Ohio Basketball Topic
Topic: Official Game 20 Thread: Buffalo
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FearLeon
1/26/2018 10:45 AM
Bobcat1998 wrote:expand_more
That last, awful season with Bean and Mo we managed to beat a few teams at home we had no business beating. We have no business beating Buffalo, but the game is here and we are due for an "all cylinders clicking" type game.
Speaking of that game....

http://www.espn.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/i...

https://youtu.be/ux9mARjahMs
Wow did that team underachieve (OUr team). You've got a future pro in Mo, you have a current pro (G-League) in Tone. You've got a fiery point guard in Stevie and a dagger shooting 2 guard in Bean. You've got your hype man in Treg and a future 20 ppg scorer in Ryan Taylor. Toss in Laster's energy and that group should have been better. But we all know about the attitudes on the team. Mo never dominated consistently. And we were thin with schollies going to Wads, Khari, Chandler Thomas and two transfers sitting out (Kenny and Jaaron). We still should have been better.
Stevie should never have been a 28-35 minute point guard. He was a nice "10-15" minute guy off the bench. Coaches overvalued his ability.
Last Edited: 1/26/2018 10:46:35 AM by FearLeon
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GoCats105
1/26/2018 11:35 AM
FearLeon wrote:expand_more
That last, awful season with Bean and Mo we managed to beat a few teams at home we had no business beating. We have no business beating Buffalo, but the game is here and we are due for an "all cylinders clicking" type game.
Speaking of that game....

http://www.espn.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/i...

https://youtu.be/ux9mARjahMs
Wow did that team underachieve (OUr team). You've got a future pro in Mo, you have a current pro (G-League) in Tone. You've got a fiery point guard in Stevie and a dagger shooting 2 guard in Bean. You've got your hype man in Treg and a future 20 ppg scorer in Ryan Taylor. Toss in Laster's energy and that group should have been better. But we all know about the attitudes on the team. Mo never dominated consistently. And we were thin with schollies going to Wads, Khari, Chandler Thomas and two transfers sitting out (Kenny and Jaaron). We still should have been better.
Stevie should never have been a 28-35 minute point guard. He was a nice "10-15" minute guy off the bench. Coaches overvalued his ability.
Just never got a chance to be in the correct system to adapt to his abilities. Three coaches in 4 years.

Bean was not a 2 guard. He had a 2 guard mentality in a PG body. Usually doesn't bode well and it didn't.
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bshot44
1/26/2018 12:01 PM
OU_Country wrote:expand_more
That last, awful season with Bean and Mo we managed to beat a few teams at home we had no business beating. We have no business beating Buffalo, but the game is here and we are due for an "all cylinders clicking" type game.
Speaking of that game....

http://www.espn.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/i...

https://youtu.be/ux9mARjahMs
I'd love to see that environment in the Convo. That feels like it was a million years ago ... and that team won 11 games. Look at the crowd.

It will be a morgue in there tonight. Zero buzz. And that sucks.

I'd kill for a 630p Friday game as a student ... that's literally a perfect time. Pre-game dinner/drink ... go to game ... and then uptown to "celebrate"

They'll be lucky to have 4500 in there tonight is my guess.

Woof.
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shabamon
1/26/2018 3:14 PM
bshot44 wrote:expand_more
That last, awful season with Bean and Mo we managed to beat a few teams at home we had no business beating. We have no business beating Buffalo, but the game is here and we are due for an "all cylinders clicking" type game.
Speaking of that game....

http://www.espn.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/i...

https://youtu.be/ux9mARjahMs
I'd love to see that environment in the Convo. That feels like it was a million years ago ... and that team won 11 games. Look at the crowd.

It will be a morgue in there tonight. Zero buzz. And that sucks.

I'd kill for a 630p Friday game as a student ... that's literally a perfect time. Pre-game dinner/drink ... go to game ... and then uptown to "celebrate"

They'll be lucky to have 4500 in there tonight is my guess.

Woof.
And that atmosphere was nothing compared to mid-2000s.
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bshot44
1/26/2018 3:18 PM
shabamon wrote:expand_more
That last, awful season with Bean and Mo we managed to beat a few teams at home we had no business beating. We have no business beating Buffalo, but the game is here and we are due for an "all cylinders clicking" type game.
Speaking of that game....

http://www.espn.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/i...

https://youtu.be/ux9mARjahMs
I'd love to see that environment in the Convo. That feels like it was a million years ago ... and that team won 11 games. Look at the crowd.

It will be a morgue in there tonight. Zero buzz. And that sucks.

I'd kill for a 630p Friday game as a student ... that's literally a perfect time. Pre-game dinner/drink ... go to game ... and then uptown to "celebrate"

They'll be lucky to have 4500 in there tonight is my guess.

Woof.
And that atmosphere was nothing compared to mid-2000s.
No kidding! Or even the late 90's (Trent/Geno era). Convo Magic is certainly a thing of the past. Sad, really.
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GoCats105
1/26/2018 6:02 PM
I'm sick of Buffalo damnit. Let's go get this W, boys. Bust ass, hit shots, play tough D.

Yes I'm at happy hour.
Last Edited: 1/26/2018 6:02:31 PM by GoCats105
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MonroeClassmate
1/26/2018 6:45 PM
Shiver me timber...Bull going through the lane and Doug Taylor steps back away from his man and the Bull got picked and then had to pick himself off the floor! I loved it--looked like he was dazed while laying there and Taylor probably didn't feel a think.

Go Bobcats
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GoCats105
1/26/2018 8:06 PM
Our defense is tenacious tonight. Definitely have the Bulls off balanced. Offense needs to pick it up.
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OU_Country
1/26/2018 8:29 PM
Bobcats give UB the best game they've been given all conference season, by far.
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GoCats105
1/26/2018 8:32 PM
Love the effort tonight. Love it.

Missed bunnies and FTs haunt us again. Just...ugh.
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GraffZ06
1/26/2018 8:42 PM
I saw energy tonight. I saw effort. This team doesn't/hasn't quit.

What I didn't see much of was athleticism or talent.

We're just not a very good basketball team. It is what it is.
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Alan Swank
1/26/2018 9:18 PM
As old coach once said, the guys got after it tonight. A missed dunk and two missed free throws down the stretch - might have been a different outcome. Got to get a win at BG.
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cathead
1/26/2018 9:20 PM
GraffZ06 wrote:expand_more
I saw energy tonight. I saw effort. This team doesn't/hasn't quit.

What I didn't see much of was athleticism or talent.

We're just not a very good basketball team. It is what it is.
We competed .... enjoyed being in the Convo tonight -TK is very fun to watch, thrilled to have him in a Bobcat uniform. Nice crowd - ROTC impressive ! Season ticket holder for the past 35 years and not going to whine and complain. I’ve seen the best teams and I can handle the tough times. My Team...
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Bobcat1998
1/26/2018 9:42 PM
GraffZ06 wrote:expand_more
I saw energy tonight. I saw effort. This team doesn't/hasn't quit.

What I didn't see much of was athleticism or talent.

We're just not a very good basketball team. It is what it is.
I agree with this assessment. I know we're hurt. I think Kirk and Butler are the only two guys not nursing injuries right now. I just saw a team with fight tonight. I see us winning five games in the league this year with a first round win and maybe a second round win before losing to a Buffalo or a Western Michigan in Cleveland.

If all goes as planned with guys staying and NO injuries I like the Kirk/Butler combo mixed with Dartis, Block, DT, Gollon, Carter, Gareri and Vander Plas. Then you hopefully get at least one new guy of the trio to step up.

Does anyone else watch these games and when it's boring think about how it would be going with Carter in? I don't think about Jaaron because we wouldn't have Kirk if he stayed. I like Kirk for four years!
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OU SLAM
1/26/2018 9:50 PM
GoCats105 wrote:expand_more
Love the effort tonight. Love it.

Missed bunnies and FTs haunt us again. Just...ugh.

Agree. Good effort. Way to hang in the game and play tough.
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Bobcat1998
1/26/2018 9:56 PM
FearLeon wrote:expand_more
That last, awful season with Bean and Mo we managed to beat a few teams at home we had no business beating. We have no business beating Buffalo, but the game is here and we are due for an "all cylinders clicking" type game.
Speaking of that game....

http://www.espn.com/blog/collegebasketballnation/post/_/i...

https://youtu.be/ux9mARjahMs
Wow did that team underachieve (OUr team). You've got a future pro in Mo, you have a current pro (G-League) in Tone. You've got a fiery point guard in Stevie and a dagger shooting 2 guard in Bean. You've got your hype man in Treg and a future 20 ppg scorer in Ryan Taylor. Toss in Laster's energy and that group should have been better. But we all know about the attitudes on the team. Mo never dominated consistently. And we were thin with schollies going to Wads, Khari, Chandler Thomas and two transfers sitting out (Kenny and Jaaron). We still should have been better.
Stevie should never have been a 28-35 minute point guard. He was a nice "10-15" minute guy off the bench. Coaches overvalued his ability.
It must be a "Taylor" thing because I feel like Doug would be an outstanding 15-18 minute guy off the bench but instead he's pressed into playing big minutes with injuries.
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OhioCatFan
1/26/2018 10:17 PM
Bobcat1998 wrote:expand_more
I saw energy tonight. I saw effort. This team doesn't/hasn't quit.[/quote]

Agree totally!

[quote=Bobcat1998]Does anyone else watch these games and when it's boring think about how it would be going with Carter in? I don't think about Jaaron because we wouldn't have Kirk if he stayed. I like Kirk for four years!
Yes, I do that. In fact, at halftime I had a conversation with a guy in the Rohr room over this very matter. He agreed that Carter would change the whole dynamics of this team. Then he made the following comment, "If one guy is that indispensable to a team, you don't have much of a team." I'm not sure I agree with that, but that was his response.
Last Edited: 1/26/2018 10:17:54 PM by OhioCatFan
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OU_Country
1/26/2018 10:34 PM
I can see that point of view, but at the end of the day, most college basketball programs are that way. Most have 1-2 players, who, if you take them away, are THAT missed. It's simply the way it is. Take Bates Diop from OSU, and they're not as good. Take Bluitt from Xavier and they're definitely less of a team. Carter is that guy for Ohio.
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bobcatsquared
1/26/2018 10:35 PM
The more I watch this team the more I think Kirk needs to be as close to a 40-minute man as possible. And that doesn't have to mean fewer minutes for Butler.

DT with 9 rebounds (the good). But I would love to see him be stronger with the ball once he grabs it (the bad). How many times a game does he allow the ball be stripped away after a rebound?

I think it was back in November when I stated Nick Perkins is the best big man in the MAC (you can look it up). Don't think he did anything tonight to disprove that. He's a beast around the basket and even hit a 3 late tonight.

UB is as talented and deep a team the MAC has seen in many years.

Marching 110 playing "Long Train Runnin' " only improves the much-discussed Convo atmosphere. Nothing better than hearing this song late in a close game v. Miami or Akron in front of a 10,000-plus crowd of yesteryear.

I disagreed with Saul having his team intentionally getting UB into the bonus at the end of the game. A two-possession game with about 90 seconds left - play good D and hope to for two quick scores. And, if memory serves me, Ohio played good D deep into the shot clock before the first of 3 quick fouls sent UB to the line.

Thought Ohio fought hard for 40 minutes but was out-classed, out-sized, out-lengthed, & out-athleticismed by UB. Might have just made up a new word or two.
Last Edited: 1/26/2018 10:37:35 PM by bobcatsquared
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RSBobcat
1/26/2018 11:20 PM
bobcatsquared wrote:expand_more
The more I watch this team the more I think Kirk needs to be as close to a 40-minute man as possible. And that doesn't have to mean fewer minutes for Butler.

DT with 9 rebounds (the good). But I would love to see him be stronger with the ball once he grabs it (the bad). How many times a game does he allow the ball be stripped away after a rebound?

I think it was back in November when I stated Nick Perkins is the best big man in the MAC (you can look it up). Don't think he did anything tonight to disprove that. He's a beast around the basket and even hit a 3 late tonight.

UB is as talented and deep a team the MAC has seen in many years.

Marching 110 playing "Long Train Runnin' " only improves the much-discussed Convo atmosphere. Nothing better than hearing this song late in a close game v. Miami or Akron in front of a 10,000-plus crowd of yesteryear.

I disagreed with Saul having his team intentionally getting UB into the bonus at the end of the game. A two-possession game with about 90 seconds left - play good D and hope to for two quick scores. And, if memory serves me, Ohio played good D deep into the shot clock before the first of 3 quick fouls sent UB to the line.

Thought Ohio fought hard for 40 minutes but was out-classed, out-sized, out-lengthed, & out-athleticismed by UB. Might have just made up a new word or two.
Most every point I would call out for tonight. Doug - Grab that ball! Long Train - Play it though when can start it at start of a break - so can get thru more than 1 min of it..... I don't think UB Out Hustled us - They sure have a lot of talent, and the talent mix is good.
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Andrew Ruck
1/26/2018 11:35 PM
That was a frustrating game in a frustrating season. Just like Akron, get an exciting spurt and be ready to tie it up or take the lead, then just can't get over the hump. Not so fun fact - We have not had a lead in the last 80 minutes of basketball. And yet both were close games. Cyncics will say we fail to execute/coach in crucial moments, and that may be true but it just seems like our opponents have hit some tough/impressive shots in these turning point moments. There were several of those tonight.

Buffalo allowed us to stick around by not shooting well from 3, though I think a good part of that was defending them on the perimeter well.

Buffalo had a lot more touch and toughness around the rim tonight. They grabbed boards with authority and hit those soft jumpers. We missed tons of jumpers that we probably should have hit. Game in the paint was ugly, excluding dribble drives to the hoop.

Giving up offensive rebounds to them when we had the position was the key. At least 3-4 possessions should have ended and instead they got it back and ended up with 2 or 3.

I really like a lot of things about Doug but he can be really frustrating. The point about strong hands when grabbing a rebound is so true. And he needs to be stronger and quicker when going back up, maybe he just doesn't have the necessary athleticism. It's like someone needs to piss him off and make him play angrier and hungrier.

I really like TK and I think he will improve a lot in the next couple years. I love his fearless ability to drive to the hoop, though sometimes it is a little Brett Favre like where there is no caution or plan to it, which can lead to some tremendous plays but also some ugly ones. These don't necessarily end up as turnovers but can be bad shots or unproductive passes. This will improve with time, I expect him to be making some better passes down the road. But he could be special.

The "decision" to foul 3 straight times with about 1:20 left in the game was odd, and I think TK misunderstood what coach wanted to do. I think he wanted to get them to 6, so that they could force FTs when they were ready to, but don't think he wanted to yet, especially since the shot clock was at something like 10 at that point.

A few dazzling efforts aside, Dartis & Laster have struggled in MAC play as the veteran leaders. They need to catch fire and lead the offense if we have any shot at making a run at a respectable finish.

Jason Carter is EXACTLY what this team is missing in every way. We have a PG who can drive to the hoop, a spot up sharp shooter in Dartis, a mid-range jumper in Laster, an energy role player type guy in Block, a supplemental big in Mickle...But no one who plays big but is versatile, who positions as well as anyone in the league on either end of the court, who has a great inside out game, who grabs every ball in the air anywhere near him. His absence hurts all the other roles I mentioned. I legitimately think we are 6-2 with a healthy Jason Carter.

Carter & Kirk together for 3 years sounds amazing and that alone should make you a contender. Here's to their health and commitment to the program!
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Alan Swank
1/27/2018 9:01 AM
bobcatsquared wrote:expand_more
Marching 110 playing "Long Train Runnin' " only improves the much-discussed Convo atmosphere. Nothing better than hearing this song late in a close game v. Miami or Akron in front of a 10,000-plus crowd of yesteryear.

I disagreed with Saul having his team intentionally getting UB into the bonus at the end of the game. A two-possession game with about 90 seconds left - play good D and hope to for two quick scores. And, if memory serves me, Ohio played good D deep into the shot clock before the first of 3 quick fouls sent UB to the line.
I'm a Long Train guy too but it needs to be played at the right time immediately as the break starts (preferably a time out called by the other team when we are on a run) and in its entirety. It loses something when it's played in the short form after a mindless promotion.

As for the fouls, the first two Saul wanted but the third one was a mistake on Kirk's part. Saul couldn't believe the kid called it as evidenced by his demeanor after the foul. D had been good to that point that the 7th foul wasn't needed.

Even with the small crowd, the energy in the Convo was the best it's been all season.
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Bobcat1998
1/27/2018 9:01 AM
Andrew Ruck wrote:expand_more
That was a frustrating game in a frustrating season. Just like Akron, get an exciting spurt and be ready to tie it up or take the lead, then just can't get over the hump. Not so fun fact - We have not had a lead in the last 80 minutes of basketball. And yet both were close games. Cyncics will say we fail to execute/coach in crucial moments, and that may be true but it just seems like our opponents have hit some tough/impressive shots in these turning point moments. There were several of those tonight.

Buffalo allowed us to stick around by not shooting well from 3, though I think a good part of that was defending them on the perimeter well.

Buffalo had a lot more touch and toughness around the rim tonight. They grabbed boards with authority and hit those soft jumpers. We missed tons of jumpers that we probably should have hit. Game in the paint was ugly, excluding dribble drives to the hoop.

Giving up offensive rebounds to them when we had the position was the key. At least 3-4 possessions should have ended and instead they got it back and ended up with 2 or 3.

I really like a lot of things about Doug but he can be really frustrating. The point about strong hands when grabbing a rebound is so true. And he needs to be stronger and quicker when going back up, maybe he just doesn't have the necessary athleticism. It's like someone needs to piss him off and make him play angrier and hungrier.

I really like TK and I think he will improve a lot in the next couple years. I love his fearless ability to drive to the hoop, though sometimes it is a little Brett Favre like where there is no caution or plan to it, which can lead to some tremendous plays but also some ugly ones. These don't necessarily end up as turnovers but can be bad shots or unproductive passes. This will improve with time, I expect him to be making some better passes down the road. But he could be special.

The "decision" to foul 3 straight times with about 1:20 left in the game was odd, and I think TK misunderstood what coach wanted to do. I think he wanted to get them to 6, so that they could force FTs when they were ready to, but don't think he wanted to yet, especially since the shot clock was at something like 10 at that point.

A few dazzling efforts aside, Dartis & Laster have struggled in MAC play as the veteran leaders. They need to catch fire and lead the offense if we have any shot at making a run at a respectable finish.

Jason Carter is EXACTLY what this team is missing in every way. We have a PG who can drive to the hoop, a spot up sharp shooter in Dartis, a mid-range jumper in Laster, an energy role player type guy in Block, a supplemental big in Mickle...But no one who plays big but is versatile, who positions as well as anyone in the league on either end of the court, who has a great inside out game, who grabs every ball in the air anywhere near him. His absence hurts all the other roles I mentioned. I legitimately think we are 6-2 with a healthy Jason Carter.

Carter & Kirk together for 3 years sounds amazing and that alone should make you a contender. Here's to their health and commitment to the program!
I guess that last comment is the silver lining to the redshirt of Carter and even Ben Vander Plas. We will have 3 years of Carter and Kirk together. I have only seen high school highlights of BVP and have read thoughts from people who have seen him and they say he's the real deal as well in terms of a swing man. But three years of Kirk/Carter is going to be special (as long as Carter doesn't leave as a grad. I can completely see Holtmann stealing him from us. Great recruiter with something special going on in C-Bus)!
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FearLeon
1/27/2018 11:24 AM
Two consecutive games of MAC Basketball and Ohio has not led any portion of those games for 1 second. We've gone 80 minutes without having the lead. Think about it...that's hard to do. Boys fought hard, but Buffalo was sloppy. Can't win when Dartis and Block don't do anything offensively...just never gonna happen. Many on here seem content losing to Buffalo by 7 at.......HOME. I just don't get it. My how things have changed in the last 6 years with this program and expectations.
Last Edited: 1/27/2018 11:32:34 AM by FearLeon
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FearLeon
1/27/2018 11:41 AM
Andrew Ruck wrote:expand_more
I really like a lot of things about Doug but he can be really frustrating. The point about strong hands when grabbing a rebound is so true. And he needs to be stronger and quicker when going back up, maybe he just doesn't have the necessary athleticism. It's like someone needs to piss him off and make him play angrier and hungrier.
Careful...not allowed to criticize players on this board...especially DT.
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