Would you deem Saul's tenure a failure then?
Easy answer. Yes.
Well, in that case, coaches are definitely going to be banging down the door to get this job. A full rebuild AND a delusional fanbase with crazy expectations? Great combination.
If it's delusional to expect a winning conference record given what the school puts into the program, could you tell us what rational expectations look like? Not losing every game by 20?
Sorry, but you missed the point.
I laid out a hypothetical scenario where Saul had OU in three MAC Championship games in and narrowly lost in all three. Buck said he'd fire him regardless.
Or actually, probably more accurately, Buck came into a thread, didn't read it closely, and couldn't resist chiming in about his thoughts on firing Saul because literally nobody here seems capable of following a conversation or responding rationally when it comes to this particular subject.
There's a conversation taking place about what expectations are reasonable going forward. Nobody is arguing in favor of retaining Saul, nor is anybody arguing that the results to date are acceptable.
It is easy to discern your thought and intentions, that is why you come up with crazy hypotheticals and moral victories. It is is also why you called people with reasonable expectations delusional. We all hope that Saul can pull a rabbit out of his hat. Don’t be ashamed to be a Saul advocate, it is nothing wrong with that, but is wrong to lie about how you feel on a message board. Be strong and of a good courage and tell us really how you feel and we can have a debate or a meeting of the minds.
Okay, dude. Whatever you say. You know you can tell you're definitely doing a really good job in an argument? When you have to completely disregard what the other person is actually saying and pretend they're saying the exact opposite for your reaction to make any sense.
Also: bonus points for accusing me of making up hypotheticals because I need a moral victory in the very same post where you've decided I'm saying the opposite of what I actually mean in order to convince yourself that you're winning this argument.
I believe that's called "projecting."
But I guess when I say things like this:
I agree completely that Saul didn't put the talent on the floor. Don't dispute that at all.
My take is basically that the late rounds of the MAC tournament and early rounds of the NCAA tournament should be thought of similarly to how the Moneyball crew thought of playoff baseball. Essentially, the sample-size is too small to really count on anything, and the best you can do is build a team that gets you to that point in the season and gives you the opportunity for the chips to fall in your favor.
And I think that's the basic point most folks are making about Groce. We won some really exciting games and went on some great runs, but did so with some uneven if very talented teams. That we went to the Sweet 16 shouldn't alter how we benchmark success for our basketball program. We want a coach who recruits talented players and gives the program the opportunity to win games that matter, but I'm not convinced that it's the right expectation that we insist on an NCAA tournament appearance every few years. There's just too much variability and luck that goes into that.
And when I lay out the list of coaches I think we should target, or when I say things like "It's obvious we need to move on, I just think we should try and do so with some class". . .
I'm just being a Saul fanboy who is lying about my personal feelings because, I dunno, you all need somebody to argue with on a subject in which there's actual universal agreement? I mean sure, Saul obviously didn't do the things that I set as my standard for what the OU basketball coach should accomplish, and I've said I think he should be fired a dozen times, but don't let that stop you from pretending I feel the complete opposite of what I've been saying.
I find it super weird how desperate you are to find somebody who wants to keep Saul around. I mean, I've said the exact opposite a bunch, so I guess the best option is just to assume I'm lying and rally the mob to attack points I'm not making?
I get it though man, you're angry about the basketball team and you lack the emotional intelligence to handle that anger rationally, and want somewhere to focus it.
If it helps to focus that anger on me, you're welcome to do so. Here, maybe this will help:
I think Saul Phillips is a better coach than John Groce and I prefer losing records to going to the Sweet 16. Ohio University basketball has never been in better shape and I'm perplexed as to why anybody wants to fire Saul.
Last Edited: 2/13/2019 10:39:39 AM by Bobcat Love's Sense of Shame