 5:47 PM
Well it's official now:

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/18...

I think he will be hired by someone else if he wants to-most likely a mid major.

Maybe would prefer to work as an assistant for a few years?

He definitely has a lot to offer college basketball.
Last Edited: 3/12/2017 5:50:08 PM by OUcats82
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Jerry86
3/12/2017 7:16 PM
allen wrote:expand_more
Looks like some in IL have the same sentiments as some of our own going back to posts in 2010 and 2011 as they look at UNC Wilmington for the next coach.

The idea that Keatts is a John Groce hire is just wrong. John Groce took a mediocre Ohio program and kept it mediocre capping it off with a "fluke" hot run to the sweet 16. Keatts took a nothing program and turned it into a great one. Not okay...great. Keatts record is sterling....
how can a Sweet 16 run be a fluke when you make it to the rd of 32 just 2 years earlier?


0-1 in the CIT and 0-1 in the NCAA is all you need to make UNC Wilmington into a GREAT program? that's straight comedy.
Yeah that run 2 years earlier wasn't a fluke?

2009–10 Ohio 22–15 7–9 5th (East) NCAA Second Round

Sorry but a 7-9 MAC record doesn't suggest a 2nd round game in NCAA. Rather, it suggests a mediocre team that got hot for a few games.

In the name of SP, let's throw stones at JG. It's fight or flight, let's attack JG, he recruited knuckle heads, he was a mediocre coach. Two of his players turned into assistant coaches, 5 or 6 play overseas. They all graduated and one became a criminal. SP SP, he's our man if he can't do it nobody can.
Let's not be this crazy. SP will have his time to shine, let's get some recruits and get after it. Tearing down JG is sick.
Who is tearing down JG? Get a grip.

I merely pointed out the facts regarding the season 2009-10. We had a once in a blue moon run. 7-9 in MAC play is not very good.
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person
allen
3/12/2017 7:28 PM
Jerry86 wrote:expand_more
Looks like some in IL have the same sentiments as some of our own going back to posts in 2010 and 2011 as they look at UNC Wilmington for the next coach.

The idea that Keatts is a John Groce hire is just wrong. John Groce took a mediocre Ohio program and kept it mediocre capping it off with a "fluke" hot run to the sweet 16. Keatts took a nothing program and turned it into a great one. Not okay...great. Keatts record is sterling....
how can a Sweet 16 run be a fluke when you make it to the rd of 32 just 2 years earlier?


0-1 in the CIT and 0-1 in the NCAA is all you need to make UNC Wilmington into a GREAT program? that's straight comedy.
Yeah that run 2 years earlier wasn't a fluke?

2009–10 Ohio 22–15 7–9 5th (East) NCAA Second Round

Sorry but a 7-9 MAC record doesn't suggest a 2nd round game in NCAA. Rather, it suggests a mediocre team that got hot for a few games.

In the name of SP, let's throw stones at JG. It's fight or flight, let's attack JG, he recruited knuckle heads, he was a mediocre coach. Two of his players turned into assistant coaches, 5 or 6 play overseas. They all graduated and one became a criminal. SP SP, he's our man if he can't do it nobody can.
Let's not be this crazy. SP will have his time to shine, let's get some recruits and get after it. Tearing down JG is sick.
Who is tearing down JG? Get a grip.

I merely pointed out the facts regarding the season 2009-10. We had a once in a blue moon run. 7-9 in MAC play is not very good.

His resume is his resume, we have banners because of him and your SP defense mechanisms can't change that. Your hate Sessions to build SP moral victories can't change that. Let's help Saul get some banners and put down the hatorade
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OU_Country
3/12/2017 7:29 PM
OUcats82 wrote:expand_more
Well it's official now:

http://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/story/_/id/18...

I think he will be hired by someone else if he wants to-most likely a mid major.

Maybe would prefer to work as an assistant for a few years?

He definitely has a lot to offer college basketball.
He has a lot to offer college basketball for sure. It wouldn't be surprising to see Thad hire him back as an assistant. Thad needs help righting the ship, we know that.
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OU_Country
3/12/2017 7:37 PM
allen wrote:expand_more
His resume is his resume, we have banners because of him and your SP defense mechanisms can't change that. Your hate Sessions to build SP moral victories can't change that. Let's help Saul get some banners and put down the hatorade
[/QUOTE]Man, you have an interesting way of seeing the world.



[QUOTE=allen]
Let's stop trying to discount Groce, he recruited Kinney and he was just as good as Bassett. Saul needs to get the right recruits and make some adjustments. What if Ivo never went AWOL. What if Walt hits the free throw? The would've, could've and should've is not relevant. Groce won three tournament games. he won one at Illinois. He had a young team that was up and down this year and he got canned. His resume is his resume.
Jay Kinney was just as good as Armon Bassett at Ohio? Ok, sure.
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allen
3/12/2017 8:11 PM
OU_Country wrote:expand_more
His resume is his resume, we have banners because of him and your SP defense mechanisms can't change that. Your hate Sessions to build SP moral victories can't change that. Let's help Saul get some banners and put down the hatorade
Man, you have an interesting way of seeing the world.



Let's stop trying to discount Groce, he recruited Kinney and he was just as good as Bassett. Saul needs to get the right recruits and make some adjustments. What if Ivo never went AWOL. What if Walt hits the free throw? The would've, could've and should've is not relevant. Groce won three tournament games. he won one at Illinois. He had a young team that was up and down this year and he got canned. His resume is his resume.
Jay Kinney was just as good as Armon Bassett at Ohio? Ok, sure.

Jay Kinney was only a freshman, by his senior year, he was in the running for conference player of the year. Brother or sister put down the hatorade and take off your mediocre lenses and start believing that we can win.
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Jerry86
3/12/2017 8:34 PM
allen wrote:expand_more
His resume is his resume, we have banners because of him and your SP defense mechanisms can't change that. Your hate Sessions to build SP moral victories can't change that. Let's help Saul get some banners and put down the hatorade
Man, you have an interesting way of seeing the world.



Let's stop trying to discount Groce, he recruited Kinney and he was just as good as Bassett. Saul needs to get the right recruits and make some adjustments. What if Ivo never went AWOL. What if Walt hits the free throw? The would've, could've and should've is not relevant. Groce won three tournament games. he won one at Illinois. He had a young team that was up and down this year and he got canned. His resume is his resume.
Jay Kinney was just as good as Armon Bassett at Ohio? Ok, sure.

Jay Kinney was only a freshman, by his senior year, he was in the running for conference player of the year. Brother or sister put down the hatorade and take off your mediocre lenses and start believing that we can win.
Kinney had issues throughout his college days starting in Athens:

https://bobcatbasketball.wordpress.com/2010/02/04/breakin... /

Not sure he had any chance of conference player of the year at SJSU given his two suspensions there and only playing in 14 games.

http://www.mercurynews.com/2013/02/08/san-jose-state-top-... /

I guess you'll dispute these facts as you did of the Ohio 2009-10 team.
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OU_Country
3/12/2017 8:37 PM
allen wrote:expand_more
His resume is his resume, we have banners because of him and your SP defense mechanisms can't change that. Your hate Sessions to build SP moral victories can't change that. Let's help Saul get some banners and put down the hatorade
Man, you have an interesting way of seeing the world.



Let's stop trying to discount Groce, he recruited Kinney and he was just as good as Bassett. Saul needs to get the right recruits and make some adjustments. What if Ivo never went AWOL. What if Walt hits the free throw? The would've, could've and should've is not relevant. Groce won three tournament games. he won one at Illinois. He had a young team that was up and down this year and he got canned. His resume is his resume.
Jay Kinney was just as good as Armon Bassett at Ohio? Ok, sure.

Jay Kinney was only a freshman, by his senior year, he was in the running for conference player of the year. Brother or sister put down the hatorade and take off your mediocre lenses and start believing that we can win.
The hatorade...oh boy aren't you cool? That's code for the Meigs County gold you've clearly been enjoying too much of today.

I believe very much we can win. I think with a full year of Tony, we'd have seen OUr name drawn on CBS this evening. I loved John Groce and everything he did here as much as anyone. I'm just not holding on to it five years later. Also, at some point, I remember that Ohio Basketball is my fun, my entertainment. I'm not wasting my time getting angry at Saul for his recruiting at this point.

This Jay Kinney - the one that was suspended twice his senior season, including for the season in February last year? He was as good as the guy that was the MAC Tournament MVP in 2010?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Kinney_(basketball )
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allen
3/12/2017 8:53 PM
I won't argue Jay Kinney, with Tone we lost to 5 or 6 teams with a 150+RPI, so it is you that is on the koolaid. We would have had to win our tourney, maybe we would have won with Tone, maybe not. I am in it with SP, let's go Cats, I believe he and we can win some titles, hence you see me combatting mediocrity. Jay Kinney proved he could score, had he stayed and been responsible he could have been much better than Bassett.
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allen
3/12/2017 8:57 PM
Jay Kinney averaged 20 points per game and his team lost every game after his suspension. He has played two full seasons overseas, Bassett played a month or two.
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rpbobcat
3/13/2017 6:57 AM
There's been a lot of talk here on Groce.
It seems Matta at OSU should be feeling some heat too.
Any word on how secure his job is ?
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OUcats82
3/13/2017 7:13 AM
rpbobcat wrote:expand_more
There's been a lot of talk here on Groce.
It seems Matta at OSU should be feeling some heat too.
Any word on how secure his job is ?
Looks like he will be back for next year at a minimum…

http://www.daytondailynews.com/sports/college-basketball/... /
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Bobcat Debate 73
3/13/2017 1:02 PM
John Groce leaves Illinois with a number 12 rated recruiting class coming, if they do not decommit. Impatience in the alumni ranks of major college programs and the pressure they put to bear on athletic directors is hard to underestimate. Patience would have paid off long term at Illinois. Who knows what will happen with the next coach. If I was an athletic director of a major program needing a new coach, I would give serious consideration to Groce and also hope he could get a few decommits from the Illinois 2017 class to join him. Groce is an excellent coach, recruiter, and motivator. I love Saul Phillips as well, and our patience is paying off now and will continue to do so in the future.
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OU_Country
3/13/2017 1:03 PM
OUcats82 wrote:expand_more
There's been a lot of talk here on Groce.
It seems Matta at OSU should be feeling some heat too.
Any word on how secure his job is ?
Looks like he will be back for next year at a minimum…

http://www.daytondailynews.com/sports/college-basketball/... /
A couple buddies and I were talking about this yesterday afternoon while watching the B1G final. The more we talked and discussed it, the more we couldn't figured out how he's still there. The trend has been in the wrong direction for 2-3 years. They've struggled to get good players to become better. Their incoming freshmen, at this point, don't give the impression of being game changers for the program. It looks So the major improvement needed would seem like it has to come from within unless they're able to get a late signee or grad transfer. It's fascinating to me, because I'm of the opinion that, if this were football, Urban would have been fired last year because that's the way it seems to work in Columbus.
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allen
3/13/2017 2:05 PM
OU_Country wrote:expand_more
There's been a lot of talk here on Groce.
It seems Matta at OSU should be feeling some heat too.
Any word on how secure his job is ?
Looks like he will be back for next year at a minimum…

http://www.daytondailynews.com/sports/college-basketball/... /
A couple buddies and I were talking about this yesterday afternoon while watching the B1G final. The more we talked and discussed it, the more we couldn't figured out how he's still there. The trend has been in the wrong direction for 2-3 years. They've struggled to get good players to become better. Their incoming freshmen, at this point, don't give the impression of being game changers for the program. It looks So the major improvement needed would seem like it has to come from within unless they're able to get a late signee or grad transfer. It's fascinating to me, because I'm of the opinion that, if this were football, Urban would have been fired last year because that's the way it seems to work in Columbus.
Last Edited: 3/13/2017 3:01:00 PM by allen
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